[Albion] Garcia's reasons for leaving (from today's Argus, per Andy Naylor)

[Biscuit]

So TB said the budget 'had slightly improved.' When he should have been praising OG for working with such limited funds.

Not good Tony. Not good at all.

 

[perseus]

The year before I think the reports were right about us having the seventh or eighth best wages budget under Poyet in the Champiosnhip. That might have gone down to tenth with the relegated clubs. It was more than Burnley and Derby as well.

The way the trains problems have been ignored and the catering has gone from OK to the pits is another downhill trend.

Burke's pedigree seemed to be OK: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/16426860

 

[keaton]

This is where I'm at, too. People won't want to hear it though. Some would rather have a big stick to beat the club with.

But I still don't think it makes any sense to be unhappy about transfers, not want any say and quit for that reason.
And even if it's true the stick to beat the club with is we've lost two very good managers in two years largely due to the way we sign players, so something really needs to change

 

[Betfair Bozo]

Assuming this is all accurate of course.....disappointed that no recruits were brought in from abroad (Spain, in particular) except David Rodriguez, as many of us have long argued that the continent offers value relative to England in terms of fees and wages and it appeared we had the right man to exploit that in Oscar and it would appear it was not for lack of interest from the man himself.

However, those questioning Tony Bloom's investment really get my goat! It is not a matter of throwing money at the playing side. YOU ARE NOT PERMITTED TO DO THIS ANYMORE! Do you seriously believe that the bloke who has coughed up £130m of his own cash to buy a stadium, a training facility and service the club's debt does not want the club to go forward as much as you?! Sustainability, sustainability, sustainability.

Fwiw, I don't think the club have recruited especially well either. I rather suspect though that is due to budgets, not lack of competence. Cloth, cut, accordingly.

 

[Biscuit]

Let's be clear: Poyet most certainly did not have "very limited funds".

Fair enough. He had way more than Oscar but seemingly not enough to keep him. OG wasn't provided with the funds he needed to compete, yet TB went public to say our budget was slightly increased (misleading even if true) and that he expected a top 6 finish. That's shoddy on TB's part as far as I see it,

 

[Gwylan]

I think many underestimate the importance of parachute payments (and remember there are 7/8 clubs in receipt of them in this division).

Last season totals

Bolton revenue £28.5 million, of which £3.8 million was from gate receipts and £19.1 million from broadcasting/parachute payments.
Albion £23.3 million, of which £8.7 million was from gate receipts and £4.8 million was from broadcasting.

If we wanted to match Bolton's income, and fans had to pay for it, it would be an increase of around £240 on the price of a season ticket, and that's to compete with Bolton, who have finished below us in the last two seasons.

This single post should really be a sticky to remind the idiots who keeping going on about our gates/number of pies we eat as a reason for us to compete with the likes of Reading and QPR for wages. All but two of the clubs (honourable mentions to Derby and Ipswich) we were competing with for promotion either had parachute payments or mega-rich foreign owners splashing crazy money - it's worth bearing in mind.

This really isn't about needing vast sways of money to compete. We, and others (Palace and to a lesser extent Burnley as they have had parachute payments), have shown that it can be done.

Palace did it by amassing a pile of debt and going into admin, wiping it all out. Do you want us to go down that route? I certainly don't

 

[Pintos]

Maybe we're ahead of the curve in terms of FFP adherence and the inevitable suppression to player wages. Maybe once all the other teams get fined / need to offload players we can pick up some bargains. Maybe not.

One thing for sure though: the financial gap to the premier league is becoming wider, and the advantage to championship clubs with parachute payments even greater.

I think we're going about it the right way but proving a bit of a bumpy ride.

 

[keaton]

Fair enough. He had way more than Oscar but seemingly not enough to keep him. OG wasn't provided with the funds he needed to compete, yet TB went public to say our budget was slightly increased (misleading even if true) and that he expected a top 6 finish. That's shoddy on TB's part as far as I see it,

If Oscar's telling the truth. He could turn up at the Hawthorns in a week or two (much they like the way I suspected he joined us)

 

[El Presidente]

This really isn't about needing vast sways of money to compete. We, and others (Palace and to a lesser extent Burnley as they have had parachute payments), have shown that it can be done.

Our new manager has to work within the constraints the club give him and not get disillusioned when transfers do not go his way. This is not to say that our recruiting process could be improved, of course it can, but TB has made it clear that FFP is king as far as he is concerned. I thought that Oscar would be the man, but clearly he has given up when confronted with reality. Anyone coming in will have a hard job on their hands but they HAVE to up to the challenge. Gus clearly wasn't and Oscar has given up too soon, in my opinion.

I don't disagree with you. We're not paupers in this division, neither are we at the top of the pile.

What confuses me is why so many are moaning about the season we've just had, the playoffs is a realistic target, we made that target. Anything else is a lottery/bonus.

Cardiff lost in the playoffs for four years running before being promoted didn't they?

 

[Puppet Master]

That makes pretty grim reading.

 

[The Wizard]

I'd love to know ell the people including Oscar that comment about the budget, what do you actually want? Us to spend beyond our means end up down the proverbial shit creek without a paddle?

