[News] Craig Mackey , cowardly copper

[Weststander]

I think the majority of posters on this site are disappointed with a top copper not getting out of his motor when a colleague was being stabbed. Why you have felt the need to call out "NSC’s keyboard brave men" is beyond me. You've made your point several times, I think it's fair to say we understand your view (for crying out loud you have made it enough times) maybe agree to disagree without resorting to insults?

Playing to the gallery.

 

[Questions]

This is the story that concerns me most:
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/metr...ere-in-place-outside-westminster-8003104/amp/

On a side note, our enemies must be gutted that they were so close to murdering the acting commissioner of the Metropolitan Police, if he’d had left his car and got killed; what a coup for the extremists it could have been!

I wouldn’t and I suspect no right minded poster would see any difference between a senior officer or a normal constable if there was a fatality. As to having a view on what the murdering fanatics think about ‘missing an opportunity. Well surely we have given up trying to get inside their warped minds. S

 

[NooBHA]

My God, I didn't really expect 20 pages on this thread but it really is a divided Topic.

My earlier responses surprised even me because I am critical of how he dealt with it but I have and still can honestly understand that fear got the better of the man. That coupled with the fact that the guy is around 60 years old now. He probably hasn't been called into physical action for probably 10 years or more now. Maybe more. He more than likely isn't capable of that sort of challenge any more.

That doesn't mean that I can't criticise his actions......................I can't support his actions but I can't condemn a man in his 60s either - So I think he needs to bow out from his position but I think he has to bow out with a slight cloud under his reputation and I think that's only fair given his failings in this instance. Perhaps if the same '' him '' was still 30 years old, then things may have turned out differently for him

 

[Charlies Shinpad]

My God, I didn't really expect 20 pages on this thread but it really is a divided Topic.

My earlier responses surprised even me because I am critical of how he dealt with it but I have and still can honestly understand that fear got the better of the man. That coupled with the fact that the guy is around 60 years old now. He probably hasn't been called into physical action for probably 10 years or more now. Maybe more. He more than likely isn't capable of that sort of challenge any more.

That doesn't mean that I can't criticise his actions......................I can't support his actions but I can't condemn a man in his 60s either - So I think he needs to bow out from his position but I think he has to bow out with a slight cloud under his reputation and I think that's only fair given his failings in this instance. Perhaps if the same '' him '' was still 30 years old, then things may have turned out differently for him

Good post but age isnt a factor when your oppo is down
Adrenaline and Instinct and training should kick in whatever age you are and especially in this case, just distract the bloke anything but sit there and watch a man die

Sent from my EML-L09 using Tapatalk

 

[Return of the Rev]

just listen to yourself , your attitude is EVERYTHING that is wrong with modern society , "what was he supposed to do without equipment" , jesus wept how did we get to this point when the first thought when seeing a comrade fatally attacked is what equipment is available

He had a car which seems adequate for terrorist, was it not possible to run him over?

 

[Bold Seagull]

Good post but age isnt a factor when your oppo is down
Adrenaline and Instinct and training should kick in whatever age you are and especially in this case, just distract the bloke anything but sit there and watch a man die.

Isn't a primary part of training to prevent adrenaline influencing you to making rash decisions. Situation training is about assessment, calculation, risk management, and making the best possible decisions under intense pressure or danger.

Mahmood didn't need distracting, he'd already stabbed Palmer before Mackay knew what had happened, he was going toward the car, he was shot very shortly after and hurt no one else as no one else was in danger at that point as everyone else had fled. The only additional target and victim Mahmood would have had was whoever exited that car.

 

[darkwolf666]

Isn't a primary part of training to prevent adrenaline influencing you to making rash decisions. Situation training is about assessment, calculation, risk management, and making the best possible decisions under intense pressure or danger.

Mahmood didn't need distracting, he'd already stabbed Palmer before Mackay knew what had happened, he was going toward the car, he was shot very shortly after and hurt no one else as no one else was in danger at that point as everyone else had fled. The only additional target and victim Mahmood would have had was whoever exited that car.

Do please stop talking sense, very unbecoming of NSC...

 

[mejonaNO12 aka riskit]

NSC. Britain's BRAVEST board.

 

[Aveacarlin']

Isn't a primary part of training to prevent adrenaline influencing you to making rash decisions. Situation training is about assessment, calculation, risk management, and making the best possible decisions under intense pressure or danger.

Mahmood didn't need distracting, he'd already stabbed Palmer before Mackay knew what had happened, he was going toward the car, he was shot very shortly after and hurt no one else as no one else was in danger at that point as everyone else had fled. The only additional target and victim Mahmood would have had was whoever exited that car.

Quite possibly the most rational post on this thread.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

 

[Weststander]

The solicitor representing the widow of Keith Palmer was interviewed on 5Live this evening.

