[Politics] Brexit

[pastafarian]

He was proposing exactly that, however much he, and you, want to weasel away from it. I will grant you that what he was proposing was not what was agreed to, but you and he cannot pretend that he once saw two referendums as the logical way to do it.
Now, at that time, he and everyone else thought that an in/out referendum would yield an IN result, but by having a second referendum and a chance to pull out if the deal was shit, it might get a few more people to dare to have a look at what out might mean. Cameron clearly thought that having a scary undefined OUT on the ballot would be the best way to get the remain result and put the matter to bed, for a few years at least. That obviously did not work out for him, and here we are, but don't pretend he was never advocating a second referendum after negotiation. It suited his agenda then, but it doesn't now, he argued for it then, and argues against it now.

Im sorry you are wrong, And so are your thumbers [MENTION=36111]Klaas[/MENTION] and [MENTION=396]WATFORD zero[/MENTION]
He is indeed saying we could have two referendums, and he is right we could, but he is not saying have the second referendum after negotiation for withdrawal is completed and therefore as you believe having a 2nd ref after finding out “what we were leaving to”.
That video, and the tweets that [MENTION=14365]Thunder Bolt[/MENTION] and others often share with this video in them do indeed try to infer Mogg is saying we could have a 1st ref and a leave decision and then a follow up 2nd referendum after negotiation for withdrawal is completed, but they are being deceitful and pushing a false narrative of what Mogg is saying. This nonsense has been pointed out before how its different circumstances but it still continues. You and others are too quick to believe this rubbish by simply hearing what you only want to hear.

 

[cunning fergus]

Yep, Brexit is really unpopular with rich people, which is why some of the most prominent Remainers are Jacob Rees-Mogg, Aaron Banks, Nigel Farage, Boris Johnson, John Redwood and sundry other toffs and hedge fund managers.

Oh, wait, hang on...

Richard Drax MP (Dorset) is a Tory, one of the UKs biggest recipients of the CAP and voted leave.

So yes rich and influential people voted leave, but they are outliers comparitively. That is a fact.......more Tories were remain were they not.

 

[The Clamp]

I dont, because I know for a fact that the EU is spending less UK taxpayers money in the U.K. than the taxpayers give them.

Its like this, I give an acquaintance £20 to buy a round of drinks in a pub with some other acquaintances because I’m outside having a fag.

Firstly he dishes out the pints, telling the recipients he bought the round, secondly the round comes to £16.25 and he pockets the £3.75 to spend on a kebab and chips for himself.

This is how it works with our contribution.

If this happened to you in the pub you would have words at least, maybe more..........you wouldn’t keep on doing it for 40 years.

That doesn’t equate. I expect some of our contributions to go towards salaries, admin costs and other poorer areas of the EU. I can happily live with that.

 

[The Rivet]

That doesn’t equate. I expect some of our contributions to go towards salaries, admin costs and other poorer areas of the EU. I can happily live with that.

Out of your depth Clamp.

 

[pastafarian]

Holy macaroni, this is disturbing:

A poll commissioned last week by ICM found that 'No Deal' was the most popular option amongst the 2,500 or so survey respondents

--------

That's not the saddest thing about it. When picking through these numbers, it turns out that a significant proportion of respondents wrongly believe that 'no deal' means we stay in the EU.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/blog/live/2019/jan/21/brexit-latest-news-mays-statement-mps-commons-deal-will-be-absolute-disaster-says-business-minister-as-may-prepares-to-address-mps-politics-live?CMP=share_btn_tw&page=with:block-5c45c472e4b0197a614f73bd#block-5c45c472e4b0197a614f73bd

I'm all for giving the public votes on important matters, but when many of us don't actually fully understand what we're being asked...what hope is there?

Think you are being a bit harsh on the voters here.
When you pick through the numbers of the ICM poll itself there is no relevant question to respondents about what they think a no deal is.

https://www.icmunlimited.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/Voting-18thJan19_pv-only-BPC.pdf

It appears its just people making claims on the likes of twitter with no real polling of note that can be considered at least trustworthy.

Anthony Wells, director of political research at yougov disagrees with the people on twitter saying that a sizeable chunk of people think no deal means we stay in the EU, saying they have actually tested this a couple of times, and the numbers they get is 1%
https://twitter.com/anthonyjwells/status/1087303135209668615
https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.n...ent/4ovmboa1iw/Internal_190108_Brexit_web.pdf

sorry dont know how to embed a tweet, which is prob a good thing

 

[The Clamp]

Out of your depth Clamp.

Nah, you just don’t recognise sense when you see it.
My only quibble with sending a minuscule amount of my taxes to the EU is it pays for Farage to occasionally turn up there and make himself look stupid . And of course the pension he still plans on drawing.

 

[The Rivet]

Nah, you just don’t recognise sense when you see it.
My only quibble with sending a minuscule amount of my taxes to the EU is it pays for Farage to occasionally turn up there and make himself look stupid . And of course the pension he still plans on drawing.

Thanks Clamp, as expected the usual inane reply..

 

[The Clamp]

Thanks Clamp, as expected the usual inane reply..

As if you deserve anything else, ya wee dafty.

 

[The Rivet]

As if you deserve anything else, ya wee dafty.

X honey......

 

[LlcoolJ]

Out of your depth Clamp.

What he wrote made perfect sense.

The analogy was disingenuous and didn't make sense.

Many of the poorest areas of the UK have benefited from EU funding. Money that would NEVER have been directed to those areas by a Tory government. Or perhaps any British government. But certainly not this one.

