[Politics] General Election 2024 - 4th July

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Channel 4 news last night had a vox pop from Rugby. One gent in his sixties sporting an Italian track suit top told them he supported "Faridge" as it was important we stuck to being English (I paraphrase). These are strange times.

These sorts have always been here, but they never used to get 10 seconds of glory on national radio. Once parodied in the Private Eye column 'a taxi driver writes'.

I suspect that by the same token (of glorious stupidity), millions of German 'socialists' voted for Hitler because they though that National Socialism sounded even more socialist than ordinary socialism.

(Incidentally, can you imagine the state of their fridge?)

 

[Weststander]

I did. Mishal Husain was chairing who I have a soft spot for. I'd say that she erred on the side of non-intervention but it wasn't as stark as with Etchingham last night who I've no time for after the Sunak-Starmer head-to-head, and did nothing to salvage things. Beth Rigby has won clearly so far, but very much aided by the format (the worst of which was the head-to-head by some considerable distance).

20 years ago I remember the young Mishal presenting late night BBC24 News with Paddy O’Connell live from Wall Street.

 

[Weststander]

Shy Tories? Yes, I expect so. Consider NSC. There used to be a gaggle of Brexit gloaters on here and most of them have now disappeared, But they will all be trotting out on July 4 to put their X by the Tory name on the ballot. For sure.

Many were later banned, including the night of the long lives where Baker…. and someone else disappeared.

 

[Weststander]

I thought just about everyone bar Mordaunt came across well. She had an opportunity to really spear Rayner with one question and absolutely blew it. Asking Rayner to deny that labour would raise Capital Gains Tax, which Mordaunt said would hit hard working families when they sold their houses. It was just lame.

She also visibly gulped when the government's schools record was attacked, specifically on their failure to address crumbling school buildings. Defending this governments record is tough, but Mel Stride for one has looked a lot more competent and capable than Pompey Penny.

I thought Rayner lacked her pre election fight, the same on the other debate. Looked nervous, almost shocked at the multiple attacks from Flynn, PC, Greens and LibDems. As the party elect, they’re all going for the jugular, to win marginals.

Difficult task for her. To avoid any gaffs or statements that will be held against Labour in the next 5 years if they do the opposite.

 

[ROSM]

I didn't have an issue with Cameron. I liked Major. Thatcher had sat at Keith Josepth's feet too long and I think she had become naive to the problems of working class folk. The North will never forgive her.

Agreed, Joseph had plotted revenge against the miners and Thatcher was in his thrall

 

[deletebeepbeepbeep]

I thought Rayner lacked her pre election fight, the same on the other debate. Looked nervous, almost shocked at the multiple attacks from Flynn, PC, Greens and LibDems. As the party elect, they’re all going for the jugular, to win marginals.

Difficult task for her. To avoid any gaffs or statements that will be held against Labour in the next 5 years if they do the opposite.

Flynn speaks well, is obviously a principled person and makes a positive case for rejoining the SM. If only Labour had a leader like that, rather than the wet lettuce they do have. Starmer and his weak soporific politics is going to lead us to a right wing super majority led by Farage/Braverman in 5 years time. I will put a bet on it.

 

[rippleman]

Have any of the opposition parties given a clear statement of intent to go after the scammers (ie pals of the Tory party) who sucked hundreds of millions from the economy over PPE contracts? Is there any will, anywhere, to investigate the "fast lane" contracts that were dished out to pals / supporters of Boris and his ilk?

The party who goes after these shiesters, prosecutes them and recovers the money they stole from this country is likely to get my vote.

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

Have any of the opposition parties given a clear statement of intent to go after the scammers (ie pals of the Tory party) who sucked hundreds of millions from the economy over PPE contracts? Is there any will, anywhere, to investigate the "fast lane" contracts that were dished out to pals / supporters of Boris and his ilk?

The party who goes after these shiesters, prosecutes them and recovers the money they stole from this country is likely to get my vote.

And the Companies that took the furlough payments from the Govt and then made their staff work throughout........

 

[ROSM]

Have any of the opposition parties given a clear statement of intent to go after the scammers (ie pals of the Tory party) who sucked hundreds of millions from the economy over PPE contracts? Is there any will, anywhere, to investigate the "fast lane" contracts that were dished out to pals / supporters of Boris and his ilk?

The party who goes after these shiesters, prosecutes them and recovers the money they stole from this country is likely to get my vote.

Yes, it's in the labour manifesto from yesterday

 

[Weststander]

Flynn speaks well, is obviously a principled person and makes a positive case for rejoining the SM. If only Labour had a leader like that, rather than the wet lettuce they do have. Starmer and his weak soporific politics is going to lead us to a right wing super majority led by Farage/Braverman in 5 years time. I will put a bet on it.

Sturgeon’s also a clever operator and rabble rousing orator. But the SNP have failed across key areas, and also another corrupt snide by deleting all pandemic messages on government phones.

I’ve not given up at all. Not in no 10 yet.

Genuinely, some stealth taxes and we might see targeted spending towards key areas.

