[Politics] Dawn Butler MP

[lawros left foot]

Tony Blair lie.

I think the difference is, most of us were surprised when Blair was lying,now, most of us are surprised when Johnson isn’t.

 

[Is it PotG?]

The only way to defend the indefensible, when backed into a corner, is to claim 'they're all the same' and that you don't participate - WATFORD zero

Toute nation a le gouvernement qu'elle mérite - Joseph de Maistre

I'll wait for the edited version before reading.

 

[razer]

All politicians are liars. It's what they do.

 

[Simster]

I'll wait for the edited version before reading.

He's right though - "they're all the same" is an absolute crock of shit and only someone who would choose a bumbling immoral lying idiot running the country purely because he is a Tory and not Labour would have the front to even say as much.

They absolutely are NOT "all the same". Johnson is just f**king awful.

 

[Arthur]

****ing children the lot of them.

He's a bad man
You can't call him that, say sorry
NO!
Well you aren't allowed to play with the others until you do, go sit on the naughty step

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

All politicians are liars. It's what they do.

They no doubt have all lied at some point.

We mustn't be blinded by the "get out of jail free" card of false equivalence though.

 

[Is it PotG?]

He's right though - "they're all the same" is an absolute crock of shit and only someone who would choose a bumbling immoral lying idiot running the country purely because he is a Tory and not Labour would ever have the front to even say as much.

They absolutely are NOT "all the same". Johnson is just f**king awful.

I disagree, The common cause is not our welfare, safety, development etc etc, it's self serving glory.

Everyday we hear of MPs from all sides claiming £2.88 for a box of paper clips here or £2,500 for a new MacBook Air with surround sound gubbins for their home office.

Self sacrifice, it's the only way to get the electorate onside again.

 

[Simster]

I disagree, The common cause is not our welfare, safety, development etc etc, it's self serving glory.

Everyday we hear of MPs from all sides claiming £2.88 for a box of paper clips here or £2,500 for a new MacBook Air with surround sound gubbins for their home office.

Self sacrifice, it's the only way to get the electorate onside again.

Absolute rubbish. How anyone can accuse someone like Dennis Skinner of "self serving glory" is beyond me. Even Jeremy Corbyn - he spent his entire career making enemies of his own front bench before ludicrously being parachuted into it himself.

As for expenses - this is trivial. The worst culprits were dealt with, they don't get away with expense fiddles and yet we still have 650 MPs.


The bottom line is that you only say this because you support a properly crap, untrustworthy, Tory PM over anyone remotely left wing and you want to feel better about it.

 

[Is it PotG?]

Absolute rubbish. How anyone can accuse someone like Dennis Skinner of "self serving glory" is beyond me. Even Jeremy Corbyn - he spent his entire career making enemies of his own front bench before ludicrously being parachuted into it himself.

As for expenses - this is trivial. The worst culprits were dealt with, they don't get away with expense fiddles and yet we still have 650 MPs.


The bottom line is that you only say this because you support a properly crap, untrustworthy, Tory PM over anyone remotely left wing and you want to feel better about it.

Utter claptrap.

Using Skinner and Corbyn as role models is odd at best. As for Johnson, I've never voted Tory in my life.

The problem is when a discussion turns into 'you think this, and you're wrong. I'm right'.

 

[Simster]

Utter claptrap.

Using Skinner and Corbyn as role models is odd at best. As for Johnson, I've never voted Tory in my life.

The problem is when a discussion turns into 'you think this, and you're wrong. I'm right'.

I'm not using them as role models. I am disputing your crap assertion that they're all the same and are in fact just self-serving. Those are examples of clearly don't fit your stupid narrative.

I don't believe you've never voted Tory. You're forever critical of Labour on here and I've seen you defending Johnson. This "they're all the same" narrative is a good example of that when it's so obviously not true.

 

[Danny Wilson Said]

Most politicians are not exactly liars, but are forced to compromise at every stage - which is the nature of the job. A Kent Tory MP is an acquaintance of mine through mutual friends and although he seems a decent enough bloke in company, I've seen him on TV defending the indefensible and speaking in favour of things I know for a fact he doesn't believe in.

But there surely can never have been such a shower of corrupt, self-serving liars in government as the present gang. Everything they do seems to have one of two aims: to keep themselves in power and to line the pockets of themselves and their already-rich mates. I despised Thatcher and could never have imagined there would be anyone worse. But now there is. At least she stood for something, even if I didn't like it. These people stand for nothing except themselves.

