[Politics] Brexit

[Stat Brother]

With the amount of back tracking um and ahhing, head scratching and verbal shrugging from those in charge of Brexit, wouldn't it be better to wait and see if the first referendum is implemented?

 

[GoldWithFalmer]

8 million might SING it tonight but the minute the Government heed it then democracy is finished

Yes and with that this thread is CLOSED.

 

[Westdene Wonder]

We manufacture f*ck all. The EU will be fine without us

And [MENTION=11928]vegster[/MENTION] we were voted against 70 times and voted with, thousands. We did alright.

There are already other countries thinking of following us, thats why so many threats were made,already Obama has confessed we still have a special relelaiontship with the USA

 

[GoldWithFalmer]

With the amount of back tracking um and ahhing, head scratching and verbal shrugging from those in charge

sounds like one of your bike riding clubs

 

[GoldWithFalmer]

There are already other countries thinking of following us, thats why so many threats were made,already Obama has confessed we still have a special relelaiontship with the USA

Step forth Trump and being a major fan of the UK and Brexit our problems are solved......might see WW3 as a trade off though

 

[Triggaaar]

I'd expect to see a Swiss style agreement covering free trade, paying into the EU budget and free movement of labour as the final settlement

As long as that includes services, that would be best for all.

........which doesn't address the issue of migration that caused so many to vote leave.

Many, yes, but less than half of our voters.

 

[Scotchegg]

I have been more than happy in the referendum to debate the issues. I respect the Remain point of view. However I struggle with the concept that the debate is settled by switching on the TV and believing journalists and campaigners. This is a debate of ideas. Facts are open to interpretation. I accept that we disagree but your wish to impose a 'truth' on me is somewhat worrying.

To be honest I'm pretty grouchy about the result as I only see it as a losing situation, I probably shouldn't be commenting at the moment, especially here, I come here for the football not politics. However, I will say that I'm not talking about TV prior to the referendum, at that point it was a shower, with an awful lot of twaddle from all sides. I'm talking about the news since Friday morning. It's really not been bright and I'm really struggling to see how the leave voters are so happy. It's infuriating to see all this bad news on our economy and prospects, only to see a leave voter smug because "we got our country back" or some such soundbite.

I'm not only talking about British news here either. Globally people are looking in at the situation and thinking the same thing. The damage to our economy is plane for everyone to see. Pound crashing, trillions gone from the economy, which by the way should now be the third biggest in Europe seeing how France overtook us since the crash after the vote and people looking in bewildered at what we've done. I'm not a huge nationalist to be fair, but even I'm sore when I read news and speak to my international friends and everyone is asking the same thing "what have you done this for?". I'm with them frankly, it's turkeys voting for Christmas as far as I can see.

Granted it could all be short term problems, but I'm just not a fan of self harm, it's that simple. I suppose the difference between me and the common leave voter would be that the reasons for all this self harm were trivial to me and I was more interested in the route of attempting to fix the EU from the inside rather than sack it off. I just really see no plus points right now and it's bewildering the level of denial from the leave camp. You really don't feel any concern at the state of the pound at least? Short term or not, that's a very easy fact to see and I'd have thought must give some concern?

 

[Mo Gosfield]

When's petrol going up?

In case you haven't noticed, the operators have been stealthily moving up prices by about 15% in the last few weeks. This is at a time when crude prices are still at a very low level. The market is rigged to benefit all. The government love it, raking in massive tax revenue. The public have to have fuel and just limply pay rising prices. No questioning, just lemming like habit. The sort of lethargy and apathy that, up to Thursday typified this country.

 

[Stat Brother]

sounds like one of your bike riding clubs

Our specialty is deciding the general route.
Arrive at the roundabout 200 yards down our road.
Then each taking a different exit.

It would be funny if it weren't true.

 

[GoldWithFalmer]

Our specialty is deciding the general route.
Arrive at the roundabout 200 yards down our road.
Then each taking a different exit.

It would be funny if it weren't true.

that made me laugh.....

 

[Bwian]

Reverse phycology? Good try.

Reverse psychology? Absolutely not. As far from being a little Englander as you could imagine. Still trying to see where you get that from but don't bother, I'm not that interested.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

A lot was garnered from opinion polls also before the vote. A lot of articles in the media showing the voting demographics also, and all of them say the same thing. Young people voted overwhelmingly for remain. So, its not really peoples own private thoughts.

sure, I wasn't attempting to challenge this view. I was just responding (maybe a little too technically) to your point about exit polls.

 

[Machiavelli]

I think that is a question for the Leavers.

It is, but they might just be coming round to the view that they're not 'in control', and that they're a junior partner. They certainly have their country back, but they'll have to recognise that the twenty-first century world is configured differently, and is a multi-level world.