They said Keith would almost certainly be alive now, if it hadn't been for a major cock-up by both Met armed officers on that shift and their immediate superiors. The very clear protocol was that the armed officers (who appeared too late and dispatched the scum), should've been at the gate with Keith Palmer the entire time. In error, they were patrolling the entire yard. This was also made plain in the inquest.

This explains the foolishness of having no armed officers at the gates of a key target in a war.

 

[sams dad]

I was working at the home of a recently retired police detective today, and he was very angry about Mackey's cowardice ( his word) , and said that if a junior police officer had acted in that way he would have been hung out to dry.

 

[Boys 9d]

The Coronor's viewpoint copied from BBC web site

"Summing up the evidence he also said a senior policeman who witnessed the murder of PC Palmer from a locked car, staying inside because he had no protective equipment, had not been to blame.
Mr Lucraft said it was clear there was nothing Sir Craig Mackay, who was the Met's acting chief at the time, could have done to stop the killer.
"Even if he had got out of the car, it was clear from the CCTV evidence he would not have reached PC Palmer before Masood inflicted his fatal wounds," he said.
Ms Dick said there had been an "extraordinary amount of confused, unpleasant, personalised and ignorant commentary" about Sir Craig's actions.
"The attack in New Palace Yard occurred and was stopped in seconds. Sir Craig had absolutely no opportunity to stop the killer or save PC Palmer. Anyone who suggests otherwise is simply wrong."

 

[vegster]

How can he honestly show his face in public , he watched one of his own stabbed to death and did nothing except lock himself in his car , gutless tosser

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ckey-met-police-inquests-latest-a8574676.html

Should have got out of his car and run over and got stabbed earning ISIS/ Al quaida or whatever a HUGE propaganda coup on a plate.

 

[Super Steve Earle]

The Coronor's viewpoint copied from BBC web site

"Summing up the evidence he also said a senior policeman who witnessed the murder of PC Palmer from a locked car, staying inside because he had no protective equipment, had not been to blame.
Mr Lucraft said it was clear there was nothing Sir Craig Mackay, who was the Met's acting chief at the time, could have done to stop the killer.
"Even if he had got out of the car, it was clear from the CCTV evidence he would not have reached PC Palmer before Masood inflicted his fatal wounds," he said.
Ms Dick said there had been an "extraordinary amount of confused, unpleasant, personalised and ignorant commentary" about Sir Craig's actions.
"The attack in New Palace Yard occurred and was stopped in seconds. Sir Craig had absolutely no opportunity to stop the killer or save PC Palmer. Anyone who suggests otherwise is simply wrong."

Good. End of a thoroughly scurrilous nasty thread.

 

[Questions]

Should have got out of his car and run over and got stabbed earning ISIS/ Al quaida or whatever a HUGE propaganda coup on a plate.

Or locked his car door and sped off as quick as he possibly could so giving us the edge in the fight.

 

[vegster]

I was working at the home of a recently retired police detective today, and he was very angry about Mackey's cowardice ( his word) , and said that if a junior police officer had acted in that way he would have been hung out to dry.

I heard about a group of retired ex high ranking police officers the other day and they had got together to try to pressurise the government to increase funding as they say that police forces today are not fulfilling their duties to protect and investigate crime.

 

[afcb]

.

 

[The Clamp]

Just out of interest, and I know it’s only anecdotal but question to all the NSC members who have been caught up in a terrorist attack. What did you do and why did you come to that decision?
Reckon it’d be good to hear from those on here that have actually been there.

 

[Weststander]

The Coronor's viewpoint copied from BBC web site

"Summing up the evidence he also said a senior policeman who witnessed the murder of PC Palmer from a locked car, staying inside because he had no protective equipment, had not been to blame.
Mr Lucraft said it was clear there was nothing Sir Craig Mackay, who was the Met's acting chief at the time, could have done to stop the killer.
"Even if he had got out of the car, it was clear from the CCTV evidence he would not have reached PC Palmer before Masood inflicted his fatal wounds," he said.
Ms Dick said there had been an "extraordinary amount of confused, unpleasant, personalised and ignorant commentary" about Sir Craig's actions.
"The attack in New Palace Yard occurred and was stopped in seconds. Sir Craig had absolutely no opportunity to stop the killer or save PC Palmer. Anyone who suggests otherwise is simply wrong."

An inconvenient truth.

 

[The Clamp]

I don't think anyone is suggesting 'Sir Craig' could have saved PC Palmer (hindsight is great - he might have ) or single handedly disarmed him.The decision to lock his car door and instruct his civilian driver to leave the scene is probably unprecedented in policing history and yes he will take that to his grave....and so he should.

No one in Uniform can be blamed for backing off in a situation like this but driving off away from the scene is something completely alien, so off the scale it simply cannot be comprehended or accepted.

Hopefully there's something in the discipline code nowadays to nail this guy so he can take that to his grave as well.

Senior figure driven away by CP at speed from a highly dangerous situation? No, never happened before.