[Politics] Brexit

[Mackenzie]

For a start I was astonished that we didn't stay in the CU or the Single Market. All the talk before the referendum was being like Norway or Switzerland. Gove said it. Johnson said it. Farage said it. Hannan said it - the idea of having no trade agreement was never discussed (unless it was Brexiteers saying that it was Remain propaganda).

I'm also astonished that there was no passporting arrangements between the financial institutions given how important the sector is to the UK economy. And finally, I never believed that a Conservative government would so cavalier about European co-operation on crime and security.

I didn't foresee any problems with these, I thought they were a given. I was wrong. I also would like to have seen free movement kept but I knew that may be hard for some Brexiteers to swallow, so it didn't surprise me to see that.

But the push towards no deal and all that entails: lorry parks in Kent, 50,000 customers officers, quotas and tariffs strike me as totally bonkers and I can't understand why any government would want them.

What I wanted was to withdraw from CAP and institute new guidelines on state investment. I also thought that a by-product would be an eventual move to a unified Ireland and Scottish independence (both of which I support) - although I agree that they would need to be supported by the Irish and Scottish people.

I've got some of what I wanted but there's a whole lot of other baggage

Thank you.

 

[Johnny RoastBeef]

I accidentally selected the wrong option because I actually voted Remain (having lived and worked in another EU country for a period of time) but I am now firmly pro-Brexit. I am of "another opinion" as even though I am well-educated and am well acquainted with current affairs, I am no expert on fiscal matters, so I (along with many of us) really have no idea whether we're going to be richer or poorer. However, I am of the opinion that:

a) Brexit needs to happen for democracy's sake - even if it were to leave us worse off
b) Like most things in life, it probably won't be quite as wonderful nor nearly as terrible as those on the extremes of both sides paint it

The fact the vote was so close is a good indication of this, the wisdom of crowds and all that.

 

[Randy McNob]

Anything that divides people is never a good thing

 

[Deleted member 2719]

All will be rosy, just be patient.


Back Britain or leave Britain, it's your choice, some like to moan about it but live here and some like to live in costa bravo and moan about it. I choose to live here and support Britain.

Some people need to understand which side their bread is buttered IMO.

 

[Chicken Run]

It was appropriate to two discussions underway with different people on different threads

But since you're here, are you hoping Johnson will get a free trade deal with the EU or do you want 'no deal' ?

(And don't worry, if you don't want to say, don't know or don't understand, you can always run back to the Big Board )

What will be will be you old winker [emoji6],

Anyway I’ll leave you to your circle jerk on this wonderful Friday evening [emoji6]

 

[Sorrel]

Personally I remain in favour of Brexit - and I'm not sure it will be possible to judge how it's gone until at least twenty years have passed since we've properly left - so around 2041. Certainly not in the next five.

I was in two minds at the time of the vote, but what has happened since has made me much less in favour of the EU as an institution than I was then. What I perceive (I'm sure other opinions are available) as the arrogant way it conducts negotiations makes me want to have even less to do with it than previously.

However, I would also say that is the EU specifically that I dislike, not the countries or even the governments within it (apart from Belgium, obviously). The specific bureaucratic legalistic arrogant mindset that I don't want anywhere in the power structures above me is instead the prevailing political attitude in some of the EU countries and entirely the controlling attitude within the EU itself. It may not last for ever - even Macron now seems more than happy to change its direction and once Merkel is out of the way German may see some changes, too.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

There was a decent Brexit to be had ( or at least an OK one ) but the politicians have made such a mess of sorting it out that we are now facing a disasterous flavour.

Given the circumstances the politicians haven't done a bad job. Unfortunately, the circumstances make a good job impossible.

 

[WATFORD zero]

What will be will be you old winker [emoji6],

Anyway I’ll leave you to your circle jerk on this wonderful Friday evening [emoji6]

Don't worry, I won't embarrass you by asking which of the three reasons has caused you to run away

 

[Sorrel]

What I wanted was to withdraw from CAP

I detest the CAP - and just getting that would be almost enough for me: I just hope some government is able to create a decent environmental policy to replace it.

If they replicate it completely I will not be happy - but happier that we can change it if we vote for change - which within the EU was impossible.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

I voted for Brexit and don't regret my vote.

