[Politics] Donald Trump, US President Elect 2025

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Quite, 'aborting' and 'not keeping alive' are two very different things - perhaps not if you see the bible as a text book.

Indeed.

But how can someone who thinks like this not also recognize that execution (of criminals) is late abortion, and therefore wrong?

 

[Triggaaar]

One can twist that into executing babies only if one subscribes to keeping anything alive no matter how damaged, in agony, decerebrate or whatever.

No, one really can't. Executing someone means killing them, not failing to keep them alive at all costs. Like when an old person with no quality of life has a DNR (do not resuscitate). If they then die, they haven't been executed.

I know you know this, but let's not pretend it can be argued any other way.

 

[BadFish]

Indeed.

But how can someone who thinks like this not also recognize that execution (of criminals) is late abortion, and therefore wrong?

You see, children are the most important thing from conception to 9 months, well maybe 9.5 months now.


. . . . then guns* are the most important thing.

*gun manufacturers and their pals

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

No, one really can't. Executing someone means killing them, not failing to keep them alive at all costs. Like when an old person with no quality of life has a DNR (do not resuscitate). If they then die, they haven't been executed.

I know you know this, but let's not pretend it can be argued any other way.

Good point.

I should have written 'Once may try to...'.....but that of course reduces to absurdity.

I may try to flap my arms and fly.

Many years ago I was stopped by two young policemen for driving through a yellow light
"What does a yellow light mean?"
"er, prepare to stop"
"No, it means stop. So it is like a red light. So you drove through a red light"

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

You see, children are the most important thing from conception to 9 months, well maybe 9.5 months now.


. . . . then guns* are the most important thing.

*gun manufacturers and their pals

I think I have probably spent more than enough time today trying to deconstruct the logic architecture of the loony right.

It simply can't be done.

Owing to the absence of logic and architecture.

 

[BadFish]

I think I have probably spent more than enough time today trying to deconstruct the logic architecture of the loony right.

It simply can't be done.

Owing to the absence of logic and architecture.

I agree, our trump loving friends have been given every opportunity to put a compelling case for him gaining their vote.

Its a tough ask and they haven't surprised anyone. However the fact remains that they do have a vote and are entitled to do as they wish with it.

Las Vegan said it best with 'believe what you want'.

Not terribly scientific as one should really believe what the facts show them but this is the world in which we live I suppose and it is a notion that explains the current phenomenon well.

 

[nicko31]

This is why constructive debate is an utter waste of time - Zeberdi posts a clear and concise rebuttal to your claim and the only response is "believe what you like".

These couple of posters are an interesting insight into the Trump cult. You can see how the 5th Avenue quote has developed into reality for many

 

[GingerBeerMan]

These couple of posters are an interesting insight into the Trump cult.

This is very true. As bizarre as it may seem from the outside, 70 million people in the country share similar views.

Im not a fan of Trump but this should be a wake-up call to everyone that the world system is currently very broken. Populists don't rise to power while the world is swimming along nicely, they rise to power on the back of inequality and hardship.

 

[chickens]

Believe what you want to.

No. “Believe what you want to” is what allows bullshitters like Trump to flourish.

Absolutely you get to have your own opinions, you do NOT get to have alternative facts where evidence does not bear out your candidate’s assertions.

Your complaints of bias come down to the fact that your preferred candidate deliberately attempted to spread misinformation, and was correctly called out on it.

It’s not good enough. And I don’t think there’s any amount of supposed “assassination attempts” that is going to save this serial bullshitter from losing this election.

 

[sparkie]

All of THIS.

WTF is wrong with you @lasvegan ? Why are you claiming that all this nonsense is true? It's pure madness.

It is indeed madness.

Supporting Trump isn't mad, as such. Claiming the nonsense in question is true is crazy.

 

[Zeberdi]

This is very true. As bizarre as it may seem from the outside, 70 million people in the country share similar views.

Im not a fan of Trump but this should be a wake-up call to everyone that the world system is currently very broken. Populists don't rise to power while the world is swimming along nicely, they rise to power on the back of inequality and hardship.

I agree.

Said similar a few weeks ago. ‘Trumpism’ is symptomatic of a deeper malaise that has taken root in the American consciousness.

Radicalism has its roots in perceived injustices, disenfranchisement, social exclusion and economic hardships. It isn’t all about religion (although religious extremism often becomes the vehicle for radicalised expression).

The MAGA cult that has swept through rural America and the rust belt, isn’t just a marginalised sector of society. It’s nearly half the population, made vulnerable by economic and social exclusion, that is being manipulated and radicalised by the extreme rhetoric of Trumpism.

In particular, Trump’s fear mongering about immigration and his dangerous narratives about the alleged exploitative relationship that he claims now defines America’s relationship with the rest of the global community (eg. burden of immigration, unfair trade deals, NATO contributions, threat of WW3 because of weak American leadership) is oiling the wheels of domestic radicalisation. Furthermore, America’s puritan colonial roots and the self-identity of a nation that conflates the rise of power with moral superiority makes the Country ripe for populist ideology and religious absolutism. A very dangerous combination.

America is in the grip of some kind of psychosis, which in part imo, can be traced back to 9/11 and even earlier, back to that part of the America psyche that saw itself (and still does) as the vanguard of morality in a complex and multicultural world.

