Coaching & Football Operations

[Seagull by the Sea]

Here's the thing. Nobody is indispensable at the club. Nobody.

Every fan has a right to question how good/bad somebody is. The best way to do that for us who aren't "in the know" is by judging what we know is happening on and off the pitch.

- Playing (largely) great football with average championship players
- 1 game away from FA Cup Quarter Finals
- EIGHTH in the Championship
- An owner with a focus on sustainability rather than immediate success

For me, we've been more attacking this year. We've been LESS clueless and more purposeful when in possession. The problems that I see we have are that we don't quite have the caliber of players and squad size needed to really challenge the big boys of this league. There are some huge names in this league. All things considered, I think the coaching staff have done a great job considering the amount of injuries we've had this year.

That said, I think you can question why:

- We've made more than one totally crap signing this year?
- How come we can't play 90 minutes at a consistently high level?
- Why is only Leo scoring?

I don't think there's a need for all of the doom mongering on here since last night, but these questions do need to be answered. Can we do better? Yes. Of course we can. Should people be fired? I don't know. Only if somebody better can replace them I guess... and I think we've got quite a good thing going with the team we have here. We just need to be patient and give them time. If, after another season (or two) we're clearly not making progress, then maybe we can really start having IN/OUT polls. But until then, let's just leave these problems to the professionals to solve and not adopt the same old "1/2 a season to prove yourself" that everybody else seems to be doing.

Excellent Post!

I am definitely not a ' doom and gloom merchant' and I firmly believe Oscar has worked wonders this season (all my previous posts will back me up) but I wanted to raise some questions, for debate, about the support he has and whether it is good enough for him to really achieve all that I believe he is capable of.

Like many on this forum I have supported our club and attended matches all the way through the Goldstone, Gillingham and Withdean and I trust TB totally but I believe I am entitled to air my views on Burke and NJ on here for discussion without the need for this thread to be about 'blame' 'doom and gloom' or 'personal'. If we all agreed about everything life would be pretty damn boring!

 

[Pavilionaire]

There are times when us fans only have certain amount of information to work with, and there are times when we have almost no information. We see the end product on the field, we are not privy to what goes on behind the scenes. The bottom line is that until Oscar, Jones and Burke have a full summer transfer window and pre-season they cannot be properly judged.

On a general point about Directors Of Football, I actually think they are more necessary now with FFP than they have ever been. Managers want the best players and will ask for players the club can't afford. The Director Of Football is there to work with the board and the manager so that the whole thing can work within budget. If you do away with this position then the manager and the board are on a collision course. This is pretty much what happened with Gus and Bloom. Yes, we DID hit the ceiling, and if we'd have spent any more on expensive high salary players we'd have been fvcked this year under FFP with high wages and amortisation of transfer fees.

You only have to look at Pompey to see what havoc can be wreaked with a dominant manager and weak board. He requested and was given players that that club should never have been able to sign. I don't blame Redknapp for asking, I blame the board for granting him his wishes.

 

[HAILSHAM SEAGULL]

I have read a lot of negative comments about Nathan Jones and David Burke recently so thought I'd start a thread to deal with both at the same time.

Regarding Burke, there is, I believe, a strong case for his position to be reviewed now. You only have to look at other clubs who had a 'Director of Football' or similar to see that it simply does not work.

Wise at Newcastle, Kinnear at Newcastle, Comolli at Spurs & Liverpool, also names I've forgotten at Spurs (again), Chelsea (pre Mourinho), Sunderland (during Di Cannio's term). The facts are simple; these guys are judged by the quality of the signings they initially scout, watch and make judgements on for their 'Head Coaches' to choose from.

In Burke's case the signings have been very poor. I know Oscar has the final say but he needs to have faith in Burke and his scouts judgements that the players he is choosing from are good enough for the first team. This is especially crucial for a manager who is new to the English leagues and is relying heavily on the right information being given to him.

Worryingly, Burke also appears unable to hold onto our better players or at least negotiate full market value for them if they want to go. Bridcutt certainly should have had a % sell on clause attached to him which does not seem to have been done?

Burke's remit is simple and like all of us in our own workplace, he is judged by his results and they do not appear to be good at all. He obviously recommended Lita and Obika FFS.

