[Politics] Brexit

[Hamilton]

I had nothing to correct. I expanded on my original comments several times until you got the point.

You keep it up sunshine. You didn't need to raise any particular race to make your point but you did. I'll leave it there.


Sent from my iPhone in a non-Calde world :-(

 

[yxee]

Scotland would never be able to join alone exactly because of the Spanish issue with Catalonia. Expect similar issues with Serbia/Kosovo when they join. Sturgeon knows the only way they can stay in is to split with the UK BEFORE article 50. After that, it's one hell of a risk to gain independence and then try and fail to rejoin the EU.

 

[The Rivet]

My wife voted in, I voted out - far from being a frosty atmosphere its actually got us talking and debating the issues quite amicably. Kids are 13 & 9 so not really any interest in it.

My kids are in their twenties and we talk, we respect we may have different views. Vote in private and continue the debate afterwards. Have to admit it has been LIVELY though!

 

[Seagull58]

Yes - I agree - but it's not beyond the realms of possibility to imagine a threshold that would be unlikely to be reached except in unusual circumstances (which is pretty much what we have now, with the UK economy doing much better than most of the rest of the EU).

I would assume the majority of Brexiters always wanted free trade without political integration. Who would not want free trade in preference to import tariffs? The sticking point is free movement.

 

[neilbard]

 

[yxee]

In other news, the FTSE100 is now higher than last Thursday.

How many trillions of pounds does that mean we created today?

 

[The Rivet]

I would assume the majority of Brexiters always wanted free trade without political integration. You would not want free trade in preference to import tariffs? The sticking point is free movement.

Yep, the 'holy grail' answer we all seek the answer to, 'uncontrolled' immigration!

 

[BensGrandad]

Any truth in the story that none of the England team voted as nobody could put a cross in the box.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Yep, the 'holy grail' answer we all seek the answer to, 'uncontrolled' immigration!

I'm suspecting it will be some sort of fudge deal that saves face for the EU and UK. We'll have free trade / free movement, but some form of lock out if a certain set of circumstances occur like numbers/against GDP/against some arbitrary statistic would mean the UK could put controls in place. The government can turn around and say 'we have secured the free market with immigration controls', the EU can say 'the deal includes free movement'. That the controls will in all likelihood be difficult to ever trigger, it will be a right royal political fudge.

 

[Jim in the West]

From the ft.com about an hour ago - it would be hilarious if it wasn't so serious:

Michael Gove’s wife says Brexit result ‘terrifying’
Sarah Vine indicates reaction of Leave camp in her regular Daily Mail column

Michael Gove’s wife has described the EU referendum result as “terrifying”, in another indication that Leave campaigners may not have expected to win Thursday’s vote on EU membership. Writing in the Daily Mail, Sarah Vine said she wrongly thought that polling day “would bring an end to months of uncertainty and anxiety.” Her account is the latest example of Mr Gove and Boris Johnson making their views known through newspaper columns, rather than press conferences or speeches.

The two men made a brief, sombre statement on Friday morning, but took no questions. Mr Johnson wrote his weekly column for Monday’s Daily Telegraph about the terms on which Britain could leave the EU. But it contained several errors — including stating that the pound was trading at higher levels than in 2013 and 2014, and suggesting that UK citizens could still enjoy free movement. Friends later said it was written “too quickly”. “Everyone’s exhausted,” said one person involved in the Vote Leave campaign. “There’s a lot in play, and there’s a lot going on behind the scenes.” Such behaviour has gone down poorly with European leaders and some Conservative MPs, who say Leave should have been prepared for the aftermath of a victory. In response, Leave campaigners have said it was the government’s duty to have performed contingency planning before the vote.

