Cullip to Sheff Utd

[Set of Tracksuits]

Losing Cullip will be a huge blow I think, he organises the defence better than anyone, and I think we really miss him when he doesn't play (Blackpool away last season anyone?)

But, no one player is bigger or more important than the survival of the club and if we HAVE to sell him then that's just the way it has to be. If there was some financial saviour waiting in the wings to rescue the club and the current board were preventing that from happening then I would have an issue with that, but there isn't so we'll just have to let them get on with it.

 

[Stinky Kat]

We still have the best group of young players coming through that we have had in years and i believe we are well covered at CB

We said that in 2002 - 2003 and were relegated

 

[Lammy]

We had a short fall of £2m correct?

A&K have raised about £250k correct?

Currie sale has raised £250k correct?

Spurs game will raise about £300k correct?

This means we now have a shortfall of approximately £1.2m correct?

Now this is the bit I don't understand. £1.2m is a shit load of momey to the likes of you and I. However, in the world of big business it is a drop in the ocean.

The stadium was down to cost £48m with adjustments for inflation I reckon it will be more like £55m. £1.2m is only 2% of this investment. Where is the board going to get £55m from if is cannot raise £1.2m?

Surely some of these investers that Dick has lined up could put up this money to see us through the enquiry? There are a lot of people out there that stand to lose some big contracts if Brighton goes out of business before it crosses the finishing line. It makes sense for them to help us out a bit now.

or am I just being a prick?

 

[Marc]

We had a short fall of £2m correct?

A&K have raised about £250k correct?

Currie sale has raised £250k correct?

Spurs game will raise about £300k correct?

This means we now have a shortfall of approximately £1.2m correct?

Now this is the bit I don't understand. £1.2m is a shit load of momey to the likes of you and I. However, in the world of big business it is a drop in the ocean.

The stadium was down to cost £48m with adjustments for inflation I reckon it will be more like £55m. £1.2m is only 2% of this investment. Where is the board going to get £55m from if is cannot raise £1.2m?

Surely some of these investers that Dick has lined up could put up this money to see us through the enquiry? There are a lot of people out there that stand to lose some big contracts if Brighton goes out of business before it crosses the finishing line. It makes sense for them to help us out a bit now.

or am I just being a prick?

but we are going to the inquiry anyway, investors will wait until theres a definate green light before handing over substantial amounts of cash...its just common sense. Otherwise they may put alot into us now only for JP to say no and they will be out of pocket. Thats my take on that situation anyway!

 

[The Large One]

The stadium was down to cost £48m with adjustments for inflation I reckon it will be more like £55m. £1.2m is only 2% of this investment. Where is the board going to get £55m from if is cannot raise £1.2m?

Surely some of these investers that Dick has lined up could put up this money to see us through the enquiry? There are a lot of people out there that stand to lose some big contracts if Brighton goes out of business before it crosses the finishing line. It makes sense for them to help us out a bit now.

or am I just being a prick?

You may be working on an assumption that we are definitely getting Falmer. Who is going to throw money at an enterprise with no guaranteed future?

Oh bloody hell Crabbers, too quick for me again.

 

[Mustela Furo]

investors will wait until theres a definate green light before handing over substantial amounts of cash...its just common sense. Otherwise they may put alot into us now only for JP to say no and they will be out of pocket. Thats my take on that situation anyway!

A fair reading in my opinion

 

[Dave the OAP]

I know this may sound a bit bizzare to non financial people, but does it actually matter that we are 2mill in debt?

Presumably we are covering our current liabilities, or we would be insolvent? There is no suggestion whatsoever that we are insolvent...every business operates under some sort of debt. I assume our bankers will continuing financing this debt ( or certainly the interest on it) I appreciate we have no asset base for the banks to accept as collateral, so presumably the loans of the directors and the shareholding is taken as collaterall?

When Falmer is accepted in ...whenever next year, then there will be a release of funds from whoever has been approached to finance the club once we will have a firm statement of intent to build.

Or are we saying...and this is pure speculation, that all our current funding is going on Falmer application ( hence no money for Players) and when Falmer is accepted all our funding will go on the stadium being built? If so where is the money for players going to come from?



I wonder if we are "clearing the decks" ?

