[Politics] Brexit

[Herr Tubthumper]

I'm doing a booze cruise to Belgium next month

I'm doing one to Britain. Even that poncy craft beer is cheap as chips now.

 

[The Clamp]

Good riddance but they won't go and I think you know that

There were a load of announcements from city banks yesterday that they are putting in motion the move to secure EU nations. So yes, they are going.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp....ks-set-to-pull-out-of-brexit-uk?client=safari

It seems that despite our local Brexiteers attempts to convince everyone otherwise Brexit is having a devastating effect on our economy and our future ability to continue to trade and to hold onto industry in the UK. I guess it will be dismissed as "project fear" but frankly I'll be observing the actions of banks and industry to guage where we're headed as oppose to the likes of the Fairy Godfathers on here! Haha! If it wasn't so serious it'd be funny.

 

[yxee]

There were a load of announcements from city banks yesterday that they are putting in motion the move to secure EU nations. So yes, they are going.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp....ks-set-to-pull-out-of-brexit-uk?client=safari

It seems that despite our local Brexiteers attempts to convince everyone otherwise Brexit is having a devastating effect on our economy and our future ability to continue to trade and to hold onto industry in the UK. I guess it will be dismissed as "project fear" but frankly I'll be observing the actions of banks and industry to guage where we're headed as oppose to the likes of the Fairy Godfathers on here! Haha! If it wasn't so serious it'd be funny.

So you're "observing the actions to gauge where we're heading", but at the same time you conclude that "Brexit is having a devastating effect on our economy" on the basis of someone's words, rather than their actions. If you were really observing actions, wouldn't you wait until banks do relocate before making this judgement?

What a totally incoherent post.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...s-what-theresa-may-really-thinks-about-brexit

 

[The Clamp]

So you're "observing the actions to gauge where we're heading", but at the same time you conclude that "Brexit is having a devastating effect on our economy" on the basis of someone's words, rather than their actions. If you were really observing actions, wouldn't you wait until banks do relocate before making this judgement?

What a totally incoherent post.

You're simply ignoring FACTS in a failed attempt to back up your weak viewpoint. The banks ARE going. You clearly didn't read the article. Try reading the article, my post becomes remarkably coherent once you bother to read the evidence. Jesus wept.

 

[Soulman]

Might be best to have a thread with articles about what might happen, then scrub them off when they don't. After the predictions pre and some post the Referendum we would still be on the first page.

 

[beorhthelm]

There were a load of announcements from city banks yesterday that they are putting in motion the move to secure EU nations. So yes, they are going.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp....ks-set-to-pull-out-of-brexit-uk?client=safari

no there was not "a load of announcments". there was an opinion piece from the British Bankers Association stating that Banks are looking at what operations might need to move - what a surprise! read original peice, it was aimed as much at EU to not play hardball as they risk restricting EU based financial services to the markets established in London:

London will survive as a global financial centre. Finance is inventive and will find a way through. But putting up barriers to the trade in financial services across the Channel will make us all worse off, not just in the UK but in mainland Europe.

anyone paying attention can see that some operations will likely move to EU, but wholesale bank moves are unlikely, neither the banks nor the european nation's regulators want that.

 

[Soulman]

no there was not "a load of announcments". there was an opinion piece from the British Bankers Association stating that Banks are looking at what operations might need to move - what a surprise! read original peice, it was aimed as much at EU to not play hardball as they risk restricting EU based financial services to the markets established in London:


anyone paying attention can see that some operations will likely move to EU, but wholesale bank moves are unlikely, neither the banks nor the european nation's regulators want that.

Yes yes yes yes, no no no no, "you're simply ignoring the FACTS ".

 

[The Clamp]

Might be best to have a thread with articles about what might happen, then scrub them off when they don't. After the predictions pre and some post the Referendum we would still be on the first page.

