JC Footy Genius
Bringer of TRUTH
- Jun 9, 2015
- 10,568
Indeed, perhaps she is having second thoughts about her decision to support the wrong side?
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[Politics] Brexit
- Thread starter KingstonSeagull
- Start date
Indeed, perhaps she is having second thoughts about her decision to support the wrong side?
I think she is trying to keep a foot in both camps which seems a strange notion but how else can you explain it?
JC Footy Genius
Bringer of TRUTH
- Jun 9, 2015
- 10,568
A cynical soul might suggest she is positioning herself for a future leadership bid .. appealing to both sides of a split party.
Good swerve at not answering the question. As you clearly didn't understand it I'll simplify it for you.
The TWO options on the table that we're voting on are :
1. Leave
2. Stay but under the agreements CMD has negotiated. One of those conditions is that the UK plays no part in further political integration. This integration I'm sure you, as a good European comrade, is a prime driver of the EU ( it's an aim written into treaty ).
So how can we stay in yet stay out of further political integration without just ending up on the sidelines, the poor member of the club. Now remember, and this might be the difficult bit for you, we have NO vote to stay as we are. See, I can be as condescending as you have been on this thread !
Foreign workers will not have to go home. In all likelihood It's doubtful immigration will fall at all, brexit or otherwise. In terms of relatives and dependents the law will change there eventually and it may be more difficult for partners and relatives without work lined up, i.e a sponsor, to get a visa.
Imports: currently we are a member of the internal market so there is no excessive paperwork within the EU. A vote to leave is a vote to end the free movement of goods and will have to go through customs clearance. This will increase the time and cost of importing from the EU. Optimistically we are able to gain access into the internal market in exchange for paying a fee and follow EU regulation like Norway does, pessimistically the negotiations drag on - it will take at least 2 years - and we don't strike a deal in the first few months. We would fall back to the WTO model. Here if you bring in "£10,000 worth of shoes imported from Spain (or wherever else) the UK border agencies would charge £800 as import duties and also collect £2,000 as VAT on the imports." There are other models - all of which are bad for the UK economy.
) The Norway option
What is it: Britain would remain part of the European Economic Area, like Norway, with access to the single market but still have to accept certain EU rules like free movement and directives agreed in Brussels.
GDP: 3.8% lower (than if UK stayed in EU).
Annual cost per household: £2,600
Annual lost tax revenues: £20bn
2) The Canada option
What is it: Britain would sign a bilateral free trade agreement with the EU, like the one Canada has negotiated – an example cited by Boris Johnson, the London Mayor, as a possible option.
GDP: 6.2% lower (than if UK stayed in EU).
Annual cost per household: £4,300
Annual lost tax revenue: £36bn
3) The World Trade Organisation option
What is it: Britain would not sign a standalone trade deal with the EU but instead rely on tariff levels set by the World Trade Organistion.
http://www.theguardian.com/small-bu...eu-referendum-brexit-change-vat-import-duties
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...-every-family-4300-a-year-treasury-forecasts/
GDP: 7.5% lower (than if UK stayed in EU).
Annual cost per household: £5,200
Annual lost tax revenue: £45bn
So things will definitely change and the cost of business will go up.
We have an opt out of ever closer union, and no obligation to join the Euro. It is a cake and eat it scenario Boris Johnson could appreciate.
Cameron's words were that references to further integration do not apply to the UK. So, if something "integrated" comes up we simply don't get involved...unless we want to off course. A bit like the numerous opt-outs we currently deploy.
pastafarian
Well-known member
No they wont suddenly have to go home,its been pointed out by both sides current regulations stay in place until changed otherwise in the negotiations or a change in the law enacted by the UK gov.
There are rules and regulations already in place regarding relatives of non uk nationals(outside of EEA),these rules would simply expand to include people of Europe as well post Brexit
Brexit negotiations will end with a trade deal being done.
Why would EU countries punish themselves and their workers by imposing lengthy controls re their trade with the UK?
More conjecture on what might happen. If the outers can't tell you for sure stay put [MENTION=21200]I remember the good times[/MENTION].
I note you haven't answered the question though.
And yet you've regularly said that if we vote in we should be fully in. By voting in you're actually voting for being a bit in and a bit out.
- Apr 13, 2015
- 3,866
How can we stay out of further integration yet be on the sidelines? We just carry on as normal. We're not a typical member because we're not in the eurozone.
Yes exactly.
pastafarian
Well-known member
i wonder
how many times are you going to copy and paste the same rubbish figures
and still refuse to admit or even mention the negotiations will be a BRITISH model and wont be an off the peg "one of the above"
10? 20? 30 times?
pastafarian
Well-known member
not conjecture at all
foreign nationals will not have to suddenly leave the country.
and you will not be sent home with your British passport from Germany
Until they are disproved? They are figures from the Treasury not from atop a cloud on Planet Brexit. I'm still waiting for any serious figures, plans, or models from the Out campaign. There is no model, there is only Brexit and be damned. Can you share the details of the bespoke model?
That's what gets negotiated in the event of a leave vote - why would 2 years ( or more depending who you believe ) of negotiations take place before the vote result was known ?
Because when you're deciding the future of the UK it's a good idea to look before you leap? What we've been told about this leap - see above - is a disaster. I really don't know what the Brexiters expect or want to happen. There is no timeline, no plan.
"look before you leap"...........some of us are fed up at what we have been looking at, some of us are looking to leap before the excreta hits the fan.