[Politics] Brexit

[Kinky Gerbil]

Jezza all talk and no action as normal.

Threaten no confidence then backs down.

 

[Ernest]

A short while ago:-

Typical Tory , sooner they are gone the better

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

Jezza all talk and no action as normal.

Threaten no confidence then backs down.

At what point does Corbyn stop fiddling while Brexitland burns ?

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

At what point does Corbyn stop fiddling while Brexitland burns ?

He’s utterly useless, he will be the reason the Tories stay in power.

They are somehow less useless than him.

 

[Simster]

He’s utterly useless, he will be the reason the Tories stay in power.

They are somehow less useless than him.

Correct. It's not just him, it's Labour's entire front bench. They ought to be embarrassed and ashamed at the fact they're actually behind in recent opinion polls. Even Angela Raynor, an MP I used to have a lot of time for, was full of bluster and meaningless bullshit on QT the other night, seemingly oblivious to the fact that nobody actually wants a general election all the while we no clue what Labour stand for on Brexit themselves.

 

[nwgull]

At what point does Corbyn stop fiddling while Brexitland burns ?

He doesn't actually care about how much some of the people in the country are going to suffer (and it isn't goinf to be the rich); he just wants the country ****ed up enough so that he can get elected. ****ing politics.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Bloody hell. I think you would be worse than the PM at getting us a good deal.

None of that will happen. The EU need us as much as we need them. In fact they need us more.

No deal will mean we will agree a new final date and work towards it. No pay outs. No terms we don't like, and nothing will change.... to begin with. We will agree things like citizens rights etc as we go, document by documents. If we don't agree on something, it won't happen.

I think we will leave on the 29th. I think we will leave without a deal. We will have a transition period.

You could save everyone a lot of hassle if you could also think that we will get some very good trade deals with the major economies and trading blocs and think they start on 30th March next year

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Correct. It's not just him, it's Labour's entire front bench. They ought to be embarrassed and ashamed at the fact they're actually behind in recent opinion polls. Even Angela Raynor, an MP I used to have a lot of time for, was full of bluster and meaningless bullshit on QT the other night, seemingly oblivious to the fact that nobody actually wants a general election all the while we no clue what Labour stand for on Brexit themselves.

Keir Starmer aside.

Even he looks more and more fed up with the rest.

Corbyn had a copy of Mays speech when he mentioned the vote of confidence, knowing he wouldn’t have to go through with it.

 

[Tubby-McFat-Fuc]

A short while ago:-

Fair play to him. That's what its like trying to speak to a leftie. They just don't let you speak, and when they do pause for breath, they will just start cutting across you as soon as you start talking. This is why it is hard to debate with them. The greens are the worst for this. Don't dare make a valid point to them, as they like to hear anything like that, so will just ignore it.

 

[Tubby-McFat-Fuc]

You could save everyone a lot of hassle if you could also think that we will get some very good trade deals with the major economies and trading blocs and think they start on 30th March next year

Er, your rambling. A few commas might help me understand what the **** you are trying to say.

Is this what you are trying to say??

 

[Tubby-McFat-Fuc]

At what point does Corbyn stop fiddling while Brexitland burns ?

Corbyn doesn't want an election.

Latest opinion polls

Opinium (14th Dec) – CON 38%, LAB 39%, LDEM 8%, UKIP 6%
YouGov (7th Dec) – CON 38%, LAB 37%, LDEM 10%, UKIP 3%
Kantar (6th Dec) – CON 38%, LAB 38%, LDEM 9%, UKIP 5%
Ipsos MORI (5th Dec) – CON 38%, LAB 38%, LDEM 9%, UKIP 4%
YouGov (4th Dec) – CON 40%, LAB 39%, LDEM 9%, UKIP 4%
ComRes (2nd Dec) – CON 37%, LAB 39%, LDEM 9%, UKIP 6%

completely 50/50

If Labour can't a good lead with the Tories in civil war, with a leader no one has faith, what chance have Labour got at an election?

****ING EMBARRASSING!!

 

[vegster]

Expect Person 1 and Person 2, worked with 27 other employees, and person one and person two finance the business, and pay most of the salaries of the other 27 employess. So when person 2 leaves and takes all the money they pay into the business with them, while person one may only lose a little, the other 27 employees who pay nothing in to the business, suffer incredibly as well.