 

[Lammy]

But are we definitely going to the enquiry? If the tax office demands their loot and the creditors that are 'screaming' for their loot finally snap. We could well be out of business before during or very shortly after the enquiry. Irrespective of the decision.

I would have thought that these investers must have shelved this money so that it is there when we need it. They could well use this money to better affect by pulling out. The Falmer stadium will be a huge cash boost to a lot of firms and contractors. Say we leave £200k fot the fans to pay and split the £1m across every potential invester. It isn't a huge amount to cover. Not when you consider the £55m payout. You could even call it a deposit!

 

[Lammy]

I know this may sound a bit bizzare to non financial people, but does it actually matter that we are 2mill in debt?

Presumably we are covering our current liabilities, or we would be insolvent? There is no suggestion whatsoever that we are insolvent...every business operates under some sort of debt. I assume our bankers will continuing financing this debt ( or certainly the interest on it) I appreciate we have no asset base for the banks to accept as collateral, so presumably the loans of the directors and the shareholding is taken as collaterall?

When Falmer is accepted in ...whenever next year, then there will be a release of funds from whoever has been approached to finance the club once we will have a firm statement of intent to build.

Or are we saying...and this is pure speculation, that all our current funding is going on Falmer application ( hence no money for Players) and when Falmer is accepted all our funding will go on the stadium being built? If so where is the money for players going to come from?



I wonder if we are "clearing the decks" ?

Exactely. The company I work for has debt and so do most prem clubs. It just doesn't seem like a big enough debt to make me panic. Although we have few assests I'm sure the ones we do have would clear £1.2m. Which means that no creditor would be panicing for their money.

If the debt was £10m+ then I would be very concerened as we wouldn't stand a chance of clearing that. I'm beginning to wonder if this is a ploy by the club to make us seem more desperate than we really are when it comes to the enquiry.

It just doesn't add up to me. What would have happened if we got a yes from Prescott, not got to the play-offs, not sold Currie and not got a big cup game?

Why weren't these alarm bells ringing earlier? Where did the money come from for Nicolas, Molango, Knight, Jarrett, Claridge etc?

Something just isn't ringing true for me.

 

[Wilts]

There is not a great deal wrong with debt, the problem is when you get the likes of Parmalat, who simply "made up" a $3bn bond which they put in their assets, which in theory means that they were in liquidation.

If the assets of the club are not greater than the firm's debts, then you are in a period of liquidation. BHA can sell the players etc to raise funds, but without much else of "asset" class to sell, £2m is quite a lot...

 

[London Irish]

This means we now have a shortfall of approximately £1.2m correct?

Another point to bear in mind was that the £9 losses since we've got rid of Archer are historic ones.

Simply by existing in the Championship now, we are adding to those losses, so the figure of £2m losses not taken care of by directors' cash will certainly have gone up since the beginning of the season.

That's why Dick Knight has to stick with the current firm financial discipline of our budgets and not give into the siren calls to throw money at new players and make our losses even worse than they already are.

 

[London Irish]

Although we have few assests I'm sure the ones we do have would clear £1.2m.

Really? Name them.

Any debts we have are almost certainly covered by directors' personal guarantees, which is another millstone they have to carry round their necks.

Still, at least the fans appreciate their sacrifice, eh

 

[GUNTER]

If we can beat Spurs and draw Man United away, we won't have to sell him.



Simple!!

 

[Lammy]

Really? Name them.

Any debts we have are almost certainly covered by directors' personal guarantees, which is another millstone they have to carry round their necks.

Still, at least the fans appreciate their sacrifice, eh

You obviously don't rate our squad much. I reckon we could clear £1.2m if we sold EVERY player. Plus some second hand furniture from the office...

You also assume that I want money spent on players? not sure where you got this from as I'm one of the few people on here that has openly said I don't.

I also appreciate the burden the current board has to bear and salute them.

I'm questioning the seriousness and timeing of all this.

 

[Lord Bracknell]

Much of the investment in Falmer will be ring-fenced in a way that prevents it being made available in advance of planning permission being given.

For example, the stadium project qualifies for economic development grants from SEEDA, the South East England Regional Development Agency - subject to the location of the stadium being in line with SEEDA's objectives to promote economic development where it is most needed.