The other side of the coin is coaching and this is where Nathan Jones comes in. Is he getting the best out of our players? How many started the season ok and have now regressed? Andrews has definitely looked worse recently, David looks completely useless compared to last season, Buckley and LuaLua are not the same even taking into account their injuries. Are we sure that the coaching is up to scratch, is motvational and designed to get the best out of each and every player?

My personal view is that Burke must go and Oscar's title should become 'Manager'. You only have to look at Ferguson and Wenger to see that managers who buy what they feel they need and make the decision themselves as to who to buy generally are successful. Even the gobshite at Forest seems to be able to continually buy the players HE wants based on his own judgement.

Either the club trusts Oscar or they don't.

I think Jones is not experienced enough and therefore not ready to be a 'No 2' at a club that has the sort of ambitions we have.

In Oscar I trust but he is being badly let down by his support team.

Discuss!

Out of curiosity, what is your job/career/qualifications?

 

[spring hall convert]

I have read a lot of negative comments about Nathan Jones and David Burke recently so thought I'd start a thread to deal with both at the same time.

Regarding Burke, there is, I believe, a strong case for his position to be reviewed now. You only have to look at other clubs who had a 'Director of Football' or similar to see that it simply does not work.

Wise at Newcastle, Kinnear at Newcastle, Comolli at Spurs & Liverpool, also names I've forgotten at Spurs (again), Chelsea (pre Mourinho), Sunderland (during Di Cannio's term). The facts are simple; these guys are judged by the quality of the signings they initially scout, watch and make judgements on for their 'Head Coaches' to choose from.

In Burke's case the signings have been very poor. I know Oscar has the final say but he needs to have faith in Burke and his scouts judgements that the players he is choosing from are good enough for the first team. This is especially crucial for a manager who is new to the English leagues and is relying heavily on the right information being given to him.

Worryingly, Burke also appears unable to hold onto our better players or at least negotiate full market value for them if they want to go. Bridcutt certainly should have had a % sell on clause attached to him which does not seem to have been done?

Burke's remit is simple and like all of us in our own workplace, he is judged by his results and they do not appear to be good at all. He obviously recommended Lita and Obika FFS.

The other side of the coin is coaching and this is where Nathan Jones comes in. Is he getting the best out of our players? How many started the season ok and have now regressed? Andrews has definitely looked worse recently, David looks completely useless compared to last season, Buckley and LuaLua are not the same even taking into account their injuries. Are we sure that the coaching is up to scratch, is motvational and designed to get the best out of each and every player?

My personal view is that Burke must go and Oscar's title should become 'Manager'. You only have to look at Ferguson and Wenger to see that managers who buy what they feel they need and make the decision themselves as to who to buy generally are successful. Even the gobshite at Forest seems to be able to continually buy the players HE wants based on his own judgement.

Either the club trusts Oscar or they don't.

I think Jones is not experienced enough and therefore not ready to be a 'No 2' at a club that has the sort of ambitions we have.

In Oscar I trust but he is being badly let down by his support team.

Discuss!

"You only have to look at other clubs who had a 'Director of Football' or similar to see that it simply does not work."

False - maybe, just maybe if you wanted to make your case you would have followed it up with "in the British game." There are plenty of examples of this system being the prefered method globally with success as a result.

"In Burke's case the signings have been very poor."

False - There have been some not so good signings but he's been involved in Ince, Upson, Bridge, TK, Ward, Conway, Ulloa, Orlandi, Vicente. In addition it looks like he's building some great preospects in the development team

"Either the club trusts Oscar or they don't."

Have you ever considered that growing up the Barcelona way, Oscar doesn't actually see transfer responsibility as part of his role?

"Worryingly, Burke also appears unable to hold onto our better players or at least negotiate full market value for them if they want to go. Bridcutt certainly should have had a % sell on clause attached to him which does not seem to have been done?"

On a day filled by drivel, this is the most clueless thing I've read today. When you say better players - you mean Bridcutt. A better player, who was being offered the opportunity to play in a system a league above us, on more money, in a better team, for an ex-manager and system he loves playing for/in. What exactly was Burke supposed to do? Let Bridcutt sh*g his wife?

How do you know details of the Bridcutt deal that even the media appear to not be able to get hold of?