Person two can then work anywhere else they so choose and with who they please, without person 1 and 27 employees approval.

Person two after a tough start, thrives and within a few years becomes far more powerful that person 1, who becoming the only person in the club paying in money, suddenly see the workforce of 27 getting very peed off because there salaries are slashed ever since person 2 who was treated so badly by them in the past, finally had enough and left.

The EU is a sinking ship as it is, with mass unemployment, civil unrest, countries going, or close to going bust.

We will be free to trade with the rest of the world as well as the EU. I think in the medium to long term, they need us more than we need them. If we were Bulgaria, or Estonia, I may agree with you. But we are the UK, and have one of the strongest economises in the world. Don't worry. We'll be okay.

Has you got lost at the second sentence, I will post the rest again for you. That's if you have the energy of moving the mouse, as your arm must ache with all that white flag waving you seem to be doing.

No deal will mean we will agree a new final date and work towards it. No pay outs. No terms we don't like, and nothing will change.... to begin with. We will agree things like citizens rights etc as we go, document by documents. If we don't agree on something, it won't happen.

I think we will leave on the 29th. I think we will leave without a deal. We will have a transition period. The EU would be blowing its own brains out if we didn't. Could you image the unrest in Germany is they couldn't exports cars to us. Could you image the French if there wine industry died because they couldn't export to us!!! These countries are on the brink as it is with civil unrest amongst its people. Are the leaders going to allow that to happen. Are they hell! There will be civil unrest over the whole of the EU. The far right will have a field day!

But I think we will barely notice a difference to begin with. If you really think we will be cast adrift by the EU, then I think you are wrong.

They are bluffing. We it becomes obvious to them that we will have to leave without a deal, they will rewrite the laws, in typical EU fashion, and do all the can to make it as easy as transition as possible, because if we get ****ed up, the EU gets ****ed up, and they know that, and are not about to allow that to happen, no matter how big and tough they look at the moment.

Our biggest mistake was trying to negotiate with a bully. We should have played hard ball from day one, and prepared for no deal from day one. They would have come crawling to us little Oliver Twist looking for gruel had we done that. As it is, we have given them the upper hand, because we have a wet fart running the country.

Best thing she can do now, is put it to the vote, let parliament kick it out, and then go full throttle towards no deal........... we may then find the EU trying a little harder to obtain a deal. I am still convinced they think we are going to call it off and stay. We need to prove that won't happen, then and only then, can we get serious with them.

Wow !... just WOW ! How come you are not Brexit Minister already ?

 

[Tubby-McFat-Fuc]

Wow !... just WOW ! How come you are not Brexit Minister already ?

I know. Shocking aint it!

 

[Baldseagull]

That's the Treasury that want us to remain, and that were employed by the government to produce figures that supported the remain campaign, producing figures for a style of trade agreement that we won't get. It didn't have those caveats on the posters did it. They said we will be £4,300 worse off. We won't. It was a lie.

If you multiply £4300 by the number of UK households, you get the figure that represents a 6.2% difference in expected GDP's from Remaining and Leaving and striking a Canada style FTA. It isn't a lie, it is an indication of how much better or worse off the country would be. I doubt we will end up in a Canada style FTA with the EU, but it was/is one of the possibilities, there were other assessments, one on a Norway model, one on a Swiss model, one on Canada style and one on No Deal and WTO trading terms. Of those I think a Canada style FTA was/is preferred by most Leave campaigners, and the figures this produced were not as bad as the No Deal, WTO model, so I think it a fair model to take as representative.

 

[The Rivet]

Typical Tory , sooner they are gone the better

I would want to be 'gone' from those stupid harpies too!

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Labour chief whip Nick Brown just told parliamentary Labour Party that @jeremycorbyn will table no-confidence motion in entire government under Fixed Term Parliament Act if [MENTION=37204]the[/MENTION]resa_may refuses to give time tomorrow for no-confidence vote in her, Labour MP tells me.


He won’t

 

[Triggaaar]

Not looking for an argument-merely clarification:

What figures from which sources do you have that support your claims that "It was a lie"?

