[Politics] Gender pay gap

[Giraffe]

Once again, no, you can't assure me that, for ****'s sake, unless of course you're the one doing the interviewing, in which case, yes I imagine those big strong manly MEN will be straight in the door.

Funnily enough I have generally recruited far more women than men. Probably 80:20 split. My view is still the same though. Clearly different from yours. But you work in a very different industry to the business world so I would expect you to have a different view.

 

[Giraffe]

It's a big coincidence, isn't it, that all these women seemingly keep bursting into tears when they're working with you.

I can't say I've ever noticed that problem in my office.

Possibly point proven on the emotional side

There is a very big difference to "making them cry" and observing them cry by the way.

 

[mejonaNO12 aka riskit]

I can assure that if on paper two candidates are similar the guy will probably get it because the odds are he will be less hassle to manage. That's the issue women in business need to address. I can count on one hand how many men I have seen cry at work. I've lost cont how many women have. The moment the tears start they have lost credibility.

I suggest you don't go into recruitment or HR.

 

[Notters]

"That's a fact"? No it's not.

Anybody who dares to imagine we live in a truly equal world: read this load of misogynistic old shit and consider for a second that barely a single user has challenged it.

Well done, guys. Well done.

I'd hope that was because most of us could hardly believe what we were reading and didn't think the post even deserved a reply - that was certainly the case with me!

 

[dazzer6666]

Okay well it's my opinion based on my experience of working with thousands of people, female and men. I can guarantee there will be many reading this who agree with what I am saying but are too scared to state their view but I can assure that if on paper two candidates are similar the guy will probably get it because the odds are he will be less hassle to manage. That's the issue women in business need to address. I can count on one hand how many men I have seen cry at work. I've lost cont how many women have. The moment the tears start they have lost credibility.

Do a poll, prove your point (or not).

 

[Lady Whistledown]

Possibly point proven on the emotional side

There is a very big difference to "making them cry" and observing them cry by the way.

"I've been driving for fifty years and I've never had an accident, though I've seen dozens in the mirror".

 

[Giraffe]

"I've been driving for fifty years and I've never had an accident, though I've seen dozens in the mirror".

 

[Lady Whistledown]

Funnily enough I have generally recruited far more women than men. Probably 80:20 split. My view is still the same though.

Well thank you, thank you so very much for your sterling contribution to gender equality.

Your posts on this subject read like they were written by BensGrandad.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

I'd hope that was because most of us could hardly believe what we were reading and didn't think the post even deserved a reply - that was certainly the case with me!

This. The poster has shown his contempt for women many times over on Nsc, and I was too cowardly to take him on.
Edna is braver and more articulate than me, so I'll leave him to her.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Well thank you, thank you so very much for your sterling contribution to gender equality.

Your posts on this subject read like they were written by BensGrandad.

That's doing BG a disservice. He's quite respectful of his wife.

 

[Lady Whistledown]

I think the fact is that you are correct in that women by nature can be more emotional than men, amongst other differences in personalities, generally speaking; these can be explained by biological processes and evolutionary theory, although some feminists will still disagree.

However where I think you are wrong is that women in business need to address this human nature of theirs to succeed. It is your attitude within business that needs to change. If women are more emotional at times, it doesn't necessarily make them any worse at their jobs - it could even make them better in some positions as it could suggest greater levels of empathy.

If you and others believe these innate behaviours make women less 'credible' then we need to redefine 'credibility'.

Thank you.

 

[Lady Whistledown]

That's doing BG a disservice. He's quite respectful of his wife.

I know. It was just the tone and writing style of the post. BG hasn't contributed to this thread as far as I recall, and whilst his views are frequently somewhat traditional, they're not quite at this level.

 

[Giraffe]

Well thank you, thank you so very much for your sterling contribution to gender equality.

Your posts on this subject read like they were written by BensGrandad.