The other side of the coin is coaching and this is where Nathan Jones comes in. Is he getting the best out of our players? How many started the season ok and have now regressed? Andrews has definitely looked worse recently, David looks completely useless compared to last season, Buckley and LuaLua are not the same even taking into account their injuries. Are we sure that the coaching is up to scratch, is motvational and designed to get the best out of each and every player?

I'll take your word for it on Andrews, David's been better recently but he hasn't had a good year, perhaps age is catching up with him? Buckley was rubbish for most of last year as well, Lua Lua has probably been better this year than last.

Then what about - Ince, March & Dunk who appear to have come on significantly. The true measure of a coach is the development of the young players and they are developing. FAST

My personal view is that Burke must go and Oscar's title should become 'Manager'. You only have to look at Ferguson and Wenger to see that managers who buy what they feel they need and make the decision themselves as to who to buy generally are successful. Even the gobshite at Forest seems to be able to continually buy the players HE wants based on his own judgement.

And for every Ferguson or Wenger there are 1,000 John Barnes'. Just because they made it work, doesn't mean it's the best way.

 

[The Large One]

I am definitely not a ' doom and gloom merchant' ...

But you've called for the dismissal of David Burke on the back of some spurious considerations which have been put to bed by others.

It may not be the writing of a 'doom and gloom merchant', but it does lack a certain amount of credibility.

 

[Vankleek Hill Seagull]

David Burke is Director of Football Operations, not Director of Football. Two totally different roles.

 

[symyjym]

I have read a lot of negative comments about Nathan Jones and David Burke recently so thought I'd start a thread to deal with both at the same time.

Regarding Burke, there is, I believe, a strong case for his position to be reviewed now. You only have to look at other clubs who had a 'Director of Football' or similar to see that it simply does not work.

Wise at Newcastle, Kinnear at Newcastle, Comolli at Spurs & Liverpool, also names I've forgotten at Spurs (again), Chelsea (pre Mourinho), Sunderland (during Di Cannio's term). The facts are simple; these guys are judged by the quality of the signings they initially scout, watch and make judgements on for their 'Head Coaches' to choose from.

In Burke's case the signings have been very poor. I know Oscar has the final say but he needs to have faith in Burke and his scouts judgements that the players he is choosing from are good enough for the first team. This is especially crucial for a manager who is new to the English leagues and is relying heavily on the right information being given to him.

Worryingly, Burke also appears unable to hold onto our better players or at least negotiate full market value for them if they want to go. Bridcutt certainly should have had a % sell on clause attached to him which does not seem to have been done?

Burke's remit is simple and like all of us in our own workplace, he is judged by his results and they do not appear to be good at all. He obviously recommended Lita and Obika FFS.

The other side of the coin is coaching and this is where Nathan Jones comes in. Is he getting the best out of our players? How many started the season ok and have now regressed? Andrews has definitely looked worse recently, David looks completely useless compared to last season, Buckley and LuaLua are not the same even taking into account their injuries. Are we sure that the coaching is up to scratch, is motvational and designed to get the best out of each and every player?

My personal view is that Burke must go and Oscar's title should become 'Manager'. You only have to look at Ferguson and Wenger to see that managers who buy what they feel they need and make the decision themselves as to who to buy generally are successful. Even the gobshite at Forest seems to be able to continually buy the players HE wants based on his own judgement.

Either the club trusts Oscar or they don't.

I think Jones is not experienced enough and therefore not ready to be a 'No 2' at a club that has the sort of ambitions we have.

In Oscar I trust but he is being badly let down by his support team.

Discuss!

I scanned your post but couldn't be bothered to read it in the end.

Wow! I didn't expect such a backlash so maybe I should answer as much as I can and maybe be clearer in my view...

I didn't mean that the role of DOF was obsolete just that it works for some clubs and not others.

IMO I believe that as Oscar has clearly got a very set way of playing and needs players of a particular type to suit his system, it would work better for him if he had the chance to scout his own players. Now I understand that may not be possible or it may simply be not the way the club want to do it but I believe it would work better. If Burke has other responsibilities then great, I did not mean to say that he should be sacked just not be in control of transfers.

I obviously do not know what terms were agreed for Bridcutt but I have read on here (and maybe I should take it with a pinch of salt) that add ons were to do with staying up etc, not sell ons. Bozza, if you know different then great but it appears you are the only one privy to that info.

