[Misc] Electric Cars

[junior]

Anyone going to go left field and plump for an Alpine A290? Could be the first genuine EV hot hatch
View attachment 185365

Looks a nice car, but the Hyundai ioniq 5 N is already out and is a mental hot hatch. 600+ bhp and even has a setting where you can feel like your driving with a manual gearbox via paddle shifters.

 

[junior]

Our workplace has finally caught up and are offering a salary sacrifice scheme, so with my petrol lease ending in December I may well take the plunge.

Test drive the BMW I4 M50 as they didn’t have the e40 M sport version I may be after available as it sold in the morning.

The M50 was ridiculously rapid, to almost whiplash levels and was a nice play to sit as well. Real world range will be sufficient for my needs as well. Scheme comes with maintenance, insurance and free install of a home charger

Has one got any experience of the I4 on a long term basis as keen to get views?

Personally really liked it but fear there is some boy racer bias within my current view

We have ordered a BMW iX which is due to come in a few weeks. Test drove it back in May when we placed the order and it was my first experience driving an EV and I was sold straight away.

My work has also just joined the already existing NHS leasing/salary sacrifice scheme and there is some amazing deals on there. If we get on with the EV, then I'm looking at replacing my Cupra Ateca with a BMW i4, i5 or i7 as soon as possible.

 

[zefarelly]

Anyone going to go left field and plump for an Alpine A290? Could be the first genuine EV hot hatch
View attachment 185365

It looks like it'll get hot

does it come with a plumbed in extinguisher?

 

[albionalba]

Presumably with an electrical issue was the scrap value for the remainder of the car to be parted out?

What was your TCO over the period you owned it?

Yes it was for the remainder of the car but it was repairable - I just checked and it is presently taxed so must have been repaired - but the problem for me was the lack of certainty on the diagnosis and worry that I might spend £8k only to spend another £5k and so on etc. It was valued about £12k so quite borderline if worth it at that point. The diagnosis had cost me £2k also.

When it broke down in the run up to all this (three times) it had to be recovered as cannot be towed. Each time it was blocking busy roads and you cannot move them or push them to safety - it was horrific tbh! This is something all electric owners should be aware of (unless things are better on that front now?)

I pity whoever has it now as it has probably had a part from a similar age car with uncertain lifespan fitted.

It was fast, 0-60 <7s and I really loved it up until that point.

I haven't worked out my TCO but I suspect it was c £50,000 over 7.5 years = £6.7k per year and I only did about 30,000 miles in that time (pandemic and other household cars etc) so expensive per mile at £1.66 plus electricity (and small amounts of petrol as mine was the range extender model).

I think it has shown me that the notion of getting a decent car newish and maintaining it for 8-10 years as I did with my previous SAAB is just not worth thinking about - as @halftimepies has said above also.

 

[Flounce]

It looks like it'll get hot

does it come with a plumbed in extinguisher?

Alpine will NEVER be allowed to forget that Top Gear episode

 

[zefarelly]

Yes it was for the remainder of the car but it was repairable - I just checked and it is presently taxed so must have been repaired - but the problem for me was the lack of certainty on the diagnosis and worry that I might spend £8k only to spend another £5k and so on etc. It was valued about £12k so quite borderline if worth it at that point. The diagnosis had cost me £2k also.

When it broke down in the run up to all this (three times) it had to be recovered as cannot be towed. Each time it was blocking busy roads and you cannot move them or push them to safety - it was horrific tbh! This is something all electric owners should be aware of (unless things are better on that front now?)

I pity whoever has it now as it has probably had a part from a similar age car with uncertain lifespan fitted.

It was fast, 0-60 <7s and I really loved it up until that point.

I haven't worked out my TCO but I suspect it was c £50,000 over 7.5 years = £6.7k per year and I only did about 30,000 miles in that time (pandemic and other household cars etc) so expensive per mile at £1.66 plus electricity (and small amounts of petrol as mine was the range extender model).

I think it has shown me that the notion of getting a decent car newish and maintaining it for 8-10 years as I did with my previous SAAB is just not worth thinking about - as @halftimepies has said above also.

I know its incomparable, but I had a Subaru Legacy estate for 11 years, bought it just under 4 years old and as good as new really . . . . 90k miles later after a lot of very hard work I sold it and calculated from its history, it cost me 11p a mile, including fuel @ 30mpg . . . . Granted it was a manual petrol car, but given what it did and its versatility . . .and 100% reliability. An overgrown scalextric fire hazard aint happening any time soon For me to work like that.

4 years later its still going . . . .