I am More inclined to heed the warnings of Browne et al than the head in sand ramblings of the small cluster of Brexiteers on here.
Basically what has been happening is reasonable, sensible experts (I know, you're sick of them) forecast a turn, your mob dismisses it as project fear, the forecast proves true, your mob say "look, we all knew it wasn't going to be easy, it's not all about money, stop wetting yourself, give it ten years, we knew this was going to happen". Did you balls. You knew nothing, the people that do know a thing or two, you ignore.
Astonishing.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...s-what-theresa-may-really-thinks-about-brexit

Most MPs are Remainers and there are few signs so far that they are prepared to fight for even a soft Brexit, let alone resign and invite the people to judge them on their convictions and throw them out or re-elect them. May has made it quite clear that she wants to remain in the single market but in order to placate the UKIP-tendency has repeatedly thrown up conditions that make that very unlikely. Zac Goldsmith may be cushioned by his millions but at least he is showing the courage of his convctions.

 

[BigGully]

You're simply ignoring FACTS in a failed attempt to back up your weak viewpoint. The banks ARE going. You clearly didn't read the article. Try reading the article, my post becomes remarkably coherent once you bother to read the evidence. Jesus wept.

No, you are regurgitating the Remain stance probably by a pre referendum Remainer that said precisely this pre Brexit, he as you is hurting a little bit, he genuinely thought his view held some sway, but it never did.

I am willing to see if our economy does take a medium term hit and try and see if it was exclusively down to Brexit, but I suspect it wont, there will be headlines both ways, but unless you naively expect the economy to bob along without fluctuations irrespective of the referendum you then you are simply clutching at straws, neither the pounds current value or a commentator forecasting an unlikely withdrawal and subsequent collapse of our banking industry is not proof of anything.

 

[studio150]

No, you are regurgitating the Remain stance probably by a pre referendum Remainer that said precisely this pre Brexit, he as you is hurting a little bit, he genuinely thought his view held some sway, but it never did.

I am willing to see if our economy does take a medium term hit and try and see if it does, then was it ever exclusively down to Brexit, but I suspect it wont, there will be headlines both ways, but unless you naively expect the economy to bob along without fluctuations irrespective of the referendum you then seem to be clutching at straws, neither the pounds current value or a commentator forecasting an unlikely withdrawal and subsequent collapse of our banking industry is not proof of anything.

So a lower GBP is not proof of anything?

Why is it not proof of a lack of confidence in the UK economy at the present time.

 

[studio150]

Might be best to have a thread with articles about what might happen, then scrub them off when they don't. After the predictions pre and some post the Referendum we would still be on the first page.

£350m to the NHS

When do we take this one off the list?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

neither the pounds current value [...] is not proof of anything.

Do you genuinely believe that the current nose-dive in the pound is not primarily down to a lack of confidence in sterling caused by the current Brexit situation?

And yes we all know the value has fluctuated previously (the single plank of your vague argument) and will fluctuate again but there are always reasons for this. And, as for for, I believe the current reason is, primarily, Brexit.

 

[BigGully]

So a lower GBP is not proof of anything?

Why is it not proof of a lack of confidence in the UK economy at the present time.

It seems there was always going to be some level of re-evaluation on sterling, by all accounts Remainer and Brexiteers both agree that Sterling was over valued pre referendum.

The rest is just markets doing what markets do, they flunctuate, yes sometimes due to confidence and sometimes for no particular reason that is then analysed after the event by experts, all with their own agendas.

Picking individual snippets of economic data is not a true evaluation of events.

 

[BigGully]

Do you genuinely believe that the current nose-dive in the pound is not primarily down to a lack of confidence in sterling caused by the current Brexit situation?

And yes we all know the value has fluctuated previously (the single plank of your vague argument) and will fluctuate again but there are always reasons for this. And, as for for, I believe the current reason is, primarily, Brexit.

My vague argument is no more vague than you quoting an individual bit of economic data, the value of sterling cannot be a true indicator of our economies worth, otherwise it wouldnt have been over valued pre referendum.

Why dont you use your same logic on snippets of EU data and see how it fairs ?

