Do you think the JOCKS will vote YES ?

[piersa]

Apparently there are no exit polls.

Well that's slashed on my chips then.

 

[beorhthelm]

It will be an incredibly complex set of negotiations, agreements, treaties and such which is why you can't really state the detail, just the democratic will.

the EU have made some pretty unequivocal statements: Scotland will leave the EU, they will have to reapply as a new nation like everyone else, and they'll have to adopt the Euro as part of that.

 

[Captain Sensible]

GBP up on USD EUR CHF
FTSE UP
Markets not spooked yet....

 

[The Spanish]

Until 2016

there are plenty of precedents for formerly westminster governed administrations retaining the pound, or a pegged version of, or effective currency union for many years after effective independence (in some places more far reaching than what scotland is currently voting for).

i really cannot believe anyone thinks we are gonna stop them using it or not maintaining currency union to some degree for years to come, it utterly baffles me people believe all this guff thats done some much damage to the better together campaign.

 

[Sergei's Celebration]

GBP up on USD EUR CHF
FTSE UP
Markets not spooked yet....

That's because they went long on IronBru and short on Union flags last week.

 

[ofco8]

No they don't. I've seen it many times on the internet and the news in the last couple of weeks saying "we don't want to be ruled by the south of England", "it's those southern tories that are the problem", etc. I don't think they realise quite how much they're opening themselves up to criticism from the more remote parts of Scotland. Northern Shetland is 350 miles from Edinburgh and Lewis/Harris over 200 miles (as the crow flies). Whereas the Scottish borders are circa 270 miles from London, but with much better connections. Not that the location of London is relevant anyway. I can't imagine they'd feel any different if Manchester or Newcastle were the capital!

Agree. What about USA, Canada, Australia. Their capitals are over a 1000 miles away from many of their inhabitants due to the expansive land masses.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

Surprised the EU hasn't come out with an unequivocal statement about where Scotland stands if theirs a yes vote, in fact the whole debate seems to be clouded in mystery.Sadly if their is a NO vote it won't stop the scots whinging it seems to be part of their dna, easier to blame the southern English than sorting it out yourself.

Scotland will be able to apply for membership like any other nation and will be more qualified than many. It will of course loose the benefits such as budget rebates and VAT exemptions it gets as a result of being part of the UK. There is the additional problem that the Spanish at least, for good reasons of their own, will be reluctant to see the Scots sweep in - Spain's prime minister said yesterday that it could take the best part of a decade for Scotland to get into the EU. Salmon disputes this.

We will have the strange situation that the Scots will be out of the EU but will want to be in and the English will be in, and many of them (apparently) will want to be out.

 

[sten_super]

there are plenty of precedents for formerly westminster governed administrations retaining the pound, or a pegged version of, or effective currency union for many years after effective independence (in some places more far reaching than what scotland is currently voting for).

i really cannot believe anyone thinks we are gonna stop them using it or not maintaining currency union to some degree for years to come, it utterly baffles me people believe all this guff thats done some much damage to the better together campaign.

We couldn't stop them using it - we could refuse a currency union. What would realistically happen is that we'd refuse a currency union without costs to Scotland - and those costs would be significant (the BoE holding substantial Scottish funds that can be used to prop up the currency if required). That would blow a hole in Salmond's already ridiculously optimistic budget calculations. So Salmond tried to suggest that the extreme option of a 'free' currency union was the best option, that idea was refuted, and Salmond didn't want to be drawn into a discussion of the potential costs of currency union (of course including loss of the hard-won sovereignty!) and so left himself open to the broadside that he didn't have a viable currency plan.

I would also dispute that it's been a problem for Better Together; I think it's been a massive boon, and the quotes coming from No votes (at least in the Guardian, which I've been following) have extensively mentioned the uncertainty around the currency.

 

[El Sid]

The thing that worries me is Prince Philip. If they vote YES will he be out of a job?

And will the Queen get locked out of Balmoral when they turn it into a local Buckfast sodden Wetherspoons with onsite deep frying facilities?

 

[Captain Sensible]

there are plenty of precedents for formerly westminster governed administrations retaining the pound, or a pegged version of, or effective currency union for many years after effective independence (in some places more far reaching than what scotland is currently voting for).

i really cannot believe anyone thinks we are gonna stop them using it or not maintaining currency union to some degree for years to come, it utterly baffles me people believe all this guff thats done some much damage to the better together campaign.

