[News] France just what's going on?

[Westdene Seagull]

What confuses me is why gangs are looting the Nike store and high end electronics retailers? What do they have to do with an anti police brutality protest?

I couldn't possibly imagine why gangs would loot high end stores . Guess it beats raiding Londis.

 

[jcdenton08]

Yes, because people nicking some trainers is the thing to focus on rather than the police murdering civilians.

It would almost seem like they are using the sad death of a 17 year old boy in a case of police brutality as an excuse to steal. It’s almost like they don’t have a shit about the victim and are using this tragedy for personal gain.

 

[timbha]

It would almost seem like they are using the sad death of a 17 year old boy in a case of police brutality as an excuse to steal. It’s almost like they don’t have a shit about the victim and are using this tragedy for personal gain.

Sadly this is true and the focus and attention get diverted and diluted from the original issue. Some people use any opportunity for personal gain knowing full well there will be a raging mob standing between their victim (eg a Nike store) and the police. In the same way why do they set fire to cars, attack ambulances, fire engines and anything to do with central or local government?

 

[vegster]

Some police incident? A 17-year-old boy was shot in the head at point blank range.

He was shot through the arm/chest allegedly. Apparently the lad in question had form for driving off when stopped, a shot was fired when the car started to move. All will be revealed when this gets to court anyway and hopefully justice will be done.
Sadly, guns kill people, no matter how well trained the user is.

 

[vegster]

I couldn't possibly imagine why gangs would loot high end stores . Guess it beats raiding Londis.

A Lidl store was ram raided then looted in Nantes, 385 km away from Paris.

 

[Happy Exile]

What confuses me is why gangs are looting the Nike store and high end electronics retailers? What do they have to do with an anti police brutality protest?

Well...as you asked. Unsurprisingly after the London riots there was some good analysis of this and why JD Sports and FootLocker were targeted for example, but higher end shops weren't, and how an event - like the killing in this case - becomes a trigger for a wider anger at societal injustice. It's both to do with the police brutality and to do with everything that brutality and the killing represent about exclusion.

The most interesting bit for me is why Nike and high end electronics? At the risk of over-simplifying it, those doing the looting are going for things they want and will get use out of. Most don't need food particularly (so won't raid Londis), and don't need or want a fancy watch or Louis Vuitton bag or jewellery. What they are going for are the standard goods of consumerism they've had pushed at them as desirable but they will literally never have an opportunity to have. The unattainable nature of these most basic items is one of the many indignities of that excluded life and why a killing of a teenager who was young and poor and from a minority like many of them are, and police brutality, is absolutely connected to rioting, looting and burning down of shops. It's all part of the same continuum.

 

[timbha]

A Lidl store was ram raided then looted in Nantes, 385 km away from Paris.

Did they escape with a fold up chair and a set of drills from the middle aisle?

 

[BNthree]

I was commenting on what seemed to be a fairly dismissive tone in your post

I probably should have said atrocity or outrage rather than incident but didn't really ponder on the wording before hitting "post reply"

 

[Bakero]

He was shot through the arm/chest allegedly. Apparently the lad in question had form for driving off when stopped, a shot was fired when the car started to move. All will be revealed when this gets to court anyway and hopefully justice will be done.
Sadly, guns kill people, no matter how well trained the user is.

I guess the officer wasn't very well trained then as before pulling the trigger he said “You are going to get a bullet in the head”.

 

[vegster]

I guess the officer wasn't very well trained then as before pulling the trigger he said “You are going to get a bullet in the head”.

That's probably the French equivalent of " We are The Sweeney and you're f***ing nicked "

 

[jcdenton08]

Well...as you asked. Unsurprisingly after the London riots there was some good analysis of this and why JD Sports and FootLocker were targeted for example, but higher end shops weren't, and how an event - like the killing in this case - becomes a trigger for a wider anger at societal injustice. It's both to do with the police brutality and to do with everything that brutality and the killing represent about exclusion.

