Charlie Hebdo - merged

[Insel affe]

It wasn't that well planned - they didn't even know where in the building the magazine's offices were.

May have just been a coincidence that the staff were all in a meeting.

You could be right, we just don't know do we, I am sure you can get confused when in an office block you have never been before.

 

[Diablo]

With their attrocities from Lee Rigby to the 100+ children in Pakistan and now the Paris shooting surely no one of sound mind can have any sympathy with them. Decent Muslims around the world will I`m sure have reacted in horror. They will be worried about the backlash against themselves which will no doubt happen.My hope is that the terrorists either kill themselves or are killed in shootout with Police/army. If they are imprisoned they become a bargaining tool for other extremists. Whilst our security forces are good this sort of terrorism cannot be stopped anyone with AK47 can walk down any street/into any school or office and Kill many.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

Your reply to Beorhthelm's post suggests you believe Communism to be an atheist movement. It's perfectly acceptable to be a Communist and a Christian.
View attachment 61581

I'm neither incidently.

I agree. I would perhaps have been more accurate to cite Marxist-Leninism. Atheism is also a fundamental core of the Chinese communist party's core 'beliefs'.

 

[somerset]

You know, these types of threads always drag on and on, so for my sanity I will make one contribution, then leave it to the rest of you.

Through the ever increasing attitude of appeasement and concessions in a frantic effort to avoid conflict and offence, especially to Muslims and more broadly to Islam in general...... we have done nothing but empower those predisposed to Jihad, and in fact created a situation that convinced them that a) their cause is just and b) any sleight, no mater how small, is justification for murder.

So, stop appeasing, start standing up for our own values.

 

[Hastings gull]

Very clearly expressed last night on BBC News by top Muslim clerics. This is not a Muslim issue, this is an issue of some extremists that have chosen to associate themselves with the Muslim faith but do not represent the feelings, or beliefs of over 99% of the faith. Muslims are trying to deal with the issue but by thinking its a Muslim issue in isolation reduces the chances of dealing with it and leads to the marginalisation of a large number of law abiding, peaceful Muslims.

Thanks for this. I missed it last night but have no doubt that this would have been the case. As to whether it is a question of 1 and 99%, your figures chosen conveniently at random, this is where there is more doubt. You could be right, I accept, but my point is that is that after so much trouble, I have no idea if you are right or not, (and, lets be honest, nor have you) and it is very much in the muslim's community's interest that we should be in no doubt. I would certainly want more evidence than "muslims are trying to deal with it".

 

[BigGully]

I heard a senior Muslim cleric condemn the attacks and urging muslims that if they are concerned about Syria, Iraq etc. to use the political route.

Personally I think he would of been better served to ask his muslim brothers to stop prioritising some unknown fellow muslim 1000's miles away and prioritise their thoughts to their own fellow British citizens of all faiths and genders that reside around the corner.

 

[The Spanish]

I heard a senior Muslim cleric condemn the attacks and urging muslims that if they are concerned about Syria, Iraq etc. to use the political route.

Personally I think he would of been better served to ask his muslim brothers to stop prioritising some unknown fellow muslim 1000's miles away and prioritise their thoughts to their own fellow British citizens of all faiths and genders that reside around the corner.

thumbs up

 

[1234andcounting]

I must admit i know very little about the KKK, perhaps i should investigate. Have they shot, beheaded or blown anybody up.

They have lynched a fair few in their time. Try The Scottsboro Boys........Or listen to Strange Fruit by Billie Holliday.

 

[JCL666]

Thanks. I wonder just how many muslin friends you have -we could all say that that I know more than you and claim some high-ground! The muslim community is a minority in a Christian country (whatever that means, I know!) and somehow I would have expected rather more evidence of appreciation of british values from what I have seen and more of an attempt by, say, way of public statements that they unequivocally wish to distance themselves from extremism. Of course, I don't necessarily expect a huge demo every time an atrocity occurs either. As I say, it may well be the case that I simply have not heard loud denunciations of extremism.

It's not about how many, and I'm not trying to claim any high ground. It's about the contact people have in their everyday lives. The people I hang out with treat these sort of incidents in the same most people do. They are outraged/upset/saddened.

As for statements, the press and media have reported loads of public denunciations of extremism by Muslim leaders and representatives.

 

[JCL666]

So basically you can distinguish 'communities' when they demand, want or deserve help, but then not when some are spawning people that perpertrate, support or empathise with such atrocitise.

I'm not sure how you've come to that conclusion.

I'm not distinguishing anyone from anything. In the statement I made I placed emphasis on the faiths that some of friends adhere to. What I didn't say was that I treat them any differently because of their beliefs.

 

[Bozza]

It may or may not be related, but a policewoman has been shot dead in South Paris this morning and another woman is seriously injured.

 

[BigGully]

I'm not sure how you've come to that conclusion.

I'm not distinguishing anyone from anything. In the statement I made I placed emphasis on the faiths that some of friends adhere to. What I didn't say was that I treat them any differently because of their beliefs.

But in many instances council leaders and 'community leaders' do distinguish between communities, either by ethnicity, faith etc. and they will regularly cite disadvantage, certain special needs or needed financial support above and beyond what others may require.

If they then perhaps have certain factions within those communities that then spawn empathy for these atrocities then some level of exclamation would be expected, I think some already have.

Your original point was why should your friends of any faith 'march', they neednt but a statement of common values might be appropriate for those self acclaimed leaders that comment on everything else.

 

[spring hall convert]

This was posted on the Charlie Hebdon twitter feed

At the risk of kicking up a whole new ruck.

That Rowan Atkinson quote is to my mind correct. However, consider it in relation to Judaism where criticism of the state of Israel and its actions are often considered to be anti-semitic.

It's not just Islam that has that particular problem.

 

[Insel affe]

It may or may not be related, but a policewoman has been shot dead in South Paris this morning and another woman is seriously injured.

not on bbc reports yet

 

[clippedgull]

It may or may not be related, but a policewoman has been shot dead in South Paris this morning and another woman is seriously injured.

One of the gunman in this incident has been captured and the other is still on the run.

 

[spring hall convert]

We need to face up to the fact that we are at war with so called Islamic extremists

You are probably right. This is a very important distinction from being at War with Islam.

If we fight a War with Islam we'll likely lose. If we fight a war against Islamic Extremists, we'll likely win or at least not lose.

By tarring all Muslims with the same brush we do the extremists job for them. We push people into their arms. It is important for all of us to make this distinction.

 

[spring hall convert]

https://twitter.com/RLOppenheimer/status/552848047089405952

Nail on Head.

That is extremely good.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

BBC News reporting new police officer killing in Paris this morning

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-30721677

 

[Bozza]

BBC News reporting new police officer killing in Paris this morning

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-30721677

Yep...

It may or may not be related, but a policewoman has been shot dead in South Paris this morning and another woman is seriously injured.

 

[clippedgull]

Two gunmen from yesterdays shooting located in Northern France according to AFP sources.

Also, named suspect had left his ID card in car used in shooting getaway.