[Politics] By election result

[midnight_rendezvous]

Or maybe people are realising blaming a minority party for all the ills of a coalition was dumb?

The moment UK politics started going tits up was the moment the Lid Dems were decimated in the 2015 GE, and the moment politics has come to its senses is with the resurgence of the Lib Dems.

British politics needs a strong functioning centrist party to keep the other two honest.

Of course the Lib Dems weren’t entirely at fault for the coalition... they did however enable ruinous Tory austerity. Jo Swinson’s voting record shows as much.

 

[Pavilionaire]

Lid Dems are strong on their views on Brexit and that's about it.

For starters they have the only female main party leader - a young, hard working mother who will appeal to many.

They also have policies that are easily acceptable to the Labour masses, a number of which stand to the left of Blair's New Labour.

I agree Bollocks to Brexit is their main attraction but if you think they're a one trick pony you may be in for a surprise.

 

[Bob!]

If a General Election is called, an extension will be granted to Article 50.

Who is going to ask for that, because the Prime Minister won't?

 

[Pavilionaire]

Of course the Lib Dems weren’t entirely at fault for the coalition... they did however enable ruinous Tory austerity. Jo Swinson’s voting record shows as much.

You think it wouldn't have happened anyway? Better to get some good stuff than nothing at all, i.e. delay on EU Referendum, massive hikes in tax-free Personal Allowance and Pupil Premium.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

as said in Brexit thread, its a strategic failure on their behalf.

Or Farage knows helping Boris retain a seat the Tories were expected to lose is likely to see even more Brexit party voters heading back to the Conservative party. By splitting the vote leading to a Tory loss Farage/ the Brexit party are showing they are still a big threat and could do serious damage to the Tories at the next GE.

 

[Pavilionaire]

Or Farage knows helping Boris retain a seat the Tories were expected to lose is likely to see even more Brexit party voters heading back to the Conservative party. By splitting the vote leading to a Tory loss Farage/ the Brexit party are showing they are still a big threat and could do serious damage to the Tories at the next GE.

In simple terms if Farage wants Brexit then last night's result doesn't advance that cause, and in a GE you can see that outcome being replicated. In order to improve chances of Brexit Boris needs to do a deal with Farage, but both men are vain so that probably won't happen.

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

You think it wouldn't have happened anyway? Better to get some good stuff than nothing at all, i.e. delay on EU Referendum, massive hikes in tax-free Personal Allowance and Pupil Premium.

Her and her ilk still voted for; the Bedroom Tax, rip-off tuition fees, disability benefit cuts, welfare benefit cuts, cuts to youth employment funding, voting against the mansion tax and voted against the fracking ban. She put her own personal enrichment and career prospects above the welfare of the nation. She had an absolutely golden opportunity as Employment Minister to stand up for British workers by resigning from her post in protest, but she chose not to for the benefit of her own career prospects.

 

[Greg Bobkin]

If a General Election is called, an extension will be granted to Article 50.

What's the point of an extension? Just bin the whole thing off now! That's what Johnson is going to do any way (IMO) – he's not SERIOUSLY going to leave without a deal – because it's absolute madness and his ego couldn't cope with the backlash. He's going to go back to Europe, fail to get any movement on May's proposals, throw his toys out of the pram and then blame the EU for not being able to leave. As a result he'll revoke A50 we'll stay put.

 

[Two Professors]

If nothing else,the voting showed how irrelevant Labour have become.They need to get rid of Corbyn now,or get him to declare for Brexit.If not they will get wiped out at a GE,and if they come out for Remain it will nicely split the pro Evil Empire vote.

 

[Pavilionaire]

Her and her ilk still voted for; the Bedroom Tax, rip-off tuition fees, disability benefit cuts, welfare benefit cuts, cuts to youth employment funding, voting against the mansion tax and voted against the fracking ban. She put her own personal enrichment and career prospects above the welfare of the nation. She had an absolutely golden opportunity as Employment Minister to stand up for British workers by resigning from her post in protest, but she chose not to for the benefit of her own career prospects.

That's your opinion. When the two main parties can't command a majority then the largest will normally seek a coalition with a willing partner, and the junior partner will have to toe the line on the lion's share of policy whilst extracting what they can along the way. This is what happened for a full 5 year parliament at the end of which the UK was stronger than at the start.