Tony Bloom is clearly a good business man who has employed Barber & Burke for a reason, so please do not insult his intelligence by questioning this as if you know better as some posts appear to have. We have a budget, like all businesses what exactly do people want? I loved Oscar here don't get me wrong but resigning over budget ect is just a kop out, I'm certain he has another job lined up and is trying to avoid any clubs having to pay compensation.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

Fair play to Poyet. Despite having very limited funds he built a team that made the Championship playoffs - twice! They're all getting on a bit now and we don't have any money to replace them. The ceiling did exist.

A midtable budget will give us a midtable team. We can't continually over achieve.

The ceiling may well exist, but it is a lot higher than some believe it to be.

Burnley ( our higher revenue balances their 8 million parachute ), Palace, Derby are proof that we are perfectly able to go higher with our budget.

Poor decision making in recruitment needs to be addressed though, and perhaps that will give us the 3 - 5 place improvement that will see us go up a league.

 

[Biscuit]

If Oscar's telling the truth. He could turn up at the Hawthorns in a week or two (much they like the way I suspected he joined us)

I wouldn't be surprised and I'd wish him all the best. I didn't enjoy his football one iota, but as a person, he seems a man of integrity and that's an admirable trait.

Now let's just get a manager sorted please. The quicker the better.

 

[Gwylan]

I loved Oscar here don't get me wrong but resigning over budget ect is just a kop out, I'm certain he has another job lined up and is trying to avoid any clubs having to pay compensation.

One thing I'm not clear about. If we sacked OG, we'd have to pay compensation as we broke the terms of his contract but I've not seen anything to suggest that he has to pay us, as he broke the terms of the contract. Is the contract only one way?

 

[KZNSeagull]

Palace did it by amassing a pile of debt and going into admin, wiping it all out. Do you want us to go down that route? I certainly don't

No of course not, and I take your point. BUT their wage bill in their promotion season was lower than ours - you can argue that some of those players they had would not have been there if they had not gone into admin.

My point really is that we have got very close to promotion twice working under our self imposed (and correct) financial contraints. It surely does not take a huge cash injection to take the final step. What we can look at is our recruitment process and limits given to Burke, other costs in the club that can be put towards to the playing side etc etc. What I do not believe is that parachute payments are the be all and end all and that we cannot compete. I am not saying that whoever takes over will have an easy job, far from it, but it is do-able and would set someone up for life in management if they rose to the challenge.

 

[drew]

FFP

This. It was always going to be difficult and whilst you can present a wish list of players, if they don't fall within out financial constraints then we aren't going to sign them. Nobody knows whether Burke made enquiries about the spanish players on Oscars list. He may well have done so and immediately found out they were too expensive, either in fee or salary. Disappointed that Oscar has gone as I think this season has been a success when all things considered. When FFP penalties take effect in January we may well see the balance swing more towards ourselves. We'll have to wait and see.

 

[PoG]

So has everyone forgiven Gus?

 

[Biscuit]

The ceiling may well exist, but it is a lot higher than some believe it to be.

Burnley ( our higher revenue balances their 8 million parachute ), Palace, Derby are proof that we are perfectly able to go higher with our budget.

Poor decision making in recruitment needs to be addressed though, and perhaps that will give us the 3 - 5 place improvement that will see us go up a league.

Yes I agree. If we're not spending the going rate then our only other option (if we want to be competitive) is smart recruitment. Let's hope whoever comes in has a little black book of Premiership standard players we can get on the cheap - As you say it's not impossible. Derby/Palace/Burnley have managed it and for what it's worth we've had several class acts playing for us even while in League One.

 

[Mackenzie]

None of this makes any real sense though. OG is an inexperienced manager in his first season in English football after only 1 season in full management. Did he really think he can just walk into a job and get free reign? What happened to managers earning their stripes, establishing their authority through hard work and sticking at it? After his success this season, he would have the confidence of the Chairman, board etc. to start to take more control over matters, instead, and I put this tentatively, he seems to have chucked in the towel like a spoilt child.

I've defended him over the course of the season, but our football has lacked pace, positivity and goals. I think he still has everything to prove, but he obviously thinks he is already bigger and better than this club.

We've seen evidence of managers given too much control over transfers and they can make a right hash of it. Perhaps our structure is a bit cumbersome, but I assume that can be an evolving process.

Disappointing to see a manager walk after effectively overachieving in a lot of ways, and perhaps there was more to come next season. We'll have to wait to see where OG crops up in his next job, as that is going to be more of an indication of why he left than inference over transfer policy.

I'd go along with that.

Who knows, OG could have used us a stepping stone. He has gained experience working in England, both of the football and language, and the stats would say he made a pretty good job of things. His leaving has been amicable (as far as the outside world is concerned). He's enhanced his CV.

Maybe this was his plan all along!

 

[Bozza]

There are two sides to every story.

The side presented in The Argus today suggests that Oscar's hands were tied, he had no hand in transfer dealings and the Albion lost Grabban because of Burke/Bloom.

I've heard another side: Oscar had little interest in transfer dealings as he only wanted to coach, his reluctance to get involved was an issue and the Albion lost Grabban due to Oscar's reticence.

The truth, I suspect, lies somewhere between the two.