May's deal would mean free trade, as we currently have. The Bank of England estimate that our GDP could be 1% lower after 5 years' time than if we had remained in. So if 6.2% is £4,300, then 1% would be under £700.

Before the economy goes totally tits up (more than it has at the moment) wouldn't it make sense to put Article 50 on pause until ALL of the facts have been presented to us all? From Both Sides.

I don't think we'll ever get all the facts from both sides. This is politics, so each side will spin the information they have to make their case look better/the alternative case look worse.

Let both sides present things exactly as they are-without the Bullshit.

That would be a Christmas miracle.

If Leave can show us exactly what will happen after March 29 2019 and that things will be significantly better than they are at the moment then you'll have won your argument for us to leave.

I'm not even arguing for us to leave. I'm just balancing some of the one sided comments on here. The suggestion that the Leave campaign lied with its bus slogan, while the Remain campaign was somehow honest is not true.

 

[portslade seagull]

If you multiply £4300 by the number of UK households, you get the figure that represents a 6.2% difference in expected GDP's from Remaining and Leaving and striking a Canada style FTA. It isn't a lie, it is an indication of how much better or worse off the country would be. I doubt we will end up in a Canada style FTA with the EU, but it was/is one of the possibilities, there were other assessments, one on a Norway model, one on a Swiss model, one on Canada style and one on No Deal and WTO trading terms. Of those I think a Canada style FTA was/is preferred by most Leave campaigners, and the figures this produced were not as bad as the No Deal, WTO model, so I think it a fair model to take as representative.

It was a lie. It was also 4300 per worker not household.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Exactly the same as flights. As it stands we cannot fly out of the UK because we fly under EU law. We can block nearly all of Irelands flights into the EU. We can block nearly all European flights to North America, if we leave with a deal, as there will be nothing in place to allow us to fly.

So, what will happen. Someone will pass an amendment or temporary law to allow us to fly, and allow us to keep the skies open.

Just the same I believe the EU will agree to a temporary law on allowing us to continue to trade as we are now. Because both sides hurt if we do not. Either the EU will give us a temporary deal exactly the same as it is now, or the WTO will pass a law to let us trade as we do under EU as we do now.

Both completely un-thinkable to you at the moment, but as necessary as the aviation situation.

Off course they are not going to say that right at this moment in time, but I don't the EU want to **** themselves up, any more than we do.

Because in my opinion, the chances of us not being able to freely trade on 30th March, is as likely as us not being able to fly on 30th March, and closing North America to most EU flights, which is a big fat ZERO

UK to remain in Common Transit Convention after Brexit

Continued membership of the convention will ensure simplified cross-border trade for UK businesses exporting their goods.....The UK is currently a member of the CTC while it is in the EU, and has successfully negotiated membership in its own right after Brexit. This would apply to any new trading relationship with the EU or in the unlikely event of a no deal.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/uk-to-remain-in-common-transit-convention-after-brexit

 

[Triggaaar]

If you multiply £4300 by the number of UK households, you get the figure that represents a 6.2% difference in expected GDP's from Remaining and Leaving and striking a Canada style FTA. It isn't a lie, it is an indication of how much better or worse off the country would be.

It was a lie, and I will detail why.

Firstly, the figure is wrong. The figure is looking at GDP per household - total GDP, divided by the number of households. However, that is not how you measure the actual amount each household gets. GDP is currently about £1.8tn a year which divided by 27 million households gives you £66,667 per household. But the average household income is about £44,000. So you can't attribute a drop in GDP to a drop in household income on a pound for pound basis. So it's a complete lie.

Secondly, it's an estimate on what could happen were we to take a deal that we're not likely to take. The poster doesn't say 'households could be £x worse off if we follow the Canada deal', it says that the cost to UK families will be £4,300 if we leave the EU. The poster acts like that is a fact, when clearly it isn't (even if the figure was correct, which it isn't).

Lastly, regarding the poster, the Treasury Select Committee said:
“Neither government departments nor other spokespeople for the remain side should repeat [this] mistaken assertion… to persist with this claim would be to misrepresent the Treasury’s own work.’