SEEDA's money is public (taxpayers') money. They have a duty to spend it on projects that bring a public benefit in line with SEEDA's responsibilities. There is an audit trail. SEEDA cannot stump up the cash if planning consent might not be forthcoming. They certainly can't stump up the cash and sit back while the Albion uses it to buy a replacement for Danny Cullip.

Most of the funding for Falmer will be in the form of long term loans (ie mortgages). Mortgage lenders don't "shelve" money for future loans (in the way that Lammy suggests). They lend uncommitted funds to other borrowers. But that doesn't mean they won't back other worthwhile projects that come along later. They will not, however, fund the hopes of potential borrowers. Again, once we have got the planning permission, we can include the costs of getting it in the spending that will be funded from the loan.

Provided we get planning permission, the project will be secure and funded. But ... if Dick Knight is seen NOW as being the sort of football club chairman who throws money he hasn't got at something as short-term as survival in the Championship, it may well turn out that the big lenders wouldn't trust him with a mortgage loan.

 

[Stinky Kat]

That would mean focusing on the playing side

 

[Lammy]

Much of the investment in Falmer will be ring-fenced in a way that prevents it being made available in advance of planning permission being given.

For example, the stadium project qualifies for economic development grants from SEEDA, the South East England Regional Development Agency - subject to the location of the stadium being in line with SEEDA's objectives to promote economic development where it is most needed.

SEEDA's money is public (taxpayers') money. They have a duty to spend it on project that have a public benefit in line with SEEDA's responsibilities. There is an audit trail. SEEDA cannot stump up the cash if planning consent might not be forthcoming. They certainly can't stump up the cash and sit back while the Albion uses it to buy a replacement for Danny Cullip.

Most of the funding for Falmer will be in the form of long term loans (ie mortgages). Mortgage lenders don't "shelve" money for future loans (in the way that Lammy suggests). They lend uncommitted funds to other borrowers. But that doesn't mean they won't back other worthwhile projects that come along later. They will not, however, fund the hopes of potential borrowers. Again, once we have got the planning permission, we can include the costs of getting it in the spending that will be funded from the loan.

Provided we get planning permission, the project will be secure and funded. But ... if Dick Knight is seen NOW as being the sort of football club chairman who throws money he hasn't got at something as short-term as survival in the Championship, it may well turn out that the big lenders wouldn't trust him with a mortgage loan.

So basically we don't have any invester lined up. We have a promise of a mortgage letter? A bit like I had to get before I could buy my house. got cha.

Whilst I don't think it is necessarily wise to throw money around for players, I don't think it could be held against Dick Knight if he made £250k on Currie and spent £50k on a replacement. Leaving £200k to repay some debt. Especially when you consider the three sets of wages he has saved and the payout from Spurs that we can expect.

I just don't think that this situation can possibly be as bad as it is being made out to be.

 

[3gulls]

Ferret's comments on the black hole

So the "Ferret" is now DK's mouthpiece is he? I thought he was supposed to be independent.

 

[Lord Bracknell]

So the "Ferret" is now DK's mouthpiece is he? I thought he was supposed to be independent.

When Ferret wants to be truly independent, he has his outlets.

But I doubt if Ferret would want to post something on the official website about the Club's financial situation without being absolutely certain that the Club was comfortable with what he was saying.

No different from Insider's responses on "Ask The Club".

 

[3gulls]

Exactely. The company I work for has debt and so do most prem clubs. It just doesn't seem like a big enough debt to make me panic. Although we have few assests I'm sure the ones we do have would clear £1.2m. Which means that no creditor would be panicing for their money.

If the debt was £10m+ then I would be very concerened as we wouldn't stand a chance of clearing that. I'm beginning to wonder if this is a ploy by the club to make us seem more desperate than we really are when it comes to the enquiry.

It just doesn't add up to me. What would have happened if we got a yes from Prescott, not got to the play-offs, not sold Currie and not got a big cup game?

Why weren't these alarm bells ringing earlier? Where did the money come from for Nicolas, Molango, Knight, Jarrett, Claridge etc?

Something just isn't ringing true for me.

Nor me. I suspect that Directors or Ex-Directors are trying to withdraw their loans. Perhapse to recover their position as they are now less confident of getting Falmer.