 

[Diego Napier]

actually the narrowness of your views is flawed.
millions do care about parliamentary accountability even though you claim its not important

millions argued we should have full control of lawmaking and be accountable to westminster, millions more argued this accountability could be served through the EU.
thats millions on each side saying accountability is important

you are a lone voice that thinks accountability is unimportant. Thankfully people like you can be counted in 3 digits.But please carry on and continue to promote the EU as your favourite way to achieve the goal of politicians not being accountable.

You repeatedly fail to understand what I'm saying because it challenges a basic tenet of your belief system. You think I have a narrow view but, as an obviously fervent servant of your religion, it's your very subjectivity that denies you the perspective to form any objective assessment.

I understand that parliamentary accountability is important to you and your beliefs and you also believe that it is important to millions of others. What I'm saying is that you are unable to separate your belief from reality and that you assume but you don't know the others who voted the same way as you in the referendum share your motivation.

Throughout history, every belief system has maintained control and order over their adherents by promising future benefits; Christian religions promise an eternal life of pleasure or pain, English Trial by Ordeal promised proof of innocence through survival, Communism promises each according to their needs, Hinduism promises reincarnation & eternal life, Capitalism promises future wealth for all, Mediaeval witch trials promised truth by drowning, the UK justice system promises truth by oath & jury, Democracy promises you accountability.

You repeat the mantras of your own religion and your opinion is based on your belief but that does not make it real or true.

You do not know that millions argued that we should have full control of lawmaking, that is your assumption. How many people know what the UK lawmaking process is? How many people know what the EU lawmaking process is? How many people know which laws were passed by the EU. Are all the laws passed by the EU bad? Which EU laws would you have challenged? How did you attempt to influence those EU laws you object to? How many people know which EU laws the UK voted against. How many people know which EU laws were significantly modified by the UK before they reached the statute books? How many people know which laws originated in the European Court of Human Rights? How many people have been informed about EU laws by tabloid? How many people have been informed about EU laws by their own basic psychological needs?

You do not know that we will have full control of lawmaking once we have left the EU, that is your assumption. Who are "we"? What is "full control"? What additional benefit will we derive? How will you personally benefit from having full control of lawmaking? What additional freedoms will you enjoy? How will your life be improved? How will UK society benefit?

Neither you can nor anyone else has described what "full control of lawmaking" entails.

You state

"millions more argued this accountability could be served through the EU"

. No they didn't, that is your assumption. Did they know what the accountability of the EU is? Do you know what accountability the EU has? Do you know what accountability the UK retains within the EU? Do those other millions?

"But please carry on and continue to promote the EU as your favourite way to achieve the goal of politicians not being accountable."

I know you're blinded by your faith but if you'd read and (here's the key) understood what I'd posted earlier on this thread then you'd realise why that comes across as such a silly little conceit.

 

[Soulman]

£350m to the NHS

When do we take this one off the list?

Take a look already removed....next.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

You're simply ignoring FACTS in a failed attempt to back up your weak viewpoint. The banks ARE going. You clearly didn't read the article. Try reading the article, my post becomes remarkably coherent once you bother to read the evidence. Jesus wept.

Have you considered the possibility that the many statements made by numerous organisations/governments/politicians re Brexit, signalling possible intent to do this or that may be as much about applying pressure, gaining concessions as any supposed hard evidence they will go anywhere?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business...ks-wont-leave-the-city-of-london-after-brexi/

All part of the negotiating progress ... Hollande/Merkel/X EU leader tell their electorate what they want to hear as does our PM. Organisations/business sectors fight their corners, then we all get down to the nitty gritty of negotiating a deal.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

My vague argument is no more vague than you quoting an individual bit of economic data, the value of sterling cannot be a true indicator of our economies worth, otherwise it wouldnt have been over valued pre referendum.

Why dont you use your same logic on snippets of EU data and see how it fairs ?

You're not answering my question

I'll ask again

Do you genuinely believe that the current nose-dive in the pound is not primarily down to a lack of confidence in sterling caused by the current Brexit situation?