Garage_Doors
Originally the Swankers
Are you sure about that fact
London is the most camera-ed (is that a word
) in the world it would be impossible to drive uninsured undetected.
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Cyclist fatalities in London - what's going on?
- Thread starter Bry Nylon
- Start date
Are you sure about that fact
London is the most camera-ed (is that a word
) in the world it would be impossible to drive uninsured undetected.
Ceej
Active member
Estimated that there are now half the number of uninsured cars on the road (don't know about buses and lorries but will be very few) than eight years ago due to ANPR and tougher penalties. Still 1.2 million.
This is just a very unfortunate cluster. Always very sad of course. Drivers and cyclists need to be very aware of each other, use as much common sense as possible at all times and always expect the unexpected. Afraid this isn't always what happens.
This is just a very unfortunate cluster. Always very sad of course. Drivers and cyclists need to be very aware of each other, use as much common sense as possible at all times and always expect the unexpected. Afraid this isn't always what happens.
If only we could pinpoint the attitude that leads to deaths on the road.
There are bad cyclists on the road and bad drivers. Having lived
in London 25 years - I would *never* dare cycle on the road - London ain't
equipped to be a proper cycling city, simple as that. The number of cyclists
(and vehicles I admit) that go through red lights in the West End and City is
staggering.
It seems many of the incidents are left turn - so you cannot
really blame unsighted HGV drivers from colliding with cyclists
who don't have the sense to hang back at a left turn. Very, very
sad - but true.
in London 25 years - I would *never* dare cycle on the road - London ain't
equipped to be a proper cycling city, simple as that. The number of cyclists
(and vehicles I admit) that go through red lights in the West End and City is
staggering.
It seems many of the incidents are left turn - so you cannot
really blame unsighted HGV drivers from colliding with cyclists
who don't have the sense to hang back at a left turn. Very, very
sad - but true.
I would agree with this. I have started cycling to work a recently - partly for a bit of extra exercise, but mostly because I cannot justify driving 2 miles to the office. I have now dropped my cycling to only Fridays - because we shut up shop earlier meaning I can get home before dark. I stick to the rules of the road, wear reflective/high viz and also use lights. Even with all of this, I still don't feel safe cycling through a City in the dark. I never had this worry when I lived in Littlehampton - it is the sheer volume of drivers in the city that puts me off cycling after dark.
Shame, because I do enjoy it.
My one absolute steadfast cycling rule is never, never go up the left side of a HGV. There looks like all the space in the world and, suddenly, as they turn it is swallowed up. An absolute death trap. Some cyclists don't seem to be aware of this danger.
I agree about the HGV thing, I adopt the same approach with buses.
The worst part of my journey is joining the main road as I leave the business park I work on. The traffic gets bad on the access road and some drivers seem to resent the fact I am able to overtake them. Once they join the main road and catch up to me, some seem to deliberately pass very close, nearly pushing me off the road.
Fair bit of truth in this. It's all very well Boris asking that we cycle but he needs to put some money into the system. I cycle to work every day, it's only 1.5 miles but I cycle through the centre of Berlin and I do not use a single road and I have dedicated cycle traffic lights for my cycle lane. I also have a choice of numerous cycle racks up and down the road outside my office to chain my bike up.
I also believe there needs to be a huge change in mindset. I rarely if ever see the agression, territorial nonsense and out and out impatience you see all the time on UK roads and pavements. Trams, cars, cyclists and pedestrians all seem to get on when using the same spaces.
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I think this is where the debate needs to be had really. I really don't think London is any worse than many big European Cities actually. I've cycled through Amsterdam, Paris and Brussels - all the biggest cities in their respective nations, all in nations where the national cycle network is FAR superior to here, yet the cities themselves were woeful from a cyclist point of view.
The Spanish
Well-known member
Are you sure about that fact
London is the most camera-ed (is that a word
hahaha yeah cameras stop people driving uninsured if you like mate.
why would it be impossible just because of some cameras. someone has to check every plate on that camera refer that back to the dvla etc etc etc. times that by the millions of vehicles in london and the man hours to do that would bankrupt the country. you havent really thought about this.
lewisham and southwark recently had a clampdown and caught hundreds of people. but only by the police stopping them physically. cameras stop people driving uninsured? hahahaha mental. yeah i just believe this this has no basis in fact hahaha.
Amsterdam never struck me as having woeful cycling facilities? Cannot speak for Paris or Brussels.
The Spanish
Well-known member
i disagree totally. a large part if not the majority of central london was laid out pre-car era, its not designed for cars, not bikes.
Are you saying it is not designed for cars and not designed for bikes?
The Spanish
Well-known member
a lot of it is designed for carts.
dougdeep
New member
They had this debate on one of the morning programs and what annoys me are the people that come up with irrelevant facts. One said that there were far fewer deaths in Paris than London. Well it's hardly surprising as Paris is a quarter of the size and isn't really an industrial city, nor does it have a financial hub in it's centre.
The Spanish
Well-known member
ifparis had as many cyclists as london the death toll would be horrific. the way the french drive is shameful, anti social selfish and vile. in general.
Having cycled there 4 times in a 5 year period, it really isn't all that. Cobbled streets, poorly signed, trams - all in stark contrast to the Dutch national cycling network which is utterly superb.
Small parts of London are. And maybe there is little which can be done; I rarely subscribe to this idea though...my thinking is that in almost all cases and with most things you can make improvements with some smart thinking and an open mind. But equally there are quite huge swathes across all parts of London which could and should be re-designed and improved.
Fair enough. I have peddled around the 'dam three times and did not find it 'woeful' as you described.
This is true, infrastructure plays a key part.
I work in London and see clashes between cyclists and other road users every single day. I've seen driving that is nothing short of appalling, but I've also seen cyclists with apparently no respect for the laws of the road or self awareness - In all honestly they're both as bad as each other. Both these factors combined with a fairly shocking cycle lane infrastructure is what's down to the shocking statistics were seeing inregard to cycle injuries and deaths.