Just because Arsenal, Man Utd and Forest pay over the odds, it does not mean that is what they get the players they want. My argument was not to spend lots of money but to highlight that the managers at those clubs pick the players and then their 'team' do the negotiating. Billy Davies made it very clear in the press when he returned, as did their Chairman, that he would be in full control of selecting the players they try to buy and the DOF there then tries to do the deal.

The shelf life of a manager may well be a few years but I still believe, MY opinion, that you either back the manager or you don't and you trust his player choices while he is there or you don't. It cannot be. A councidence that the most successful teams have managers for the long term who select their own players (ie Ferguson & Wenger).

The argument that Bayern Munich etc. do this is an unfair comparison as there is a degree of 'safety' when you are buying a proven, international star but the risk factor increases significantly the less you are paying for the player.

There surely cannot be a single person on here that beleives Oscar chose Obika? He must have trusted the advice of NJ or Burke or both. If Oscar did choose him he would trust him more and play him more wouldn't he? Managers don't tend to give up on players and seldomly play them so quickly after buying them and by not bringing on Obika last night until the 89th minute it appears that Oscar does not believe Obika would have scored the equaliser.

With regards my comments on NJ's coaching; I obviously have not seen them train but I have played football at a decent standard and in MY opinion, I do not believe the way the team plays (at times) points to successful coaching. Sometimes, a coach has to motivate a player before or during games. I saw plenty of that with CO under Gus. I believe that the team look slower this season and almost pedestrian like at times, some players simply do not look as physically fit as they were last season. This can be checked by checking at OPTA stats for their various runs, km covered, acceleration runs etc but again, it is MY opinion and is designed to generate debate but certainly not animosity!

I think I have covered most of the replies but I want to make it clear that I am not trying to be a 'downer', nor am I anti Burke or NJ, I am a supporter of over 30 years and am merely making a personal viewpoint on what I see and believe to be true. It does not mean I cannot accept different viewpoints to my own!

Great discussion so far though!...

Really couldn't be bothered to read it.

 

[KZNSeagull]

Wow! I didn't expect such a backlash so maybe I should answer as much as I can and maybe be clearer in my view...

I didn't mean that the role of DOF was obsolete just that it works for some clubs and not others.

IMO I believe that as Oscar has clearly got a very set way of playing and needs players of a particular type to suit his system, it would work better for him if he had the chance to scout his own players. Now I understand that may not be possible or it may simply be not the way the club want to do it but I believe it would work better. If Burke has other responsibilities then great, I did not mean to say that he should be sacked just not be in control of transfers.

I obviously do not know what terms were agreed for Bridcutt but I have read on here (and maybe I should take it with a pinch of salt) that add ons were to do with staying up etc, not sell ons. Bozza, if you know different then great but it appears you are the only one privy to that info.

Just because Arsenal, Man Utd and Forest pay over the odds, it does not mean that is what they get the players they want. My argument was not to spend lots of money but to highlight that the managers at those clubs pick the players and then their 'team' do the negotiating. Billy Davies made it very clear in the press when he returned, as did their Chairman, that he would be in full control of selecting the players they try to buy and the DOF there then tries to do the deal.

The shelf life of a manager may well be a few years but I still believe, MY opinion, that you either back the manager or you don't and you trust his player choices while he is there or you don't. It cannot be. A councidence that the most successful teams have managers for the long term who select their own players (ie Ferguson & Wenger).

The argument that Bayern Munich etc. do this is an unfair comparison as there is a degree of 'safety' when you are buying a proven, international star but the risk factor increases significantly the less you are paying for the player.

There surely cannot be a single person on here that beleives Oscar chose Obika? He must have trusted the advice of NJ or Burke or both. If Oscar did choose him he would trust him more and play him more wouldn't he? Managers don't tend to give up on players and seldomly play them so quickly after buying them and by not bringing on Obika last night until the 89th minute it appears that Oscar does not believe Obika would have scored the equaliser.

With regards my comments on NJ's coaching; I obviously have not seen them train but I have played football at a decent standard and in MY opinion, I do not believe the way the team plays (at times) points to successful coaching. Sometimes, a coach has to motivate a player before or during games. I saw plenty of that with CO under Gus. I believe that the team look slower this season and almost pedestrian like at times, some players simply do not look as physically fit as they were last season. This can be checked by checking at OPTA stats for their various runs, km covered, acceleration runs etc but again, it is MY opinion and is designed to generate debate but certainly not animosity!