Yet you talk as if it was something the Lib Dems were happy to do. The reality is different and it is a shame Labour ruled out the option of a coalition quickly after the 2010 result, leaving the Lib Dems with nowhere else to go.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

In simple terms if Farage wants Brexit then last night's result doesn't advance that cause, and in a GE you can see that outcome being replicated. In order to improve chances of Brexit Boris needs to do a deal with Farage, but both men are vain so that probably won't happen.

Farage wields influence (stops Boris backsliding on Brexit promises) and puts pressure on the Tories by not doing any deals but you are right the next GE will be crunch time for both men. Some sort of agreement will be probably be needed for the Tories to have a realistic chance of forming a majority government.

 

[beorhthelm]

According to the beeb if they get their timings right a election can be squeezed in on or just before the 31st Oct

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49004486

same old nonsense from MPs, saying they might do anything except an outright vote on revoking Article 50.

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

That's your opinion. When the two main parties can't command a majority then the largest will normally seek a coalition with a willing partner, and the junior partner will have to toe the line on the lion's share of policy whilst extracting what they can along the way. This is what happened for a full 5 year parliament at the end of which the UK was stronger than at the start.

Yet you talk as if it was something the Lib Dems were happy to do. The reality is different and it is a shame Labour ruled out the option of a coalition quickly after the 2010 result, leaving the Lib Dems with nowhere else to go.

The Lib-Dems made the awful mistake of going into the coalition negotiations from a weak debating position (we've got fewer seats than you so we'll agree to most of your terms) instead of taking a strong debating stance (you need us more than we need you) and drawing a number of red lines.

Had the Liberal Democrats held out on these red line issues, the Tories would have either have had to agree and we'd be looking at a completely different political landscape right now, or they would have had to refuse and opt to work as a weak minority government (which would also have been good for the Lib-Dems and good for the progressive agenda).

It's obvious that the progressive agenda would have benefited if the red lines had been agreed to, but even if they hadn't and the Tories had opted for minority rule (under some kind of confidence and supply deal with the Lib-Dems), the Lib-Dems could have gleefully shot down every rotten and unpopular piece of Tory legislation (such as Caroline Spelman's attempt to sell off our public forests) until the next election was called.

The Lib-Dem narrative at the next election (whenever it would have been called) would have been a very strong one indeed, meaning they could conceivably have significantly increased their share of the vote at the next election rather than getting almost completely wiped out as they did in 2015.

If the Lib-Dems hadn't been so strategically inept, the Tories wouldn't have been able to spend the that five years laying the groundwork for what was to come next, and it's by no means certain that they would even have been in power at all. Imagine if the Lib-Dems and Labour had called a vote of no confidence in the Tory government when the economy was flatlining as a result of harsh ideological austerity in 2012 (around the time George Osborne was being booed at the Paralympics). Anyone who imagines that the Tories would have won a majority government at that point must be living in a fantasy world.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

What's the point of an extension? Just bin the whole thing off now! That's what Johnson is going to do any way (IMO) – he's not SERIOUSLY going to leave without a deal – because it's absolute madness and his ego couldn't cope with the backlash. He's going to go back to Europe, fail to get any movement on May's proposals, throw his toys out of the pram and then blame the EU for not being able to leave. As a result he'll revoke A50 we'll stay put.

Just bin it off, **** democracy.

 

[Albumen]

Just bin it off, **** democracy.

It's been 3 years. Now we know the choices. New vote, simple.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

It's been 3 years. Now we know the choices. New vote, simple.

It will never ever be right.

 

[Greg Bobkin]

Just bin it off, **** democracy.

If it can't be done in a way that won't do detrimental damage to the country then yeah, I think it makes sense to reverse the decision of an advisory, albeit democratic, referendum.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

If it can't be done in a way that won't do detrimental damage to the country then yeah, I think it makes sense to reverse the decision of an advisory, albeit democratic, referendum.

How about we leave first, respect democracy. If after 5 years it's true what they say, have another referendum to join as full members of the EU.

 

[Ernest]

Never has there been a clearer indication of the disarray the Labour party are in right now. The government has a majority of just 1, is heading inexorably towards something that 48% of the entire country (probably more) do not want, and is lead by a complete buffoon, yet still, they do not even believe themselves that they could win a general election.

The tories have never had it so easy.

Stupid comment of the year award winner

 

[pasty]

Stupid comment of the year award winner

"Stupid comment of the year award winner" is a much more worthy winner.