 

[Deadly Danson]

 

[herecomesaregular]

So odd that anyone who asks Trump a question just lets him ramble about anything and everything but the question. Don't they have a Paxman over there? Bizarre.

 

[marlowe]

You see, children are the most important thing from conception to 9 months, well maybe 9.5 months now.


. . . . then guns* are the most important thing.

*gun manufacturers and their pals

Yes, he demonstrates more fake concern (because it's certainly not genuine concern) for the lives of those who are yet to be born than he does for the lives of anyone after they are born. He doesn't even bother to demonstrate fake concern for them. He simply doesn't care about human life apart from his own.

People have already died because of him, including some of his own supporters, but he doesn't care. He doesn't care about the lives he puts at risk with his inflammatory comments, which includes the lives of children. He doesn't care about those who have lost their lives serving his so called beloved country (which he doesn't genuinely care about either). He doesn't care about the lives of all the Ukrainians that have been lost, which have included babies and children, with his only emotional response being to show admiration for the actions of his buddy who was responsible for causing those deaths. And he certainly doesn't care about the lives of those Ukrainians which will certainly be lost if he becomes president again.

Its amazing that anyone swallows this bullshit that he cares about the lives of unborn babies. The only thing those lives mean to him are as something he can exploit for his own benefit and self aggrandisement.

And they're the easiest to exploit because they're the only ones who haven't got a voice to object to him using and exploiting them in that way.

 

[Peteinblack]

This is very true. As bizarre as it may seem from the outside, 70 million people in the country share similar views.

Im not a fan of Trump but this should be a wake-up call to everyone that the world system is currently very broken. Populists don't rise to power while the world is swimming along nicely, they rise to power on the back of inequality and hardship.

A tragic irony being that many of these Populists support (and benefit from) the economic policies which have caused this growing inequality and hardship.

However, they convince the victims that the real causes of their poverty and hardships are immigrants, liberals, the 'radical Left', and 'the Woke', and in so doing, divert attention from the role of 40 years of 'neoliberalism' - deregulation, labour market flexibility, weakened trade unions, the unrestrained pursuit of profit, maximising shareholder value, corporate greed, and the power of landlords to charge whatever rents they want for slum properties.

Trump is (or was) a billionaire property tycoon, and here, Farage is a public-school-educated millionaire ex-City trader - the notion that they and their ilk genuinely give a shit about ordinary people paid poverty wages and/or paying exorbitant rents, and having their quality of life further damaged by underfunded or virtually non-existent public services, would be laughable if it wasn't so tragic.

These Populists also have absolute contempt for things like civil liberties, human rights, and the 'rule of law'.

 

[GingerBeerMan]

A tragic irony being that many of these Populists support (and benefit from) the economic policies which have caused this growing inequality and hardship.

However, they convince the victims that the real causes of their poverty and hardships are immigrants, liberals, the 'radical Left', and 'the Woke', and in so doing, divert attention from the role of 40 years of 'neoliberalism' - deregulation, labour market flexibility, weakened trade unions, the unrestrained pursuit of profit, maximising shareholder value, corporate greed, and the power of landlords to charge whatever rents they want for slum properties.

Trump is (or was) a billionaire property tycoon, and here, Farage is a public-school-educated millionaire ex-City trader - the notion that they and their ilk genuinely give a shit about ordinary people paid poverty wages and/or paying exorbitant rents, and having their quality of life further damaged by underfunded or virtually non-existent public services, would be laughable if it wasn't so tragic.

These Populists also have absolute contempt for things like civil liberties, human rights, and the 'rule of law'.

Bang. On.

 

[Mellotron]

There is nothing wrong with posting an opinion and leaving it at that

You're perfectly entitled to post something with no back up or context whatsoever, but equally you can't then complain when it gets pulled apart for having no substance. You are choosing to post strawman comments and arguments, it seems like a waste of your time to me.

Proper, nuanced, valuable, worthwhile debate requires a back and forth of ideas.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

If he's interrupted he will accuse the network of treason, and the owners are probably genuinely concerned.

ABC, for example, is already being presented by Trump as a communist conspiracy station.

That will affect advertising and ABC is a commercial company.

 

[US Seagull]

So HIGNFY is the one UK show I absolutely miss the most. Apparently this is the fourth attempt at a US version, but none of the previous versions have got past a pilot. CNN has apparently ordered an initial ten episode run of this:

‘Comedy thrives in dark times’: is the US ready for Have I Got News for You?

Long-running British comedy is getting another attempt of American version, starting at a difficult political moment

www.theguardian.com

First episode dropped on Friday:



It wasn't great, and certainly nowhere near as good, but it had some good moments. I hope it will improve as the host and the captains (and the guests, and the viewers) get more comfortable with the format (so they don't need to explain every round before the round starts).

I will say I absolutely hated the theme music, which is weirdly like the original theme that has been filtered through AI to make it "distinct". Also not sure why they made the half hour original into an hour long show? But then the UK did the same thing with their latest version of Jeopardy! So...

Also, Trump will absolutely hate this show. If he picks up on it and complains of "Truth" social about it, I'm sure CNN are hoping that it will absolutely blow up.

 

[Seagull on the Hill]