I think I have covered most of the replies but I want to make it clear that I am not trying to be a 'downer', nor am I anti Burke or NJ, I am a supporter of over 30 years and am merely making a personal viewpoint on what I see and believe to be true. It does not mean I cannot accept different viewpoints to my own!

Great discussion so far though!...

Oscar does have a set way of playing, correct, but that fits in with the clubs way of wanting to play.

I am not sure what the difference is of Oscar scouting his players and the club scouting for players? The club's objective is the same - to recruit players who can play the way the club want to play - it just so happens that Oscar is the coach at the moment but as we all know, that can change. The club's objectives remain the same though - to play possession football in a, for want of a better expression, Barcelona type style.

As for signings - Burke alone does not have the final word on who gets signed. As far as I am aware, it is a team effort, from the scouts to identify targets, through to David Burke to negotiate the deals to Oscar and NJ to coach them to the board to ratify the deal. We know that Oscar is involved in this process, from determining the type of player required right the way through to talking to them before signing to ensure that they will fit in with what he/the club wants. What he may not necessarily do is physically go out and scout all his targets in the flesh as it were.

What we have no evidence of is players being thrust upon Oscar that he does not want. If the process is failing, then yes it is ultimately David Burke's responsibility, but any link in the chain could have got things wrong, from the scouts right through to the coaching staff.

Forgive me if I am wrong, but David Burke was at the club when the deal to sign Wayne Bridge (possibly the best deal this club will see for MANY years) was finalised. This shows to me that he knows how to strike a great deal.

We are not in the market for signing expensive PL players on PL wages. What we are in the market for is deals like the Wayne Bridge one, which David Burke stated in his interview really is not very common any more. The PL clubs want full wages paid and in some cases, guaranteed starts for their player - we are not going down that route. We are also in the market for deals like the Spanish Rod one - short contracts to prove their worth. If it does not work, we have not lost much - if it does work then we are sitting pretty. The nature of these markets mean that we will sign some duffers, but we will also uncover some gems. I would rather the club did that than spend a fortune on a failing PL player, breaking our wage structure in the process.

Also, the signings made for the Development Squad, which is the long term future of this club, seem to be excellent and we are starting to see the fruits of that now with Ince and Solly.

Anyway, this is a ramble now. In summary, we play the Brighton way with a coach that knows how to play that way and the entire team at the club finds and tries to sign players that fit that style. As Matthew Upson himself said last week, you do not sign for a manager, you sign for a club and that is why he is here.

 

[JCL - the new kid in town]

I have read a lot of negative comments about Nathan Jones and David Burke recently so thought I'd start a thread to deal with both at the same time.

Regarding Burke, there is, I believe, a strong case for his position to be reviewed now. You only have to look at other clubs who had a 'Director of Football' or similar to see that it simply does not work.

Wise at Newcastle, Kinnear at Newcastle, Comolli at Spurs & Liverpool, also names I've forgotten at Spurs (again), Chelsea (pre Mourinho), Sunderland (during Di Cannio's term). The facts are simple; these guys are judged by the quality of the signings they initially scout, watch and make judgements on for their 'Head Coaches' to choose from.

In Burke's case the signings have been very poor. I know Oscar has the final say but he needs to have faith in Burke and his scouts judgements that the players he is choosing from are good enough for the first team. This is especially crucial for a manager who is new to the English leagues and is relying heavily on the right information being given to him.

Worryingly, Burke also appears unable to hold onto our better players or at least negotiate full market value for them if they want to go. Bridcutt certainly should have had a % sell on clause attached to him which does not seem to have been done?

Burke's remit is simple and like all of us in our own workplace, he is judged by his results and they do not appear to be good at all. He obviously recommended Lita and Obika FFS.

The other side of the coin is coaching and this is where Nathan Jones comes in. Is he getting the best out of our players? How many started the season ok and have now regressed? Andrews has definitely looked worse recently, David looks completely useless compared to last season, Buckley and LuaLua are not the same even taking into account their injuries. Are we sure that the coaching is up to scratch, is motvational and designed to get the best out of each and every player?