The idea that we will see any benefit from not paying into the EU hinges on trusting the politicians in charge here to spend that money correctly.

Personally, I can see a major problem with that, based on the current government's record on public spending. Or lack of it.

So it's better that the mate with your £20 bought the round and himself a kebab than taking your £20, ****ing off with it, and buying himself a bottle of champagne to go home with, screwing you and all your mates as well.

 

[Swillis]

They all get the chance to vote again, except the dead ones, and they won't mind. What you are suggesting is that people will riot over a democratic result if it doesn't go their way, but surely if we just say to them, you lost, get over it, they will be fine and get behind remaining to make it a success. Remaining in the EU will be great if you just believe in it.

But we have already had a democratic vote and leave won, or should we just keep voting until we get the result the whiners want. I really do believe that people won't just put up with it this time, hence why the reservists have been called up. Then again if we do get Brexit I expect there to be a lot of protests, but only in the guardian comments column.

 

[The Clamp]

But we have already had a democratic vote and leave won, or should we just keep voting until we get the result the whiners want. I really do believe that people won't just put up with it this time, hence why the reservists have been called up. Then again if we do get Brexit I expect there to be a lot of protests, but only in the guardian comments column.

So rather than a second referendum to achieve what you voted for you’d rather people riot. Why? Rioting will just lose what little sympathy is left for your lost cause.

 

[Baldseagull]

If I understand your point correctly you consider that decisions made on UK taxpayers money are best left to unelected Europeans as oppose to a democratically elected UK Govt?

I don’t obviously, however I understand all elected Govts in the UK are held accountable by the opposition and subject to a free press.

This does not happen in the EU, and I probably wouldn’t care if it wasn’t for the fact that we put in more than we get back. That means if we get a socialist Govt we will still have less to give the poor in the UK.........or “plebs” as you call them.

So if we have a socialist Govt that takes tax revenues from London and spends them disproportionately on areas outside London, like Liverpool or Middlesbrough would it piss you off that the poor in London could have had more?

 

[LlcoolJ]

Not really bothered about the idea of a gammon riot.

When Farage tried to organise a march against parliament being allowed to have power over government on article 50 he said there would be hundreds of thousands of people turning up.

Overheard in the pub......


First fat old man - "It's bloody ridiculous! Leave means leave, you see that march, that'll show em"

Second fat old man - "See Nigel's said there will be a hundred thousand there!"

Third fat old man -"Yes, I was going to go but my daughter's up for the weekend."

Fourth fat old man - "Well I was going to go too. Mrs says I've got to sort the garden, otherwise I would."

#2 - "You'll be going then Geoff? I'm taking the grandson to United else I'd go too."

#1 - "Of COURSE I would John but the bloody trains are a fortune and I'm not sitting on a coach for four hours. Anyway, they don't need us, there's going to be at least a hundred thousand there."

*All mumble into pints of shit cheap bitter*

Under 100 people turned up.

 

[Baldseagull]

Im sorry you are wrong, And so are your thumbers [MENTION=36111]Klaas[/MENTION] and [MENTION=396]WATFORD zero[/MENTION]
He is indeed saying we could have two referendums, and he is right we could, but he is not saying have the second referendum after negotiation for withdrawal is completed and therefore as you believe having a 2nd ref after finding out “what we were leaving to”.
That video, and the tweets that [MENTION=14365]Thunder Bolt[/MENTION] and others often share with this video in them do indeed try to infer Mogg is saying we could have a 1st ref and a leave decision and then a follow up 2nd referendum after negotiation for withdrawal is completed, but they are being deceitful and pushing a false narrative of what Mogg is saying. This nonsense has been pointed out before how its different circumstances but it still continues. You and others are too quick to believe this rubbish by simply hearing what you only want to hear.

Weasels weasel.

 

[LlcoolJ]

Weasels weasel.

Is that one of pasta's private videos?

 

[The Clamp]

Is that one of pasta's private videos?

Nice

 

[melias shoes]

You know when you see kids dicking about and their parents get wound up by the noise and the silliness, it's like that.

I rest my case.

 

[nicko31]

50 billion. I suppose you are talking of the divorce bill where Britain settles it's obligations. Would you prefer us not to pay what we legally owe. Your comment is laughable.

No one is laughing about the 2.5% loss of GDP growth since you launched your nationalist tantrum. Still Liam. Fox has got lots of trade deals ready to go with poor countries far away, or has he??

 

[nicko31]

Not really bothered about the idea of a gammon riot.

When Farage tried to organise a march against parliament being allowed to have power over government on article 50 he said there would be hundreds of thousands of people turning up.

Overheard in the pub......


First fat old man - "It's bloody ridiculous! Leave means leave, you see that march, that'll show em"

Second fat old man - "See Nigel's said there will be a hundred thousand there!"

Third fat old man -"Yes, I was going to go but my daughter's up for the weekend."

Fourth fat old man - "Well I was going to go too. Mrs says I've got to sort the garden, otherwise I would."

#2 - "You'll be going then Geoff? I'm taking the grandson to United else I'd go too."

#1 - "Of COURSE I would John but the bloody trains are a fortune and I'm not sitting on a coach for four hours. Anyway, they don't need us, there's going to be at least a hundred thousand there."

*All mumble into pints of shit cheap bitter*

Under 100 people turned up.

The only gammon riot will will be when local Spoons runs out of microwaveable gammon joints.

Last Brexit betrayal march went well, didn't it?