Duffy tweet

[Wellesley]

I'll always support the Albion, but I will be a lot happier once Duffy has f#cked off. He is entitled to his views, but so am I and I find his support for a murdering terrorist b@stard that indiscriminately killed OUR fellow countrymen, women and children, more than disgusting. He called him a f#cking hero! Scumbag.

 

[Albumen]

I'll always support the Albion, but I will be a lot happier once Duffy has f#cked off. He is entitled to his views, but so am I and I find his support for a murdering terrorist b@stard that indiscriminately killed OUR fellow countrymen, women and children, more than disgusting. He called him a f#cking hero!

Should we not buy any Northern Irish players?

 

[Buzzer]

It very much depends on how you see history. But as you asked me that question personally I’ll give you my perspective with a nod to the first sentence and a flag against your suggestion to extract Britain from the equation.

History is handed down to us by the ruling classes, or was when I grew up in the ashes of Empire. We were taught of foreign conquest, of kings and queens, of servitude and loyalty. To what ? I must have thought.

Frederick Engels once suggested that the English don’t do revolutions as we are in a permanent state of quiet revolution. And, for me, this defines our character as a nation.

I identify with our rich social history, not the Wellington and Nelson rhetoric. The struggle of the working classes, the social revolution that brought about the living standards we enjoy today. The makers, the levellers, the social protagonists who fought for fairness and equality. Those who devoted their lives to the betterment of future generations. Ultimately those who fought tyranny in the ‘good fight’ and paved the way for the levelling of the spoils of labour.

For me, that is my country in which I am proud. I love Its, sometimes grudging, acceptance of the alien. The values of respect -even if it does feel uncomfortable with our natural reserve. The mundane safety that our social systems afford us. Our music, or literature, our sporting institutions, rain in July, tea at cricket, the BBC, the visual legacy of those who paved the way for us to have the chance to enjoy such things.

What is there not to identify with ? This is England. But the reality is, in many ways, it is also Scotland too. To me, all that separates us is May Day poles and deep fried mars bars. When I grew up I didn't differentiate between Scottish and English writers, as your article says. So it’s hard to delineate between English and British. I’d say Scots are actually more conservative in nature but have a richer appreciation for the roots of their social and economic history (thus a greater identity as a nation- for that is where it starts). This may be why they will be better off alone.

This brings me to my earlier post. Our identity is not defined by centuries old wars that bring a temporary and long lost superiority. For when that star falls so the identity has no guide. Thus we see our ‘flag’ hijacked by those who long for the grand past that the history books inflicted upon us in a measure too large. But when you know your roots, you know the struggles of those who facilitated today’s comfort, you know the good custom, and you know about simple values that come from within and are not inflicted by government, nationalists, or religious institution, then you cannot fail to love being English. It is our own ancestors who wrote history, yours and my ancestors, whether it was dying to stop Hitler, dying making a rail viaduct in wage slavery, or beating the Aussies at cricket. They make me proud to be English.

Wars were never won on the playing fields of Eton, they were won in the cotton mills of Manchester.

People have called me a yoghurt knitting, lefty appeaser. Perhaps I am. But I’m a proud Englishman- because my country puts up with me and doesn’t try to stop me.

You may love the working classes but I don't think you understand their patriotism. I say this in all sincerity, this is possibly the single biggest problem with the metropolitan left that controls the Labour party right now.

 

[darkwolf666]

The IRA Murdered Children for example Warrington 1993:

Three-year-old Johnathan Ball died at the scene. He had been in town with his babysitter, shopping for a Mother's Day card. The second victim, 12-year-old Tim Parry, was gravely wounded. He died on 25 March 1993 when doctors switched his life support machine off, having asked permission to do so from his family, after tests had found minimal brain activity. Fifty-four other people were injured, four of them seriously

Freedom Fighters? Do me a favour...

Yet Tim Parry's father met MM on several occasions having made more of an attempt to understand the mans reasoning for his actions. It's a shame sometimes that those outside of such atrocities seem to take more of the moral high ground than those actually affected!

 

[Wellesley]

Should we not buy any Northern Irish players?

It is our country that is most important to me and if a player calls murdering IRA filth a hero, I personally don't want them at our club.

 

[jakarta]

People have called me a yoghurt knitting, lefty appeaser

That is because you are evidently are a yoghurt knitting lefty appeaser.