My personal view is that Burke must go and Oscar's title should become 'Manager'. You only have to look at Ferguson and Wenger to see that managers who buy what they feel they need and make the decision themselves as to who to buy generally are successful. Even the gobshite at Forest seems to be able to continually buy the players HE wants based on his own judgement.

Either the club trusts Oscar or they don't.

I think Jones is not experienced enough and therefore not ready to be a 'No 2' at a club that has the sort of ambitions we have.

In Oscar I trust but he is being badly let down by his support team.

Discuss!

i think including Wise and Kinnear in your argument ruins it a little bit as they were given those positions as "jobs for the boys" by Ashley, they didn't get them on merit. I cynically think they were employed as for someone reason he wants Pardew to leave but doesn't want to pay to sack him so hired 2 disruptive/useless people in the role above him to make him quit

 

[Bold Seagull]

Oscar does have a set way of playing, correct, but that fits in with the clubs way of wanting to play.

Exactly with bells on. The club appointed a coach that would play their way, not a coach to come in and change everything that is set up through the club right from the kids upwards. This is established through the club so that if we sign a 14 yr old, he is already 'our' type of player.

There seem to be many people who are simply getting hung up on job titles. Both Alex Ferguson and Wenger have exactly the same person as we have in David Burke, only they're called the Chief Scout. In reality, there is little difference other than Burke has a football operations role that looks at all the age groups through the club as well as other responsibilites, whereas a chief scout might only be looking at signings for the first team.

David's responsibilities in close conjunction with the Coach, CEO and Chairman, are listed on his LinkedIn as:
Player and transfer negotiation.
Player budget
Player audits
Scouting and recruitment
Performance analysis
The Academy and player development
Player support services, education, welfare and liaison
Kit management
Women and girls elite football

It seems people need someone to blame on very little knowledge about what is going on behind the scenes.

 

[Seagull by the Sea]

I scanned your post but couldn't be bothered to read it in the end.



Really couldn't be bothered to read it.

Haha, I do tend to write lots!

However, thank you for thorough, detailed and articulated input.

 

[symyjym]

Haha, I do tend to write lots!

However, thank you for thorough, detailed and articulated input.

Sorry that I didn’t have it in me to write an essay back in response to express a view.

 

[Seagull by the Sea]

But you've called for the dismissal of David Burke on the back of some spurious considerations which have been put to bed by others.

It may not be the writing of a 'doom and gloom merchant', but it does lack a certain amount of credibility.

If you read my 2nd post you will see that I clarified that I did not mean to imply he should be sacked.

I'm not here trying to say my view has 'credibility' but it is my view based on what I know. Some people are suggesting that some of my facts are wrong, some are guesswork, some are factual. I accept and take on board everyone's comments as this is a discussion board after all!

 

[Hiney]

I have read a lot of negative comments about Nathan Jones and David Burke recently so thought I'd start a thread to deal with both at the same time.

Regarding Burke, there is, I believe, a strong case for his position to be reviewed now. You only have to look at other clubs who had a 'Director of Football' or similar to see that it simply does not work.

Wise at Newcastle, Kinnear at Newcastle, Comolli at Spurs & Liverpool, also names I've forgotten at Spurs (again), Chelsea (pre Mourinho), Sunderland (during Di Cannio's term). The facts are simple; these guys are judged by the quality of the signings they initially scout, watch and make judgements on for their 'Head Coaches' to choose from.

In Burke's case the signings have been very poor. I know Oscar has the final say but he needs to have faith in Burke and his scouts judgements that the players he is choosing from are good enough for the first team. This is especially crucial for a manager who is new to the English leagues and is relying heavily on the right information being given to him.

Worryingly, Burke also appears unable to hold onto our better players or at least negotiate full market value for them if they want to go. Bridcutt certainly should have had a % sell on clause attached to him which does not seem to have been done?

Burke's remit is simple and like all of us in our own workplace, he is judged by his results and they do not appear to be good at all. He obviously recommended Lita and Obika FFS.

The other side of the coin is coaching and this is where Nathan Jones comes in. Is he getting the best out of our players? How many started the season ok and have now regressed? Andrews has definitely looked worse recently, David looks completely useless compared to last season, Buckley and LuaLua are not the same even taking into account their injuries. Are we sure that the coaching is up to scratch, is motvational and designed to get the best out of each and every player?