Before yesterday I didn't think much of Dawn Butler. But what she did was the only thing that makes sense in these increasingly desperate times.

 

[Iggle Piggle]

I'd have to disagree with that. We've had some principled politicians of all hues down the years, we really have. Our politicians have actually been the envy of similar nations. You only need to look across the water at France to see evidence of this - they've had absolute corrupt toe rags for years - so bad that the FN gained a foot hold.

It is absolutely laughable that Biggums sees fit to compare Blair to Johnson. When Johnson opens his mouth and it's not a lie, it's complete gibberish. The same cannot be said for Blair. Or Major. Or Thatcher. Or even David Cameron. These people had policies and while they weren't always transparent, you knew what the policy was. Johnson is just inept in every way, including his blatant lying.

I don't entirely blame an ignorant electorate that still look at cuddly fat Boris as if he's a mate and use Labour whataboutery at every turn to excuse appalling Tory leadership. I blame the local Tory constituent offices themselves for purging dissenting but principled people and replacing them with clueless sheep. The result is this: a govt that lies and blusters through everything, and then forces through shit laws and blames everyone else for it. This is truly the worst PM and government I have ever lived through and hope I ever see again.

I always liked the Barack Obama description of the 3 PM's he met :

Blair : Sizzle and Substance
Brown : Subtance
Cameron : Sizzle

God only knows how he'd describe Johnson.

 

[Is it PotG?]

I'm not using them as role models. I am disputing your crap assertion that they're all the same and are in fact just self-serving. Those are examples of clearly don't fit your stupid narrative.

I don't believe you've never voted Tory. You're forever critical of Labour on here and I've seen you defending Johnson. This "they're all the same" narrative is a good example of that when it's so obviously not true.

Nonsense. As for your continued 'voting Tory' assertion, it goes to show how a blinkered, ignorant and assumptive prejudice is prevalent in such discussions. Using words such as 'obviously' also comes across as patronising.

 

[Bladders]

Great thread

The NSC Clownerati shocked that politicians sometimes lie

Naive fools a plenty


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[Billy the Fish]

Not necessarily, but anyone. Without Dawn Butler today people wouldn’t be talking so bluntly about Boris Johnson the liar anywhere outside left-wing Twitter.

I think you overestimate the reach. Just look at this thread, the Labour supporters lap it up just like on Twitter, nobody else cars for it that much.
The Corbyn era proved this sh*t doesn't get you elected, rabble rousers aren't good leaders

 

[franks brother]

 

[Surf's Up]

I can't stand Dawn Butler normally but on this occasion she's 100% spot on and has got the cojones to simultaneously tell it like it is and put two fingers up to the public school common room that is the so called House of Commons

 

[WATFORD zero]

Great thread

The NSC Clownerati shocked that politicians sometimes lie

Naive fools a plenty


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A much more subtle attempt at whataboutery than your friend

They're all the bloody same. Liars and noses in the trough.

One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors - Plato

The only way to defend the indefensible, when backed into a corner, is to claim 'they're all the same' and that you don't participate - WATFORD zero

Toute nation a le gouvernement qu'elle mérite - Joseph de Maistre

However you seem to have hit the nail on the head with your last line

Naive fools a plenty

 

[Bladders]

A nobody on the internet patronizingly telling a highly successful politician of many years standing what she 'needs to learn'

You sound ridiculous.

Anyway, my view is that Johnson was found to have deliberatelly lied, by the highest court in the country to the Commons, to the Citizens of the UK and to the Queen. So she's on very solid ground. She has stated clearly and publicly what everyone knows to be true but the current, spineless, opposition leaders don't have the balls to say.

Ducking and diving, avoiding answering questions and the use of weasel words by politicians have been normal for a long time in this country. But the Cummings/Johnson strategy of deliberately and knowingly using outright lies to gain and hold on to power and then the refusing to take accountability when caught out has been a worrying shift in tactics and there is a danger we have all become so cynical that it that it no longer raises the anger it would have done in the past. So Dawn Butler has highlighted this deliberately and provocatively. And it has worked just fine.

A clever move by a clever woman.

Edit: For purpose of accuracy, it was the Scottish Court of Sessions that was explicit that Johnson lied. The Supreme Court stopped short of saying that explicitly, but made it clear that they did not believe the reasons he gave for prorogation of parliament and that 'no justification for taking action with such an extreme effect has been put before the court' - which is effectively accusing him of lying.

We’re all nobodies on the internet

Including you petal


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[Charlies Shinpad]

The biggest Liar was Blair. He got away with it somehow at a cost of thousands of innocent lives

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