Two concerns:
- I fear KS will be a weak commander. Unlike the NHS, not in his DNA. (Kinda agreeing with you).
- Zero interest in enhancing EU relations. The panel’s show of hands was shocking. I think PC and LibDems voted no, WTF.

 

[Audax]

Even Labour now falling too.

Being dragged down by a pair of recent YouGov polls. As mentioned in another post, they've changed their methodology and it's only since then we've seen the Labour numbers drop. Is that a genuine drop, or are they actually still steady and we're just seeing either a dodgy change by YouGov or a reality that already existed prior but has only now become visible? Think the answer to that is below (there's no real drop).

But I don't know what their methodology change was all about.

There's a detailed explanation here: https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/49614-using-mrp-for-our-voting-intention-polling

But what it boils down to is that the new method better resolves potential tactical voting ... which reduces Labour share and increases Lib Dem share. So IMO the dip in Labour share in the YouGov polls is nothing to worry about as yet.

 

[Bodian]

Flynn speaks well, is obviously a principled person and makes a positive case for rejoining the SM. If only Labour had a leader like that, rather than the wet lettuce they do have. Starmer and his weak soporific politics is going to lead us to a right wing super majority led by Farage/Braverman in 5 years time. I will put a bet on it.

I think we're ready for a period of rest, where nothing much goes wrong or upsets people. I guess we could draw a parallel with Biden/Trump. Biden only just got in in 2020, he's done okay - but not set the world alight. The situation four years later is much the same as it was going into the 2020 elections - pretty close. So, a four-year soporific period hasn't led to a total collapse or switch in support.

If the same thing happens here - five years of soporific politics where everyone is calm - then there's no reason to doubt that Labour will get a second term.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

So the tory trope now is that we "must not give labour unfettered power. They will raise takes on mortgages, pensions, VAT, everything. Who knows what they would do? ".

This is wankery.

Give it a few days and the Tory trope will be "Don't vote for Muslim Dalek Labour. They will kill you and eat you. Fact!"

 

[Flounce]

Who cares what tactics the Conservatives use? They are wasting their time. This election is like a Sunday League team playing a PL team as far as the result is concerned.

No need to get stressed about it imo

 

[Giraffe]

And the Companies that took the furlough payments from the Govt and then made their staff work throughout........

Funnily enough I was just thinking about this. The biggest issue for me with Sunak is how easily he put out money to support companies that really didn't need it. Or at least if they did they don't now. Really should have made them loans not money to never be returned. Could have easily have said that once a business returns to a pre covid level of profit the monies will be repaid over a set period. Would have put billions back into the treasury. Also think in most cases the 80% was too much. My nephew sat at home for 12 months being paid 80%, had no travel, couldn't go out and socialise so saved enough for a deposit on a house for the first time in his life. Not begrudging him that but was that what the point of furlough was for? Fundamentally the massive support given by the Tories has created a large part of the problems we had since, including the inflationary pressure.

 

[Flounce]

Funnily enough I was just thinking about this. The biggest issue for me with Sunak is how easily he put out money to support companies that really didn't need it. Or at least if they did they don't now. Really should have made them loans not money to never be returned. Could have easily have said that once a business returns to a pre covid level of profit the monies will be repaid over a set period. Would have put billions back into the treasury. Also think in most cases the 80% was too much. My nephew sat at home for 12 months being paid 80%, had no travel, couldn't go out and socialise so saved enough for a deposit on a house for the first time in his life. Not begrudging him that but was that what the point of furlough was for? Fundamentally the massive support given by the Tories has created a large part of the problems we had since, including the inflationary pressure.

Lucky nephew but I imagine the vast majority had mortgages and other expenses that would have ruined them without furlough. Beating Sunak with a stick because he introduced furlough is a step too far imo.

Dishonest companies is not the Government’s fault, maybe those being made to work should have reported it as they are part of the problem. I’m sure anonymity must have been available?

 

[Giraffe]

Lucky nephew but I imagine the vast majority had mortgages and other expenses that would have ruined them without furlough

Accepted, but that was the problem with a blanket approach. It's a bit johnny hindsight because at the time we all thought the world was ending but certainly they could have saved a few bob through the money given to some companies.

 

[Eeyore]

So the tory trope now is that we "must not give labour unfettered power. They will raise takes on mortgages, pensions, VAT, everything. Who knows what they would do? ".

This is wankery.

Give it a few days and the Tory trope will be "Don't vote for Muslim Dalek Labour. They will kill you and eat you. Fact!"

I did find that amusing given that the 2019 election was called so that the Tories could get a clear majority to do as they wished.

 

[Flounce]

Accepted, but that was the problem with a blanket approach. It's a bit johnny hindsight because at the time we all thought the world was ending but certainly they could have saved a few bob through the money given to some companies.

Saved my company and no I didn’t ask people to work until they were allowed to and the hours worked were deducted from Furlough requests. Am I a mug?

 

[Giraffe]

Saved my company and no I didn’t ask people to work until they were allowed to and the hours worked were deducted from Furlough requests. Am I a mug?

No, you did everything right and proper.