Getting back to the substance of the thread it is also because you never had to take bits of people out of trees and put them in body bags which a mate of mine had to do in Ulster, the bombing having been done at the behest of Martin McGuinness and his buddies.

 

[dazzer6666]

Lots of relatively positive comments about MM today from a LOT of people including: Bill Clinton, Ian Paisley Jr, David Cameron, Alastair Campbell, Tony Blair (just skimming BBC News). Huge numbers of mourners our on the streets of Derry right now as we speak - he's a very popular man amongst parts of that community. Also obviously a lot of people understandably feel very differently about his contributions and are making their opinions known. It's a divisive issue.

Given that Shane Duffy is well known to come from a nationalist background in Derry, why on earth would anyone be surprised that he would be from the side of the debate that look favourably on MM? I know a lot of Albion fans would strongly disagree with his politics but he doesn't owe us all some sort of political allegiance or neutrality - he owes us 100% effort on the pitch and I don't think anyone could question he gives that. If you genuinely can't stomach someone playing for the Albion and tweeting what he did today (which doesn't particularly stand out amongst a lot of mainstream commentators), then I think you're walking down a path towards saying that players of certain backgrounds and political persuasions aren't welcome.

Difficult issue, that's just my take.

Good post. As others have said, to Duffy he will have been an instrumental figure in bringing peace. Duffy will have heard enough tales about life during the troubles to know how different life is now.

As for some other posts on here today, I can also sympathise with anyone who would have been directly exposed to the horrific acts, but wishing ill on one of our players for expressing a personal view is a step too far.

 

[daveinprague]

Irrelevant to my mind, keep your counsel and be aware of the atrocities that MM was responsible for in the city he now lives in and represents.

That's not the point. How you can assess his tweet as hero worship of a terrorist is a bit lame. Its just your prejudice. SD was two years old when the peace process started, but you are sure he is worshipping his terrorist past and not is role in bringing peace

 

[jakarta]

Yet Tim Parry's father met MM on several occasions having made more of an attempt to understand the mans reasoning for his actions. It's a shame sometimes that those outside of such atrocities seem to take more of the moral high ground than those actually affected!

Not having that, I'm from Cheshire, I was in Warrington a few days previously and more importantly my brother and sister in law were actually in the town that day.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Yet Tim Parry's father met MM on several occasions having made more of an attempt to understand the mans reasoning for his actions. It's a shame sometimes that those outside of such atrocities seem to take more of the moral high ground than those actually affected!

Colin Parry is one hell of a man.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-39337760

Colin Parry's 12-year-old son, Tim, was killed when two IRA bombs exploded in Warrington in 1993.
"I don't forgive Martin nor the IRA and nor does my wife and children," he said.
But he added that he found Mr McGuinness "an easy and pleasant man to talk to".
"He was a man who, I believe, was sincere in his desire for peace and to maintain the peace process at all costs," he said.
"He deserves great credit for his recent life - rather than his earlier life for which I don't think anything in his recent life can atone.
"He was still a brave man who put himself at some risk within some elements of his own community in Northern Ireland."

 

[darkwolf666]

Not having that, I'm from Cheshire, I was in Warrington a few days previously and more important my brother and sister in law were actually in the town that day.

I was in Brighton when The Grand was blown up, but I have no right to speak for the victims...

 

[Buzzer]

Yet Tim Parry's father met MM on several occasions having made more of an attempt to understand the mans reasoning for his actions. It's a shame sometimes that those outside of such atrocities seem to take more of the moral high ground than those actually affected!

Is Aileen Quinton's high ground good enough for you? For every Colin Parry there's an Aileen Quinton or Lowly Mathers or Shauna Moreland or Rose Hegarty. Google their names, read their story too. I can't call a man like McGuinness, who did what he did to these families, was completely unrepentant about it and refused to assist in telling the truth about the deaths of their loved ones or even where the bodies are, any sort of hero.

[tweet]844214975094652928[/tweet]

 

[Mackenzie]

With the polarising feelings about the death of Mcguinness, Duffy tweeting what he did was idiocy whether you agree with him or not.

The club should be having a word imo.