In a previous column in February, Ms Vine wrote about a dinner at the Johnsons’ house, shortly before the two men backed Brexit. “As dinner was being served, it got even more bizarre. A senior Cabinet minister, accompanied by a lawyer, came on speakerphone to discuss the complexities of law in relation to sovereignty. Michael and Boris leaned into the iPhone, Boris firing questions at it, Michael making listening noises,” she recalled. On Wednesday, she described how her husband was woken at 4.45am on the morning of the result, by a caller saying, “Michael, guess what? We’ve won!” “Gosh, I suppose I had better get up,” he said. By that stage, the UK Independence party leader Nigel Farage had already given a victory speech, congratulating Leave campaigners on winning “without a bullet being fired”. Ms Vine expressed surprise at the result: “What I thought would bring to an end to months of uncertainty and anxiety — polling day itself — has, in fact, turned out to be merely the start of it. It’s not that I didn’t think Leave could win. It was just that they were up against a rival campaign with all the money, all the power and all the scare stories.” “[Voters] ignored all the threats and lies, and voted according to their principles. Which, from where I’m standing, makes the result even more terrifying,” she added.

Mr Gove is supporting Mr Johnson’s campaign to become Conservative party leader after David Cameron announced his resignation on Friday. The two men met as students at Oxford university, where Mr Gove supported Mr Johnson’s campaign to become president of the Oxford Union 30 years ago. “I was Boris’s stooge. I became a votary of the Boris cult,” the justice secretary wrote in 2005. Mr Johnson was elected Union president, after he renounced his Conservative ties and posed as a supporter of the Social Democrats, the university’s largest political grouping.

 

[The Rivet]

From the ft.com about an hour ago - it would be hilarious if it wasn't so serious:

Michael Gove’s wife says Brexit result ‘terrifying’
Sarah Vine indicates reaction of Leave camp in her regular Daily Mail column

Michael Gove’s wife has described the EU referendum result as “terrifying”, in another indication that Leave campaigners may not have expected to win Thursday’s vote on EU membership. Writing in the Daily Mail, Sarah Vine said she wrongly thought that polling day “would bring an end to months of uncertainty and anxiety.” Her account is the latest example of Mr Gove and Boris Johnson making their views known through newspaper columns, rather than press conferences or speeches.

The two men made a brief, sombre statement on Friday morning, but took no questions. Mr Johnson wrote his weekly column for Monday’s Daily Telegraph about the terms on which Britain could leave the EU. But it contained several errors — including stating that the pound was trading at higher levels than in 2013 and 2014, and suggesting that UK citizens could still enjoy free movement. Friends later said it was written “too quickly”. “Everyone’s exhausted,” said one person involved in the Vote Leave campaign. “There’s a lot in play, and there’s a lot going on behind the scenes.” Such behaviour has gone down poorly with European leaders and some Conservative MPs, who say Leave should have been prepared for the aftermath of a victory. In response, Leave campaigners have said it was the government’s duty to have performed contingency planning before the vote.

In a previous column in February, Ms Vine wrote about a dinner at the Johnsons’ house, shortly before the two men backed Brexit. “As dinner was being served, it got even more bizarre. A senior Cabinet minister, accompanied by a lawyer, came on speakerphone to discuss the complexities of law in relation to sovereignty. Michael and Boris leaned into the iPhone, Boris firing questions at it, Michael making listening noises,” she recalled. On Wednesday, she described how her husband was woken at 4.45am on the morning of the result, by a caller saying, “Michael, guess what? We’ve won!” “Gosh, I suppose I had better get up,” he said. By that stage, the UK Independence party leader Nigel Farage had already given a victory speech, congratulating Leave campaigners on winning “without a bullet being fired”. Ms Vine expressed surprise at the result: “What I thought would bring to an end to months of uncertainty and anxiety — polling day itself — has, in fact, turned out to be merely the start of it. It’s not that I didn’t think Leave could win. It was just that they were up against a rival campaign with all the money, all the power and all the scare stories.” “[Voters] ignored all the threats and lies, and voted according to their principles. Which, from where I’m standing, makes the result even more terrifying,” she added.

Mr Gove is supporting Mr Johnson’s campaign to become Conservative party leader after David Cameron announced his resignation on Friday. The two men met as students at Oxford university, where Mr Gove supported Mr Johnson’s campaign to become president of the Oxford Union 30 years ago. “I was Boris’s stooge. I became a votary of the Boris cult,” the justice secretary wrote in 2005. Mr Johnson was elected Union president, after he renounced his Conservative ties and posed as a supporter of the Social Democrats, the university’s largest political grouping.