I just don't see electric cars being financially viable for the majority of people in the short term . . . . Too expensive in every respect

Having said that . . . . There are lots of people with over sized status symbols who really should shift. school run could be slot based as well, it would be safer for all concerned.

 

[Greg Bobkin]

Thanks for taking the time

Didn’t even look at Audi as never been happy with interiors (first sign of getting older when the inside matters as much!) and I’ve never liked Mercedes, to me BMW is a class above both.

The i4 is due a facelift release this month so i suspect it will be a 2023 model but the standard kit hasn’t changed really.

The car was pre spec so no option to add any packs. I don’t think the tech pack is massively useful for me (compared to standard kit) I would have taken the comfort pack (fully electric front seats and wireless phone charger) but can live without it.

Glad to here on the range being real world realistic as the sales staff said the same and I say said well you would say that!

Interior is way more important to me than exterior - you spend more time looking at the inside than the outside. And when it's done badly (No buttons, fiddly controls, an HMI with sub-menus in sub-menus) is unbearable.

I doubt MY24/25 i4 will be massively different - more software upgrades and a few cosmetic changes than anything major. Car manufacturers at getting like football clubs with kits: there seems to be a 'new' version of some cars every year.

 

[Greg Bobkin]

Looks a nice car, but the Hyundai ioniq 5 N is already out and is a mental hot hatch. 600+ bhp and even has a setting where you can feel like your driving with a manual gearbox via paddle shifters.

Yeah, but it's nearly £70k! Everything I've read and heard is positive (driving it in August, hopefully), but it wants to be for that price.

Turning circle is awful apparently, as a slightly random aside.

 

[Greg Bobkin]

Don’t underestimate the sporting heritage of the Dieppe based Alpine. I will be shocked if it’s not much more of a driver’s car than the Renault

Without a doubt it will be. The A110 is an awesome bit of kit and Renault clearly has a plan - and target audience - for Alpine's EVs (three on their way in 2025 and more to follow in 2026, so I was told the other day).

I'm just saying that the R5 will be here first and it will sell loads of them.

 

[Half Time Pies]

I know its incomparable, but I had a Subaru Legacy estate for 11 years, bought it just under 4 years old and as good as new really . . . . 90k miles later after a lot of very hard work I sold it and calculated from its history, it cost me 11p a mile, including fuel @ 30mpg . . . . Granted it was a manual petrol car, but given what it did and its versatility . . .and 100% reliability. An overgrown scalextric fire hazard aint happening any time soon For me to work like that.

4 years later its still going . . . .

I just don't see electric cars being financially viable for the majority of people in the short term . . . . Too expensive in every respect

Having said that . . . . There are lots of people with over sized status symbols who really should shift. school run could be slot based as well, it would be safer for all concerned.

Petrol cars also go wrong though don't they, and can cost a lot to repair particularly if a premium brand and with new technology.

I remember buying a Toyota ago when they first came out which had a newly developed automatic gearbox. It cost about 7K new and shortly after the warranty ran out the gearbox went costing me £1700!

Technology often takes a while to to become as reliable as what it replaces and anyone buying an electric vehicle in 2015 was effectively beta testing it for the manufacturer. The situation is completely different now, most manufacturers have whole ranges of electric vehicle and battery technology has improved massively. The Kia range of electric vehicles now have the same 7 year warranty as its petrol and diesel cars.

EV's in theory should me more reliable than combustion engine cars as they have fewer moving parts, no fluids to replace and the wear to consumables like Break Pads and Discs is significantly reduced.

 

[zefarelly]

Petrol cars also go wrong though don't they, and can cost a lot to repair particularly if a premium brand and with new technology.

I remember buying a Toyota ago when they first came out which had a newly developed automatic gearbox. It cost about 7K new and shortly after the warranty ran out the gearbox went costing me £1700!

Technology often takes a while to to become as reliable as what it replaces and anyone buying an electric vehicle in 2015 was effectively beta testing it for the manufacturer. The situation is completely different now, most manufacturers have whole ranges of electric vehicle and battery technology has improved massively. The Kia range of electric vehicles now have the same 7 year warranty as its petrol and diesel cars.

EV's in theory should me more reliable than combustion engine cars as they have fewer moving parts, no fluids to replace and the wear to consumables like Break Pads and Discs is significantly reduced.

Reliability comes in time with correct development. The Subarus up until about 2006/7 were the last of the truly manual cars, so exrtremely robust and reliable. .

