[Politics] Brexit

[beorhthelm]

and can we please just agree on one negative thing from the EU - the poxy GDPR compliance popup/overlays on just about every commercial website? until a few months ago, a little cookies bar, which you could ignore. not now, its full on do you agree or not agree, the later of which leads to maze of options and sometimes literally hundreds of third parties to deactviate. so do you agree to everything, try to navigate the many options, or leave?

on typing this, i feel like its a metaphor for the relationship with EU.

 

[Weststander]

They need those seats, but they also need seat gains in Scotland and elsewhere. Aside from whatever motions Momentum and a pro-EU membership may put forward at conference, the Unions and their members will have a view on things too, particularly in regards to single market access and jobs in Labour constituencies that may be negatively affected how things go - it's a very difficult balancing act they face.

Modern Labour conferences since John Smith / Blair, are short, carefully stage-managed and never produce the fireworks expected. Making it dull.

There may wbe a typical fudge of people feeling they've expressed their views on Remain etc, but it's passed on to the Shadow Cabinet or National Executive to handle later. In other words, Brexit Corbyn and McDonnell will get their way.

 

[Hampster Gull]

and can we please just agree on one negative thing from the EU - the poxy GDPR compliance popup/overlays on just about every commercial website? until a few months ago, a little cookies bar, which you could ignore. not now, its full on do you agree or not agree, the later of which leads to maze of options and sometimes literally hundreds of third parties to deactviate. so do you agree to everything, try to navigate the many options, or leave?

on typing this, i feel like its a metaphor for the relationship with EU.

GDPR is great, my inbox is now full of relevant emails rather than bombarded by adverts from companies I have never of

 

[Wardy's twin]

A BIT LIKE THE COMMON AGRICULTURAL POLICY
regards
DR

too subtle for me

 

[Weststander]

It is time for the sensible members within Labour, Tory and Liberal Parties to take the initiative and form a broad centralist part which puts the interests of the majority of the British people first and that includes stopping the shambles and try to repair the damage.

Nice sentiments.

I feel that would work on so many matters - NHS, Railways, Pensions, Financing Care in Old Age, Taxation, etc.

But unfortunately in the real world, all the parties are out to destroy each other in a power grab at Council, Constituency and Parliamentary level. Not helped by the modern mouthy shit-stirring style of media coverage, thriving on division and 'bad news'.

Very few are prepared to compromise and work to solve long term issues in the national interest.

 

[pastafarian]

Revoke Article 50, tell the country that she will prepare a proper truthful plan which will be laid out in detail, so the public can understand it, and then allow another vote in two years time.

That's too much like common sense for any politician.

I doubt any sensible political outfit would propose your unworkable scenario as a political strategy.
Any finalised detailed plan for leaving the EU can only come about whilst using the processes of negotiations at the same time, as all detailed plans are subject to negotiations.
We all know (well nearly all) that negotiations can only commence after a country has notified the EU of its intention to Leave in accordance with Article 50, there are no negotiations on a nations withdrawal deal prior to notification.

 

[The Rivet]

Do people actually read stuff like that and think. Hmmm, yeah good points Melanie. Well, clearly they do otherwise we wouldn't be in this hellish mess. It's mind boggling and would be funny, but......

You seem to think valid points as just 'stuff like that'? There are good points indeed. You seem a little shallow on the 'points' except the superficial 'point scoring'.

 

[ferring seagull]

But he should have jumped ship in mid channel in a force 8 !

 

[Billy the Fish]

Now I know you're on a wind up. There are 751 MEPs of which the UK have 73.

This explains how the European Parliament works. It's not just MEPs but each head of state as well.

[tweet]1002591845812244481[/tweet]

[MENTION=14365]Thunder Bolt[/MENTION] some bedtime reading for you:
http://www.europarl.europa.eu/unitedkingdom/en/your-meps/uk_meps/south_east_region.html
These are our elected MEPs and the voting bloc they are affiliated to. You haven't got a clue what any of these groups stand for and neither have I. Neither have 99% of the population.

I only brought this up because the tweet you embedded said our elected MEP gets to vote on laws, as of that is some kind of great benefit.
My point is that they've taken democracy and wrapped it up in so much process and bureaucracy that it's diluted to the point that it doesn't make a bit of difference who we vote for.
MEPs don't vote for or against UK interests, they vote with their EU party. The groups in the EU parliament are barely mentioned in this thread, which shows how little is known about them. If you don't agree with what they're doing you can't kick them out, they represent the EU before the voters, it's basically a rigged game where the house always wins. In this case the house is the EU, and the game is control and power.