The reality is I am a good boss who treats all staff fairly, whether male or female, but I have observed a lot of behaviour at the higher end of business and my views are based on this. No one I have ever worked with would say I am sexist. I am a realist, who appreciates the good qualities of men and women but isn't blind to their failings either. I maintain men and women are different with different skills, hard work can mitigate the natural failings, and highlight the qualities, but nonetheless men and women start out as different people and sometimes this natural difference can let down both sexes. It is just my opinion that women generally let themselves down more in this way than women and that is why there are more men at the top of business than women.

Out of interest why do you think there are less women in top positions than men? I don't believe that sexism exists in the way you think it does. Hard nosed business people will recruit the best people to make their business the most profit. Yes there may be some living the dark ages that believe men are better than women full stop (not me) , but they are few and far between. In general the reason women don't progress is because they simply are not as good OR perhaps more importantly as ambition as their male competitors. What other reason can there be?

 

[Giraffe]

I think the fact is that you are correct in that women by nature can be more emotional than men, amongst other differences in personalities, generally speaking; these can be explained by biological processes and evolutionary theory, although some feminists will still disagree.

However where I think you are wrong is that women in business need to address this human nature of theirs to succeed. It is your attitude within business that needs to change. If women are more emotional at times, it doesn't necessarily make them any worse at their jobs - it could even make them better in some positions as it could suggest greater levels of empathy.

If you and others believe these innate behaviours make women less 'credible' then we need to redefine 'credibility'.

I completely agree with you and the emotional side to a woman can be a great thing in business and some roles in particular. However GENERALLY speaking the higher up a business you go the calmer and more logical your decision making needs to be. Some woman can do this, without question and I have first hand experience of some brilliant examples of this. However generally men are better from this point of view ad I really don't see that changing any time soon.

 

[Mellotron]

Just a reminder, everyone. [MENTION=3734]Giraffe[/MENTION] is a mod. Genuinely.

 

[Giraffe]

Just a reminder, everyone. [MENTION=3734]Giraffe[/MENTION] is a mod. Genuinely.

As is Edna, we are a fantastic family at Mod Towers. Oh how the time flies

 

[Mellotron]

The reality is I am a good boss. No one I have ever worked with would say I am sexist.

No good boss ever had to say "I am a good boss". You sound a lot like Donald Trump right now.

 

[Lady Whistledown]

The reality is I am a good boss who treats all staff fairly, whether male or female, but I have observed a lot of behaviour at the higher end of business and my views are based on this. No one I have ever worked with would say I am sexist. I am a realist, who appreciates the good qualities of men and women but isn't blind to their failings either. I maintain men and women are different with different skills, hard work can mitigate the natural failings, and highlight the qualities, but nonetheless men and women start out as different people and sometimes this natural difference can let down both sexes. It is just my opinion that women generally let themselves down more in this way than women and that is why there are more men at the top of business than women.

Out of interest why do you think there are less women in top positions than men? I don't believe that sexism exists in the way you think it does. Hard nosed business people will recruit the best people to make their business the most profit. Yes there may be some living the dark ages that believe men are better than women full stop (not me) , but they are few and far between. In general the reason women don't progress is because they simply are not as good OR perhaps more importantly as ambition as their male competitors. What other reason can there be?

So, in a nutshell, "I'm not sexist but women are simply not as good as men".

Brilliant.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

The reality is I am a good boss who treats all staff fairly, whether male or female, but I have observed a lot of behaviour at the higher end of business and my views are based on this. No one I have ever worked with would say I am sexist. I am a realist, who appreciates the good qualities of men and women but isn't blind to their failings either. I maintain men and women are different with different skills, hard work can mitigate the natural failings, and highlight the qualities, but nonetheless men and women start out as different people and sometimes this natural difference can let down both sexes. It is just my opinion that women generally let themselves down more in this way than women and that is why there are more men at the top of business than women.

But as I alluded to in an earlier post, you are only basing this on your industry. I have a very different view from mine. I find it bizarre that you only seem to recruit specific males and females who all seem to fit your bill. Do you do the recruitment?

 

[mejonaNO12 aka riskit]

I the higher up a business you go the calmer and more logical your decision making needs to be. Some woman can do this, .

Again, as with a previous poster, all I keep doing is reading this in the voice of Alan Partridge