The most interesting bit for me is why Nike and high end electronics? At the risk of over-simplifying it, those doing the looting are going for things they want and will get use out of. Most don't need food particularly (so won't raid Londis), and don't need or want a fancy watch or Louis Vuitton bag or jewellery. What they are going for are the standard goods of consumerism they've had pushed at them as desirable but they will literally never have an opportunity to have. The unattainable nature of these most basic items is one of the many indignities of that excluded life and why a killing of a teenager who was young and poor and from a minority like many of them are, and police brutality, is absolutely connected to rioting, looting and burning down of shops. It's all part of the same continuum.

Hang on. Are you justifying looting?

 

[Happy Exile]

Hang on. Are you justifying looting?

I can't see anything I'm saying that implies it's justified? There's a link between the killing of a teenager and looting though.

 

[pb21]

Is the focus on the looting of Nike stores a bit too sharp on the tress you like and not the wider wood?

 

[worthingseagull123]

Is this a genuine case of Police being out of control or heavy handed or more like the usual suspects looking at causing mayhem?

It is the usual suspects. Using to the shooting to loot, smash and burn things and attack people.

Simply on the basis that they’ve failed in life, and want to take this out on others.

This will be the UK in a dozen years time.

 

[pb21]

It is the usual suspects. Using to the shooting to loot, smash and burn things and attack people.

Simply on the basis that they’ve failed in life, and want to take this out on others.

This will be the UK in a dozen years time.

Why didn't they use one of the previous shootings to start to loot etc. ?

They must've wanted a new pair of Nikes for a while, why wait?

 

[BNthree]

There’ll be various factors/factions at work. There’ll be those genuinely upset/outraged at the police actions then there will be those taking advantage of the mayhem to loot. It’s not one homogenous group of people.

 

[Happy Exile]

It is the usual suspects. Using to the shooting to loot, smash and burn things and attack people.

Simply on the basis that they’ve failed in life, and want to take this out on others.

This will be the UK in a dozen years time.

Good point.

How about we all work to prevent it happening in the UK by giving young and marginalised people the same opportunities to succeed in life that their parents had? Free education at university / free vocational education (doctors, nurses etc) would be a good thing to bring back first like their parents and grandparents had so let's increase taxes to enable that. It's mad that my cousin has trained to be a doctor and left with nearly 90k in debt, totally unavoidably.

We'd have to dramatically reduce property prices too - average house price is 9 times average income which is the highest multiplier it's been since pretty much 1901. Anyone who bought a house between 1957 and 1999 had it easy by comparison however much they want to tell us it was hard. Relatively it wasn't for the majority of the population compared to today. That's just plain facts. Maybe a cap on house prices? Bigger capital gains tax? Huge inheritance tax on property to fund building? What do you recommend?

Better health too. Free dentistry for example, shorter waiting lists like the older generation (including me for much of my life) has had it. Another increase in taxes but it's important to give people the same opportunities for success we had, not to pull the ladder up and then somehow make out it's them that is at fault and we just grafted. We did that too, of course we did, but we had it easier.

Where do I sign up?

 

[pb21]

There’ll be various factors/factions at work. There’ll be those genuinely upset/outraged at the police actions then there will be those taking advantage of the mayhem to loot. It’s not one homogenous group of people.

Quite, if this was just people wanting to smash the window at the local Nike shop and loot a new pair of trainers, it would happen every day, but it doesn't.

 

[jcdenton08]

Quite, if this was just people wanting to smash the window at the local Nike shop and loot a new pair of trainers, it would happen every day, but it doesn't.

Looting of this kind depends on numbers; huge numbers, in this case genuine anger and protests caused by the police shooting an immigrant. Then comes retribution. It’s very hard to give reprisals against authority, but Nike/Apple Store? “I’ll steal an iMac, the world is unfair and I deserve one - I’ll also turn over and set fire to this civilian’s car. They’re richer than me and it’s unfair. That’ll show them”.

It’s identical to the London riots.

 

[A1X]

Maybe I imagined the London riots.

One week of riots 12 years ago, I think the point rather stands that it's not as though things have materially improved for most people over those years but not a hint of a riot since which in most countries (certainly France) would be unheard of.