 

[pastafarian]

Here's another (just so Billy can have another go)

https://twitter.com/petertimmins3/status/1015861065803059201

[tweet]1015861065803059201[/tweet]

Only on twatter.

The rebate doesn’t end our payments to the budget of a club we don’t want to be members of.
Not being in schengen doesn’t allow us to take back control of our EU borders and place the same entry requirements on EU citizens as we do with non EU citizens.
An MEP having a vote doesn’t give back the lawmaking controls parliament lost to Brussels.

Who comes up with this guff

 

[ferring seagull]

To some extent I feel sorry for any government where the opposition have not ever taken any sensible stance on this HUGE issue thus preventing any beneficial discussion ( for what is a hugely important issue and one for which the majority of the UK population voted in favour) rightly or wrongly.

 

[BadFish]

Nice sentiments.

I feel that would work on so many matters - NHS, Railways, Pensions, Financing Care in Old Age, Taxation, etc.

But unfortunately in the real world, all the parties are out to destroy each other in a power grab at Council, Constituency and Parliamentary level. Not helped by the modern mouthy shit-stirring style of media coverage, thriving on division and 'bad news'.

Very few are prepared to compromise and work to solve long term issues in the national interest.

I agree that shorttermism and childish power struggles are strangling real progress n many areas.

So the question is, how do we let the politicians know that this is the will of the people?

Or are there too many people duped by the right v left narrative?

 

[BadFish]

How people can direct their ire towards Brussels while voting in government after government who represent the interests of themselves, their cronies, the banks and big business over the people who put the X in the box is beyond me.

Brexit or Remain.

Nothing is going to improve in politics while you are still voting these clowns into power.

 

[The Rivet]

How people can direct their ire towards Brussels while voting in government after government who represent the interests of themselves, their cronies, the banks and big business over the people who put the X in the box is beyond me.

Brexit or Remain.

Nothing is going to improve in politics while you are still voting these clowns into power.

Then there is no vote worth making. Nobody to vote for, after all democracy would have been eviscerated.

 

[Ninja Elephant]

To some extent I feel sorry for any government where the opposition have not ever taken any sensible stance on this HUGE issue thus preventing any beneficial discussion ( for what is a hugely important issue and one for which the majority of the UK population voted in favour) rightly or wrongly.

Are you taking the piss? The opposition are to blame for the utter chaos that is our current minority government?!

 

[BadFish]

Then there is no vote worth making. Nobody to vote for, after all democracy would have been eviscerated.

There is no party or candidate that represents the people?

The pigs at the trough have won.

 

[Baldseagull]

Now I know you're on a wind up. There are 751 MEPs of which the UK have 73.

This explains how the European Parliament works. It's not just MEPs but each head of state as well.

[tweet]1002591845812244481[/tweet]

Don't give them facts, they know the EU is undemocratic because they keep saying so in the Sun and the Mail.

 

[Questions]

Agreed. However, these pages indicate that some people, unbelievably, actually think they can argue that it hasn't happened!

You are working on an assumption that all the Brexit ins and outs had been set out prior to the referendum.” We have some hard negotiations ahead of us”
A pound for every time I heard something along those lines. The real cry babies are not remainers who cannot accept the result but the leavers who want to pull up the drawbridge, stay in some sort of isolation bubble at the cost of the people of the UK and are not getting their way.
It’s making the best of a bad lot now.

 

[sussex_guy2k2]

Little by little Labour are going to be forced to declare where they stand on Brexit. I can see JC being the 'man of the people' and responding to the mess by offering another referendum following an election. The way this is going on I think this would get him in government

He’d have to. Because anyone worth their salt can see through his cowardice on the whole issue up to this point.

 

[sussex_guy2k2]

How people can direct their ire towards Brussels while voting in government after government who represent the interests of themselves, their cronies, the banks and big business over the people who put the X in the box is beyond me.

Brexit or Remain.

Nothing is going to improve in politics while you are still voting these clowns into power.

And we’re still voting these clowns in (and I include the current potential Labour government in that) because we have a flawed political system that allows them power without forcing them to do anything remotely worthwhile for it. You can’t ask politicians to represent the people when there’s a voting system in place that represents only a tiny minority of our country.