 

[darkwolf666]

Colin Parry is one hell of a man.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-39337760

Colin Parry's 12-year-old son, Tim, was killed when two IRA bombs exploded in Warrington in 1993.
"I don't forgive Martin nor the IRA and nor does my wife and children," he said.
But he added that he found Mr McGuinness "an easy and pleasant man to talk to".
"He was a man who, I believe, was sincere in his desire for peace and to maintain the peace process at all costs," he said.
"He deserves great credit for his recent life - rather than his earlier life for which I don't think anything in his recent life can atone.
"He was still a brave man who put himself at some risk within some elements of his own community in Northern Ireland."

It takes an incredible man to understand the motivations of someone who was culpable in the death of their child.

 

[dazzer6666]

With the polarising feelings about the death of Mcguinness, Duffy tweeting what he did was idiocy whether you agree with him or not.

The club should be having a word imo.

Probably already have a 'social media policy' and suspect he's breached it if so..........

 

[darkwolf666]

Is Aileen Quinton's high ground good enough for you? For every Colin Parry there's an Aileen Quinton or Lowly Mathers or Shauna Moreland or Rose Hegarty. Google their names, read their story too. I can't call a man like McGuinness, who did what he did to these families, was completely unrepentant about it and refused to assist in telling the truth about the deaths of their loved ones or even where the bodies are, any sort of hero.

[tweet]844214975094652928[/tweet]

No, all of those people have the right to speak out as they were directly affected and not someone who wishes to take the moral high ground just because they can.

 

[Hampster Gull]

I assume Duffy is acknowledging his part in bringing peace to his country. Fair enough, he was a key part of the journey. I doubt he is celebrating his time as killer. Might be wrong but I would need to hear that from him. May peace continue.

 

[Guinness Boy]

I'll always support the Albion, but I will be a lot happier once Duffy has f#cked off. He is entitled to his views, but so am I and I find his support for a murdering terrorist b@stard that indiscriminately killed OUR fellow countrymen, women and children, more than disgusting. He called him a f#cking hero! Scumbag.

Let's go all hypothetical here for a minute. Let's just say my footballing abilities put me, not as last pick for the pub 5th XI but as a pro. Let's say, even more improbably, I ended up playing in Argentina. And let's also say Simon Weston died. A hero to most Brits, including me, but a murderer to Argentinians.

Now I'd have choices here both in social media and in informal discussions. Maybe it would be better just to keep my admiration to myself, certainly more tactful and better for my physical and mental health. Or I could just mumble something benign and deflecting if questioned, otherwise not, and hope that did. It might well. But people are contacting me from the UK, my Facebook is filling up with tributes and the media are wondering what this English footballer living in Argentina thinks of it all. So I could then go full nuclear and get it out of the way with.

That last option takes balls. It would upset a lot of people, possibly draw that phase of my career to a close and put me in danger but my hope would be to simply ride it out and hope all was forgiven the next time I scored a goal or set up a winner against the local rivals or whatever.

I don't think Duffy's right in what he says in any way but I do admire his balls for saying it. Those are the same balls that have carried us through some of the biggest games this season and may well do again next. I can separate his football and his politics. I can admire his sticking to his own opinion without agreeing with a word of it. And I can also muse that those who've wished harm on him today are no better than the terrorists they seek to condemn.

 

[Buzzer]

No, all of those people have the right to speak out as they were directly affected and not someone who wishes to take the moral high ground just because they can.

So please don't just quote Colin Parry as the voice for all victims' families as you have been trying to imply.

Edit - and the speed of your response rather suggests you didn't google any names. Trust me, their stories deserve to be heard. What they went through and are still suffering is horrific.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

The IRA Murdered Children for example Warrington 1993:

Three-year-old Johnathan Ball died at the scene. He had been in town with his babysitter, shopping for a Mother's Day card. The second victim, 12-year-old Tim Parry, was gravely wounded. He died on 25 March 1993 when doctors switched his life support machine off, having asked permission to do so from his family, after tests had found minimal brain activity. Fifty-four other people were injured, four of them seriously

Freedom Fighters? Do me a favour...

And why would/did they do that? Why did the IRA exist?

A group like that won't exist without conditions that over a long period of time drive regular people to do terrible things out of desperation and frustration.

The way you're painting the picture you'd think no Irish child ever died at the hands of the foreign soldiers that were stationed in their native land.