Epson Derby...

[Taybha]

Thought Worthy @ 16s

 

[Mtoto]

Just had a bit on Mickdaam at 85 on Betfair too.

 

[Grombleton]

I went for Astrology at 8's, the missus went for Thought Worthy at 16's.

 

[patchamalbion]

Camelot

 

[Questions]

Only Nashwan 89 and Sea the Stars recently have won the 2000 and gone on to win the derby since Nyjinsky who of course won the triple crown. We,ll know soon enough though.

 

[Questions]

If Camelot drops down to 10 furlongs after this we might even see him take on Frankel later in the season. He,d get whipped though.

 

[Falkor]

Wow great run

 

[kevtherev]

Very impressive, once he turned the after burners on three out, it was all over.

 

[Questions]

Impressive.

 

[patchamalbion]

lots would have been on the double!

 

[BensGrandad]

The disappointing thing about the Derby is the attendance as there is only about 100,000 attending today. When I lived in Epsom 1970/80 and it was held on the first Wed of June each year they had crowds in excess of 250,000 mind they didn't charge any admission in those days.

 

[kevtherev]

If Camelot drops down to 10 furlongs after this we might even see him take on Frankel later in the season. He,d get whipped though.

But Frankel has never been further than a mile. Which would be Camelot's minimum trip now. So I would not be so confident, over ten furlongs about Frankel. Why has he never stepped up before?

 

[keithbeaky]

Won that as expected. They said in April he was very special. Main Sequence is a very good horse and others in behind aren't complete donkeys. He's not a bad animal

 

[keithbeaky]

But Frankel has never been further than a mile. Which would be Camelot's minimum trip now. So I would not be so confident, over ten furlongs about Frankel. Why has he never stepped up before?

As a 3yo Frankel was a bit free and didn't settle well enough to stay 1m2. He is also the fastest Miler in the last 20 years, if not ever, and that with him not settling so well meant races over 1m2 were never an option. His pacemaker couldn't keep up after 100 yards in the Guineas! This year he has grown up physically and mentally. The way he traveled in the Lockinge was far better than last year and with that maturity he will be fine over 1m2 and would wipe the floor with Camelot, who won an average Guineas over 1m, and who will now race over 1m4 or further rather than stepping back down.

 

[DumLum]

Camelot will win the Derby without any worries atall. I'm doubling it up with St Nicholas Abbey in the 2:40. £100 double returns £250.

Nice.

 

[kevtherev]

As a 3yo Frankel was a bit free and didn't settle well enough to stay 1m2. He is also the fastest Miler in the last 20 years, if not ever, and that with him not settling so well meant races over 1m2 were never an option. His pacemaker couldn't keep up after 100 yards in the Guineas! This year he has grown up physically and mentally. The way he traveled in the Lockinge was far better than last year and with that maturity he will be fine over 1m2 and would wipe the floor with Camelot, who won an average Guineas over 1m, and who will now race over 1m4 or further rather than stepping back down.

The proof will be in the pudding when he tackles the true champion distance of ten furlongs. I'm sure Frankel will win but I wouldn't be over confident. Workforce ran the fastest Derby time ever, then won an Arc but hasn't done a lot since......Would be nice to know who's dodging who out of the Aussie wonder horse and Frankel.

 

[keithbeaky]

The proof will be in the pudding when he tackles the true champion distance of ten furlongs. I'm sure Frankel will win but I wouldn't be over confident. Workforce ran the fastest Derby time ever, then won an Arc but hasn't done a lot since......Would be nice to know who's dodging who out of the Aussie wonder horse and Frankel.

Do you know who he will be tackling over 1m2? So You Think, Carlton House? I cant see them posing a threat. Anyway I think he will only run over 1m2 in the Juddmonte at York in August. Win the Queen Anne, Sussex, Juddmonte and then probably the QEII again before being retired to stud.

Black Caviar vs Frankel will never happen. She runs over 6f as her optimum trip and Frankel over 1m. So obviously it would seem fair to run over 7f, but there aren't any suitable races. She could take him on in the Sussex, which is the sharpest G1 Mile in the UK, but she wont. Its just media hype, they wont ever meet.

Workforce had many problems during his career but his Derby and Arc wins were no fluke and he was the best horse over 1m4 that season. Track records mean very little, there are too many factors. Going, sectional times, racing position, wind.

 

[kevtherev]

As a 3yo Frankel was a bit free and didn't settle well enough to stay 1m2. He is also the fastest Miler in the last 20 years, if not ever, and that with him not settling so well meant races over 1m2 were never an option. His pacemaker couldn't keep up after 100 yards in the Guineas! This year he has grown up physically and mentally. The way he traveled in the Lockinge was far better than last year and with that maturity he will be fine over 1m2 and would wipe the floor with Camelot, who won an average Guineas over 1m, and who will now race over 1m4 or further rather than stepping back down.

For the record eight runners since 1997 have clocked a fastest winning time than Frankel's Guineas win in 2011. I remember at the time, the other jockey's saying they thought he was the pacemaker, that's why they let him slip the field, then couldn't reel him in. Not disputing he is a great horse though.

 

[patchamalbion]

i don't think the Frankel v BC debate will ever be put to bed, just no suitable race. Would be brilliant to see but it's media hype and the uk v aus thing that keeps it going

 

[Questions]

But Frankel has never been further than a mile. Which would be Camelot's minimum trip now. So I would not be so confident, over ten furlongs about Frankel. Why has he never stepped up before?

He is going to this year kev. He,ll still go in the Sussex at Goodwood though and I just wish that Black Caviar would go there as well.
If Camelot and Frankel meet it will be in the Juddmonte I suspect. mouth watering prospect if you love your racing.
Mind you having said that connections of Camelot are surely more worried about The Ledger now surely.
There are 3 exceptional horses out there and it's a shame they can't get match ups.