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Ched Evans
- Thread starter Brighton TID
- Start date
JCL - the new kid in town
Well-known member
- Aug 23, 2011
- 1,864
How many appeals does he need? If he didn't want it discussed he shouldn't have a website about it
Hopefully this current review will put an end to the case.
With due respect, that is the picture of the girl that is continually painted by those that seem adamant that he definitely raped her. He as the predatory beast and her as this sweet little innocent victim whose whole life has been changed. Her life may well have changed because of this incident
The fact is that he has always maintained his innocence and that she was a willing sexual partner. That really is the only issue here. Was she capable of consenting and if she was, did she consent.
Until that has run it's course through the various review/appeal options, everything else is pretty much irrelevant. If the conviction is not quashed then he remains entitled to legally seek employment in his chosen career but one would hope that most clubs here would steer clear.
beardy gull
Well-known member
Agree. I believe any sentence over 4 years can never be 'spent' btw
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-30022080
Non sense. It's quite the opposite. Many of the people siding with the court, jury, appeal judge, and three judge appeal panel, make a point about her drunkenness, and the drugs in her system as something that contributed to her possible/currently official inability to consent. Hardly pointing to her as sweet and innocent.
It is the people siding with Ched that keep using the line, often claiming they aren't suggesting that she deserved it or it was less of a crime or that you can't rape someone who isn't innocent, but not ever offering an explanation for why they bring it up if not to make that suggestion.
Agreed. I'm personally not adamant that he raped her because I don't have enough information to decide, but I am accepting the decision of Jury that heard all the evidence, the judge, and the appeal judges so far rather than believing a website where the content is controlled by Evans and/or his supporters.
I have no idea if he will win an appeal, but it does worry me that some people think he is not guilty until he has all his appeals. He has been found guilty by a court and remains a convicted rapist until such time he can ever convince at court that his conviction was a miscarriage of justice.
How often can you appeal? I appreciate if new evidence comes to light then you should get an appeal but what mechanisms are in place to protect the justice system from frivolous appeals? I'm not suggesting his current appeal is frivolous, just curious how the system works.
The_Viper
Well-known member
There's no legal reason why he shouldn't be allowed to do his job, other than that people don't like that he has the gall to protest his innocence and that he works in a highly paid profession. Would you like a wage cap on anyone convicted of an offence? Perhaps waived if they publicly declare themselves guilty?
How do we formalise the amount of money you have to earn to no longer be allowed to do a job after doing your allotted punishment? Include the barred list for sex offenders to include anything with a salary over 100k? Anything that's viewed by more than 100k people? Our persecution of those who have served their sentence has to have a structure and a meaning, otherwise we're just burning witches at the stake again, although I feel some of NSC would have preferred those times.
It's become pretty damn dangerous with the way everyone is now given a trial by twitter. It gives the vocal minority of morons the ability to band together into some virtual mob, which the media will then pick up and run with regardless of right or wrong and then hey presto. The "defendant's" life is over.
How do we formalise the amount of money you have to earn to no longer be allowed to do a job after doing your allotted punishment? Include the barred list for sex offenders to include anything with a salary over 100k? Anything that's viewed by more than 100k people? Our persecution of those who have served their sentence has to have a structure and a meaning, otherwise we're just burning witches at the stake again, although I feel some of NSC would have preferred those times.
It's become pretty damn dangerous with the way everyone is now given a trial by twitter. It gives the vocal minority of morons the ability to band together into some virtual mob, which the media will then pick up and run with regardless of right or wrong and then hey presto. The "defendant's" life is over.
Bold Seagull
strong and stable with me, or...
Is it a fact she was a willing sexual partner?
The jury felt there was sufficient evidence that she was a willing partner with McDonald, however, in the same way you don't hold the jury decision on Evans safe, then surely the same can be said of McDonald's acquittal?
I've been invited back with a girl, we've actually shared a bed, it seemed pretty much nailed on, but in the end she wanted to just 'cuddle'
. Anyway, the point being is that if you believe there is insufficient evidence that consent wasn't given to Evans, the same can be said for both of them? McDonald got off on the fact the jury felt consent was sufficiently implied by going in the taxi with him to the hotel. That doesn't mean it's a fact she was a willing sexual partner.
I'm surprised you of all people are suggesting there are facts in this case - I thought your whole argument was that there weren't any facts!?
spring hall convert
Well-known member
But he can resume his football career, it's just that no club will have him. Would you want him at the Albion?
Exactly, it will always be a case of he can work, but not at our club. I think any clubs fan base will have a problem with the club employing a convicted rapist.
I don't think anyone is arguing there is a legal argument for him not going back to his old career, but a moral one. That a man who has, in the eyes of the law, committed one of the most serious crimes you can commit against another person shouldn't be able to walk right back into the life he had as if nothing has happened. The idea that someone can take a couple of years out of society, then go back as if nothing happened diminishes the crime committed and the impact it had on the victim. Especially given how much more humane we are towards prisoners than we used to be (a fact I am happy about, btw).
When you break one of the major rules of society, you should (morally speaking) have to earn your place back in society, not just slip right back where you were.
For me, the issue isn't the adulation footballers receive, the money they are paid (at least not directly), or the number of people they play in front of. It's the lack of consequences. If Ched dropped down a couple of division, spent a few years proving he was a reformed man (which would include understanding and acknowledging any wrongdoing and the impact the events have had on the people in his life, his then club etc), and then moved up the league table by proving himself as a member of society as much as proving himself as a footballer, I would be more willing to give him a chance.
For me that I why I don't think he should be able to go right back to Sheffield United. I wouldn't want a doctor who had his own surgery to go right back to that surgery as the owner, I wouldn't expect a managing accountant to waltz back into that same position, I wouldn't expect a supermarket manager to go right back to his office, or whatever.
BensGrandad
New member
So Acker 79 are you saying you would be happy if he signed a 6 month contract with Forest Green Rovers and then got signed by a Championship or Premier team in July, that would be ok. Wouldnt that be contradictory?
Don't I get to answer your hypothetical before you write my answer off as contradictory?
No, I wouldn't be happy in that situation. I don't think 6 months is enough time to prove yourself. That was one of the key aspects of my position, that he earns back his previous position in his career by proving himself a part of society, respecting the major rules of society and working his way up the ladder.
Jumping from Forest Green to the Championship (a level above Sheffield United) doesn't fulfil that criteria.
BensGrandad
New member
Surely if he went to any club it would only be to put himself in the shop window to return to a better standard whether it be in the summer or January 2015 window taking into account he is still only 25 so has 6 - 8 years left at the top. When he has achieved that with a signing it will be back to big bucks again.
Is it a fact she was a willing sexual partner?
The jury felt there was sufficient evidence that she was a willing partner with McDonald, however, in the same way you don't hold the jury decision on Evans safe, then surely the same can be said of McDonald's acquittal?
I've been invited back with a girl, we've actually shared a bed, it seemed pretty much nailed on, but in the end she wanted to just 'cuddle'
McDonald got off on the fact the jury felt consent was sufficiently implied by going in the taxi with him to the hotel. That doesn't mean it's a fact she was a willing sexual partner.
I'm surprised you of all people are suggesting there are facts in this case - I thought your whole argument was that there weren't any facts!?
To clarify what I meant, he maintains he is innocent because she (as he claims) was a willing partner.
It is a fact he has always maintained his innocence.
And like I said two posts ago, I don't care about how much money he makes.
The difference between the January 2015 window and a few years down the line is time. Time to prove he has grown as a person, as a member of society and earned the right to progress in his career.