Dear oh dear.

 

[c0lz]

Interesting read.

11 Countries Gearing Up to Strike Trade Deals With Britain

While Brexit doom-mongers have been focussing on the challenges of keeping access to the EU’s single market (16% of global trade – less once we’re gone), they forget there is a world elsewhere.European Free Trade Area (EFTA)

Green shoots are already emerging, as other countries start to realise the possibilities of free trade deals with a newly-liberated Britain, less than a week after the referendum:

http://heatst.com/uk/11-countries-gearing-up-to-strike-trade-deals-with-britain/

 

[Hampster Gull]

In other news, the FTSE100 is now higher than last Thursday.

How many trillions of pounds does that mean we created today?

My shares, mainly denominated in dollars, is doing fantastically well thanks. Will need to consider coming out before Trump has the chance to win

 

[Seagull58]

I'm suspecting it will be some sort of fudge deal that saves face for the EU and UK. We'll have free trade / free movement, but some form of lock out if a certain set of circumstances occur like numbers/against GDP/against some arbitrary statistic would mean the UK could put controls in place. The government can turn around and say 'we have secured the free market with immigration controls', the EU can say 'the deal includes free movement'. That the controls will in all likelihood be difficult to ever trigger, it will be a right royal political fudge.

It could be seen as a pragmatic solution that satisfies both parties and achieves the objective.

 

[Bold Seagull]

It could be seen as a pragmatic solution that satisfies both parties and achieves the objective.

As Bernie Ecclestone once said, the best deals are where no one leaves entirely happy.

 

[Soulman]

There has been talk that Australia and New Zealand are looking into a free trade and free movement agreement with the UK which is apparently supported by Daniel Hannan. Further evidence that immigration was not really the main issue.

" immigration was not really the main issue"......hallelujah, immigration was always just about controlled immigration, most were fed up with the laws and trading/red tape and the massive cost of being a member and accountability to the EU faceless decision makers.
We can have our own EU free trade deals.

 

[Seagull58]

Interesting read.

11 Countries Gearing Up to Strike Trade Deals With Britain

While Brexit doom-mongers have been focussing on the challenges of keeping access to the EU’s single market (16% of global trade – less once we’re gone), they forget there is a world elsewhere.European Free Trade Area (EFTA)

Green shoots are already emerging, as other countries start to realise the possibilities of free trade deals with a newly-liberated Britain, less than a week after the referendum:

http://heatst.com/uk/11-countries-gearing-up-to-strike-trade-deals-with-britain/

The government should get a negotiating team up and running ASAP and talking with the US, India, Australia, China, South Korea, the African groupings etc. We can get all of this in progress without waiting for EU negotiations.

 

[B-right-on]

The FTSE 100 Index closes today at a higher level than pre Brexit.

So where are the doom mongers today?

Interestingly the DAX hasnt event recovered 50% of its pre-Brexit level.

 

[The Rivet]

The government should get a negotiating team up and running ASAP and talking with the US, India, Australia, China, South Korea, the African groupings etc. We can get all of this in progress without waiting for EU negotiations.

Yes I think that's already happening behind the scenes. Regardless that Cameron is resigning, this country is savvy enough to know where to go. Most countries believe we have the best civil servants in the world. Remoaners slag us, I say they underestimate us.

 

[Soulman]

Interesting read.

11 Countries Gearing Up to Strike Trade Deals With Britain

While Brexit doom-mongers have been focussing on the challenges of keeping access to the EU’s single market (16% of global trade – less once we’re gone), they forget there is a world elsewhere.European Free Trade Area (EFTA)

Green shoots are already emerging, as other countries start to realise the possibilities of free trade deals with a newly-liberated Britain, less than a week after the referendum:

http://heatst.com/uk/11-countries-gearing-up-to-strike-trade-deals-with-britain/

Great news, though not surprising, we are in a great position now to trade.