My personal view is that Burke must go and Oscar's title should become 'Manager'. You only have to look at Ferguson and Wenger to see that managers who buy what they feel they need and make the decision themselves as to who to buy generally are successful. Even the gobshite at Forest seems to be able to continually buy the players HE wants based on his own judgement.

Either the club trusts Oscar or they don't.

I think Jones is not experienced enough and therefore not ready to be a 'No 2' at a club that has the sort of ambitions we have.

In Oscar I trust but he is being badly let down by his support team.

Discuss!

Ten pounds of bullshit in a five pound bag

 

[Seagull by the Sea]

Sorry that I didn’t have it in me to write an essay back in response to express a view.

Not sure anyone asked you to write an essay?

I will take your response as 'Mickey taking' rather than being rude as you did put a lovely smiley face on the end.

 

[The Large One]

If you read my 2nd post you will see that I clarified that I did not mean to imply he should be sacked.

I'm not here trying to say my view has 'credibility' but it is my view based on what I know. Some people are suggesting that some of my facts are wrong, some are guesswork, some are factual. I accept and take on board everyone's comments as this is a discussion board after all!

There was no implication in your first post; it was crystal clear...

"My personal view is that Burke must go and Oscar's title should become 'Manager'"

... based on how your perceive the set-up is run. Your second post made no reference to reversing that opinion.

As has been stated already, to glean a lot more information, listen to the David Burke interview.

 

[Seagull by the Sea]

Ten pounds of bullshit in a five pound bag

Elequently put Sir!!

Remind me to include you in any future debating teams I'm in. Your input is truly engaging

 

[Seagull by the Sea]

There was no implication in your first post; it was crystal clear...

"My personal view is that Burke must go and Oscar's title should become 'Manager'"

... based on how your perceive the set-up is run. Your second post made no reference to reversing that opinion.

As has been stated already, to glean a lot more information, listen to the David Burke interview.

Yes, I have and yes it did enlighten me further so found that very useful.

I did mean Burke should go in the part of his job where he identifies the players and that Oscar should become 'Manager' in the sense that he identifies his own players but I guess I still did not make myself clear!

 

[Seagull by the Sea]

Exactly with bells on. The club appointed a coach that would play their way, not a coach to come in and change everything that is set up through the club right from the kids upwards. This is established through the club so that if we sign a 14 yr old, he is already 'our' type of player.

There seem to be many people who are simply getting hung up on job titles. Both Alex Ferguson and Wenger have exactly the same person as we have in David Burke, only they're called the Chief Scout. In reality, there is little difference other than Burke has a football operations role that looks at all the age groups through the club as well as other responsibilites, whereas a chief scout might only be looking at signings for the first team.

David's responsibilities in close conjunction with the Coach, CEO and Chairman, are listed on his LinkedIn as:
Player and transfer negotiation.
Player budget
Player audits
Scouting and recruitment
Performance analysis
The Academy and player development
Player support services, education, welfare and liaison
Kit management
Women and girls elite football

It seems people need someone to blame on very little knowledge about what is going on behind the scenes.

As I said, I am not 'blaming' anyone but merely putting it out there for discussion that, in MY opinion, certain facets of Burke's job description do not appear to be aiding Oscar to be the best he can be.

It is an opinion of which I do not expect everyone to share but I am interested to see what other people believe. If I'm wrong by general consensus, then I will accept that.

I have read all the serious replies and accept that some of my post is possibly inaccurate. I have no problem with that whatsoever.

 

[Bold Seagull]

As I said, I am not 'blaming' anyone but merely putting it out there for discussion that, in MY opinion, certain facets of Burke's job description do not appear to be aiding Oscar to be the best he can be.

It is an opinion of which I do not expect everyone to share but I am interested to see what other people believe. If I'm wrong by general consensus, then I will accept that.

I have read all the serious replies and accept that some of my post is possibly inaccurate. I have no problem with that whatsoever.

Ultimately discussions on here about his performance are pointless because we do not have any idea of the constructive working relationships behind the scenes. It really is a job role we have to rely on our chairman to judge in regards to performance and value added. Your opinion is nothing more than a guess, simply a feeling on what might be going on. All you've done is written a fictional narrative of what might be going on.