Two questions for the Leavers:
-- what are you going to do if Scotland leaves the UK?
-- and if this materialises, do you really think that England, Wales and a violence-ridden Northern Ireland will retain its permanent status on the UN Security Council?

 

[Fungus]

Hopefully even better ,that's what I voted for ,change and a better future time will tell if I've made a mistake today I still think I did the right thing and voted leave

In what way do you expect it to be better this time next year?

 

[GoldWithFalmer]

Two questions for the Leavers:
-- what are you going to do if Scotland leaves the UK?
-- and if this materialises, do you really think that England, Wales and a violence-ridden Northern Ireland will retain its permanent status on the UN Security Council?

When Scotland leave.....it's like Brexit, going to happen eventually......do you deny them the right? I would not but they cannot have our pound...we may need strict boarders and a dmz..they go through the proper channels,leave UK re apply for EU status get a currency..

With regards Status of UN.....we can always have land based ICBM and 2 subs.....perhaps we can find a site In Wales to house them..

Fantasy maybe.....but the Scotland issue has been brewing for years Brexit changes nothing on that front....

 

[Sussex Nomad]

Reverse psychology? Absolutely not. As far from being a little Englander as you could imagine. Still trying to see where you get that from but don't bother, I'm not that interested.

Good to see.

 

[aberdare seagull]

Just a question, two professors, have you served in the Armed Forces? I know for a fact Dave in Prague, a prominent remain poster on here is ex forces, and a Falkland vet, I'm ex forces with 15 years service, including two war zones, so don't you dare to question my patriotism.

Show us your medals

Lawro ignore two professors i am currently serving and have done close to 20 yrs at sea and voted leave but i would never question anyones patriotism, especially those that have served. Happy Armed Forces Day everyone.

 

[carlzeiss]

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Feeling the pain of your fellow Poles in the UK

 

[Two Professors]

All these bad losers keep quoting opinion polls-if you believe the opinion polls,you actually won,so what are you all whinging about?

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

To be honest I'm pretty grouchy about the result as I only see it as a losing situation, I probably shouldn't be commenting at the moment, especially here, I come here for the football not politics. However, I will say that I'm not talking about TV prior to the referendum, at that point it was a shower, with an awful lot of twaddle from all sides. I'm talking about the news since Friday morning. It's really not been bright and I'm really struggling to see how the leave voters are so happy. It's infuriating to see all this bad news on our economy and prospects, only to see a leave voter smug because "we got our country back" or some such soundbite.

I'm not only talking about British news here either. Globally people are looking in at the situation and thinking the same thing. The damage to our economy is plane for everyone to see. Pound crashing, trillions gone from the economy, which by the way should now be the third biggest in Europe seeing how France overtook us since the crash after the vote and people looking in bewildered at what we've done. I'm not a huge nationalist to be fair, but even I'm sore when I read news and speak to my international friends and everyone is asking the same thing "what have you done this for?". I'm with them frankly, it's turkeys voting for Christmas as far as I can see.

Granted it could all be short term problems, but I'm just not a fan of self harm, it's that simple. I suppose the difference between me and the common leave voter would be that the reasons for all this self harm were trivial to me and I was more interested in the route of attempting to fix the EU from the inside rather than sack it off. I just really see no plus points right now and it's bewildering the level of denial from the leave camp. You really don't feel any concern at the state of the pound at least? Short term or not, that's a very easy fact to see and I'd have thought must give some concern?

Thank you for your reply. I understand you are disappointed with the result. There are quite a few posts on here from Remainers who seem to be possessed of a 'truth' and they sound like members of a religious cult. Quite alarming. If I misinterpreted you I apologise.
Regarding your analysis of market moves since Thursday the answer to your question is that no I am not particularly concerned. The pound has weakened and this is bad for imports/inflation but it is extremely good for our export industries. There is a devaluation competition happening globally (particularly in Asia) as countries try to kickstart their export industries and it could be argued that we have got ahead of this process. Trillions have not gone from the economy. The stock market is higher than last summer and the 'hot money' that travels around the world looking for arbitrage trading opportunities makes money for its speculative owners but plays no part in the real economy.
I am also not a nationalist but I do not want a society to be built upon the values of the owners of capital. People are not a commodity to be used as cheap labour to generate profit. The economy within the EU is designed to increase inequality and since the vote I have become very optimistic about the future. This is my view. I accept I may be wrong as I don't possess some sort of 'truth'. I believe in democracy. I suppose my alarm comes from a realization that many other people do not wish to debate. They would rather impose their view on me based upon some sort of defect I may have on the basis of my intelligence, age, perceived racism or whatever other criteria. Scary.