Electric vehicles must be a lot harder on tyres and brakes given theyre so bloody heavy, they should be taxed as well for wrecking ehat little left of the roads.

the biggest issue with all cars now is the size of the things, they're all too big and to heavy. road tax needs splitting into sub catogories, emissions footprint and weight at the very least. . . For all PLG vehicles. Vans are another issue, shit loads of stinky diesels racing round towns with one tradie in it and a bag of tools.

 

[Audax]

Petrol cars also go wrong though don't they, and can cost a lot to repair particularly if a premium brand and with new technology.

Such as the Ecoboost Ford's from 2014/2015 (or was it 2013 that they gave the Focus its big update?). Those things were a reliability nightmare.

 

[LamieRobertson]

Reliability comes in time with correct development. The Subarus up until about 2006/7 were the last of the truly manual cars, so exrtremely robust and reliable. .

Electric vehicles must be a lot harder on tyres and brakes given theyre so bloody heavy, they should be taxed as well for wrecking ehat little left of the roads.

the biggest issue with all cars now is the size of the things, they're all too big and to heavy. road tax needs splitting into sub catogories, emissions footprint and weight at the very least. . . For all PLG vehicles. Vans are another issue, shit loads of stinky diesels racing round towns with one tradie in it and a bag of tools.

we aren’t all like that ya know

 

[LamieRobertson]

Yeah, but it's nearly £70k! Everything I've read and heard is positive (driving it in August, hopefully), but it wants to be for that price.

Turning circle is awful apparently, as a slightly random aside.

70k?

 

[Audax]

Electric vehicles must be a lot harder on tyres and brakes given theyre so bloody heavy, they should be taxed as well for wrecking ehat little left of the roads.

This isn't as true as the anti-EV lobbyists propaganda would have us believe. The big petrol SUVs are far worse.

Keep in mind that EVs are driven differently. While they are heavier like-for-like, drivers who want to maximise efficiency will learn to do things like lift-and-coast and let the energy recovery system slow the vehicle down instead of leaning heavily on the brakes. As a result, generally speaking an EV will spend *a lot* less time under heavy braking (which is what wears the pads etc). Less time under heavy braking means less road damage as well, as the lift-and-coast doesn't result in braking energy being transferred through the compressing tyres (due to weight transfer) into the road surface. Similarly, the typical EV being driven for efficiency won't be asked to accelerate as hard out of junctions (again, weight/energy transfer does the damage ... don't accelerate as hard, don't do as much damage).

 

[Greg Bobkin]

70k?

The range starts at £65k, yeah. An extra £30k than the standard IONIQ 5.

 

[zefarelly]

This isn't as true as the anti-EV lobbyists propaganda would have us believe. The big petrol SUVs are far worse.

Keep in mind that EVs are driven differently. While they are heavier like-for-like, drivers who want to maximise efficiency will learn to do things like lift-and-coast and let the energy recovery system slow the vehicle down instead of leaning heavily on the brakes. As a result, generally speaking an EV will spend *a lot* less time under heavy braking (which is what wears the pads etc). Less time under heavy braking means less road damage as well, as the lift-and-coast doesn't result in braking energy being transferred through the compressing tyres (due to weight transfer) into the road surface. Similarly, the typical EV being driven for efficiency won't be asked to accelerate as hard out of junctions (again, weight/energy transfer does the damage ... don't accelerate as hard, don't do as much damage).

Ah, conveyance, as opposed to 'driving' I get that. They're all too heavy though.

 

[Flounce]

This isn't as true as the anti-EV lobbyists propaganda would have us believe. The big petrol SUVs are far worse.

Keep in mind that EVs are driven differently. While they are heavier like-for-like, drivers who want to maximise efficiency will learn to do things like lift-and-coast and let the energy recovery system slow the vehicle down instead of leaning heavily on the brakes. As a result, generally speaking an EV will spend *a lot* less time under heavy braking (which is what wears the pads etc). Less time under heavy braking means less road damage as well, as the lift-and-coast doesn't result in braking energy being transferred through the compressing tyres (due to weight transfer) into the road surface. Similarly, the typical EV being driven for efficiency won't be asked to accelerate as hard out of junctions (again, weight/energy transfer does the damage ... don't accelerate as hard, don't do as much damage).

Every EV I’ve had a ride in has had the driver show me how fast it accelerates within moments of getting in the sewing machine sounding abominations

 

[LamieRobertson]

The range starts at £65k, yeah. An extra £30k than the standard IONIQ 5.

I dont think I’m the target market…most ive pad for a vehicle is £6k ..prior to that £1500

 

[Brian Fantana]

I've had an Audi Q4 e-tron for about a month and it is bloody lovely all round. No complaints at all from me thus. Got my home charger being installed finally this week.