What I hadn't anticipated was that our PM would be Boris who would go on to make such a complete **** up of the negotiations during the transition period. For that reason i would support a 12 month extension of the transition period in the hope that Boris gets turfed out (or drinks himself to oblivion) so that we can sit down with the EU and negotiate a deal that suits all parties.

I think Johnson as PM was always going to happen if Leave won, it was all set up.

I still believe he pulled out of the race with May because his advisors could see the disaster the couple of years after would be/waiting to see if Trump won.

The plan was to come in after the hard work was done and take credit.

 

[Chicken Run]

Don't worry, I won't embarrass you by asking which of the three reasons has caused you to run away

Easy , you’re a big winker

 

[portlock seagull]

Free movement has always been part of the EEC/EU, it's an item in the 1957 Treaty of Rome



This a complete myth. There was a survey last year of EU countries and in not a single one was there a majority who wished to leave. In pretty much every case, there was a massive desire to remain.

There's no reason why it had to be painful, there were lots of steps that we could have taken to make it as smooth as possible. For example, just staying in the customs union would have saved a good deal of the headaches we're now facing

Sorry free movement between many more countries ie the mass immigration from former eastern bloc. Remember when Blair said no more than about 80k and 5 million arrived!

 

[WATFORD zero]

Easy , you’re a big winker

But since you're here, are you hoping Johnson will get a free trade deal with the EU or do you want 'no deal' ?

(And don't worry, if you don't want to say, don't know or don't understand, you can always run back to the Big Board )

We both know which one it is really though. I can't imagine you not having an opinion even if, for some unknown reason, you can't bring yourself to say it. From a big winker

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

U Turn incoming?

 

[daveinplzen]

Dave mate your of the “left” & a remainer and you’re on a thread that was a question directly asked to Brexiters and you’re on it arguing and spoiling for an argument [emoji23]

Not looking for a fight at all, just an observation that for many Brexiteers I've spoken, their posts seem to be a bit rightwing. There are people of the left who wanted Brexit, Corbyn for example (and Mustpha), but for many it seems a left/right issue and that seems to stifle debate regarding the pros and cons of Brexit.

 

[portslade seagull]

Nope, let's get on with it

 

[portlock seagull]

Not looking for a fight at all, just an observation that for many Brexiteers I've spoken, their posts seem to be a bit rightwing. There are people of the left who wanted Brexit, Corbyn for example (and Mustpha), but for many it seems a left/right issue and that seems to stifle debate regarding the pros and cons of Brexit.

It’s ok to be right wing! Big part of the lefty liberal leaning’s problem is the failure to be even the slightest bit tolerant of other opinions. Which is ironic when they believe everyone on the right is a racist fascist! Btw, I’m ambidextrous so don’t have a pop at me.

 

[knocky1]

This is like streaming classes on ability at school. Allowing those less clever to have a voice without the shame of losing out to the higher intellectuals in the top stream.

 

[Weststander]

Not looking for a fight at all, just an observation that for many Brexiteers I've spoken, their posts seem to be a bit rightwing. There are people of the left who wanted Brexit, Corbyn for example (and Mustpha), but for many it seems a left/right issue and that seems to stifle debate regarding the pros and cons of Brexit.

I voted Remain.

I know a large number of Brexiteers through business, family, friends and my in laws, covering all groups down to 18. If anything views have hardened, I gather due to the likes of Gina Miller, the last Parliament/Bercow doing everything possible to scupper Brexit and the likes of Hugh Grant campaigning against.

A sizeable proportion of them are lifelong Labour, they’ve never expressed any love for the Tory party, some are young graduates, some just out of sixth form. Typical reasons for a loathing of the EU is the way their Sussex towns were transformed in no short time from 1997 by a huge influx of people from Eastern Europe, also tradespeople and employed people who found job or pay rates plummeted with newbies willing to work or take on construction work for a fraction of the old rates. Some of my friends with these views are big fans of Corbyn and McCluskey for their principled loathing of the EU on these very matters.

Not my own views, but I respect those of others.

 

[nwgull]

Have to laugh at those that think Brexit will be bad short term but worth it in their lifetime. I’m assuming that lifetime means 10+ years. If this is the case - and let’s face facts we’re currently heading towards a shit fest - then parties will start campaigning for GEs on a rejoin manifesto and we’ll be back in (but with much less influence and with the Euro) within the next 2 governments. The public won’t have the patience to wait decades for things to improve.