Its not about trying to stop them, its just that the things they want, tax revenue and spending power etc, are not compatible with retaining the £. Westminster is not prepared to take up the Eurozone model. They can have a new currency pinned to the £ but you need a national bank with which to do it.

 

[larus]

We couldn't stop them using it - we could refuse a currency union. What would realistically happen is that we'd refuse a currency union without costs to Scotland - and those costs would be significant (the BoE holding substantial Scottish funds that can be used to prop up the currency if required). That would blow a hole in Salmond's already ridiculously optimistic budget calculations. So Salmond tried to suggest that the extreme option of a 'free' currency union was the best option, that idea was refuted, and Salmond didn't want to be drawn into a discussion of the potential costs of currency union (of course including loss of the hard-won sovereignty!) and so left himself open to the broadside that he didn't have a viable currency plan.

I would also dispute that it's been a problem for Better Together; I think it's been a massive boon, and the quotes coming from No votes (at least in the Guardian, which I've been following) have extensively mentioned the uncertainty around the currency.

It's not about them using Sterling, it's down to having the Bank Of England acting as the 'Lender Of Last Resort', setting interest rates and the rules for their fiscal position. These are huge issues of Sovereignty, which is surely what the SNP want.

IMO, if they go, then break all links (in terms of institutions/financial). I'm not talking about trade, but they should be treated like Ireland; just another independent state.

However, I do think Salmond has just lied on a lot of the key issues and so much is relying upon voters trusting what he says compared to a lot of other people. I'm sure there has been similar 'poetic license' from the No campaign too.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Please you skirt wearing piss smelling ginger drunks vote yes...your North Sea oil and whiskey won't stop you from being a no mark nation with massive living costs. The only vote you'll have is for a nil point for the remaing uk In the eurovision song conetest.

No wonder they want to be independent from people like you.

 

[sten_super]

It's not about them using Sterling, it's down to having the Bank Of England acting as the 'Lender Of Last Resort', setting interest rates and the rules for their fiscal position. These are huge issues of Sovereignty, which is surely what the SNP want.

Sorry, I thought that was implicit in my post - having the BoE as lender of last resort is precisely what they'd have to pay for. Looking back it was a poor expression on my part - I said 'prop up the currency' when you explain it much better.

I agree with you that, to me at least, the independence case has been muddled (we want independence but we want to be beholden to the Bank of England, oh and to the EU), but I don't think that's the biggest hole in Salmond's argument on currency - it's the fiscal implications.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

The thing that worries me is Prince Philip. If they vote YES will he be out of a job?

And will the Queen get locked out of Balmoral when they turn it into a local Buckfast sodden Wetherspoons with onsite deep frying facilities?

Phil The Greek has never done the washing up because they have servants for that sort of thing. They can't lock Liz out of Balmoral because she owns the gaff (slang for a house in Scotland )

 

[beorhthelm]

I agree with you that, to me at least, the independence case has been muddled (we want independence but we want to be beholden to the Bank of England, oh and to the EU), but I don't think that's the biggest hole in Salmond's argument on currency - it's the fiscal implications.

its not "muddled", its an outright contradiction. there's other policy issues they do this on too. i'm surprised the No campaign didn't make more of this, the practical implications and outcomes, rather than move onto emotional ground where i don't think they have a strong suit.

 

[sten_super]

its not "muddled", its an outright contradiction. there's other policy issues they do this on too. i'm surprised the No campaign didn't make more of this, the practical implications and outcomes, rather than move onto emotional ground where i don't think they have a strong suit.

I've seen a bit of stuff on social media in the past few days along the lines of 'imagine if it was the other way round - if Scotland was already independent, they wouldn't want to join rUK', but it's complete nonsense because that's exactly what they do want, as a staunchly pro-EU nation.

 

[Jim D]

Phil The Greek has never done the washing up because they have servants for that sort of thing. They can't lock Liz out of Balmoral because she owns the gaff (slang for a house in Scotland )

Is that her or the taxpayer?

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

Well that's slashed on my chips then.

Or you could just nod in Sing Li when they say "sorefinger?"

 

[Pavilionaire]

I see the odds for a YES victory are drifting - now 4/1 or 7/2 YES but 1/5 or 1/6 NO.

As for Andy Murray tweeting at 01.08am this morning and encouraging his eligible followers to vote YES, it seems a very strange thing to do for someone who has said he now tries to stay out of politics. Not really the actions of someone who claims he is "proud to be British", quite the opposite in fact. Even stranger that his home is in Surrey.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

Is that her or the taxpayer?

The taxpayers shell out for the repairs