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[Politics] Brexit

If there was a second Brexit referendum how would you vote?


  • Total voters
    1,099


Bold Seagull

strong and stable with me, or...
Mar 18, 2010
30,452
Hove
Thanks. I suppose a summary is always likely to miss out essential details.

With the variables of covid and the war on top of Brexit, it's no easy task plucking out figures for what might have been.
Exactly, but perhaps uniquely the whole world was impacted by Covid and so you can measure impact through comparison with other similar economies that suffered Covid in similar ways. It's not going to be perfect, but Covid doesn't have to be a barrier for a proper attempt at an honest assessment of how Brexit has impacted the UK. Not an easy task I'll agree with you, but a necessary one I feel.
 




WATFORD zero

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 10, 2003
27,747

EU media and leaders blame Brexit for UK political ‘insanity’ as Truss quits​


Six years on from the Brexit referendum, continental observers have become used to Westminster meltdowns – but many see in the latest cataclysm the inevitable finale of a project that was always divorced from reality.

When they look, future historians would find the roots of British politics’ “current insanity” in 2016, Dittert said. “Firstly, because Brexit has damaged the UK economy so lastingly that any extra market uncertainty leads to far greater turbulence than ever before.

“Secondly, because Brexit and the inherent magical thinking of a sovereign UK that can go its own way in the globalised 21st-century world, detached from international developments, marked the beginning of the end of rational thinking on the island.”

After a succession of “implausible scenes” in parliament and No 10, “who will be Liz Truss’s successor? That’s the really big question. Because Brexit, and its chief architect Boris Johnson, have drained the Conservative party of all substance and competence.”


https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/ukne...pc=U591&cvid=67f29f6bd61946589521d4dd33f1509d

A suitable epitaph. We now need to get on with joining the Customs Union urgently.
 
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WATFORD zero

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 10, 2003
27,747
Looking forward to Thursday's budget ?

Brexit a major cause of UK’s return to austerity, says senior economist​


Brexit is the ultimate reason why the UK now faces a fresh round of austerity, a former interest rate-setter at the Bank of England has said. “The UK economy as a whole has been permanently damaged by Brexit,” Michael Saunders, a former external member of the central bank’s Monetary Policy Committee said in an interview with Bloomberg TV.

“It’s reduced the economy’s potential output significantly, eroded business investment,” he said, adding: “If we hadn’t had Brexit, we probably wouldn’t be talking about an austerity budget this week. The need for tax rises, spending cuts wouldn’t be there, if Brexit hadn’t reduced the economy’s potential output so much.”

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/oth...pc=U591&cvid=5d0e466b652846c186d7c6bafdb7e0da

Turned out nice again, hasn't it :facepalm:
 
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nicko31

Well-known member
Jan 7, 2010
18,570
Gods country fortnightly
Looking forward to Thursday's budget ?

Brexit a major cause of UK’s return to austerity, says senior economist​


Brexit is the ultimate reason why the UK now faces a fresh round of austerity, a former interest rate-setter at the Bank of England has said. “The UK economy as a whole has been permanently damaged by Brexit,” Michael Saunders, a former external member of the central bank’s Monetary Policy Committee said in an interview with Bloomberg TV.

“It’s reduced the economy’s potential output significantly, eroded business investment,” he said, adding: “If we hadn’t had Brexit, we probably wouldn’t be talking about an austerity budget this week. The need for tax rises, spending cuts wouldn’t be there, if Brexit hadn’t reduced the economy’s potential output so much.”

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/oth...pc=U591&cvid=5d0e466b652846c186d7c6bafdb7e0da

Turned out nice again, hasn't it :facepalm:
For years the governing party have pretended imposing economic sanctions on ourselves comes with a zero net cost.

Sadly it doesn't, all of us will paying long after the liars and charlatans have left the room.
 


Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
62,677
The Fatherland


London loses position as most valuable European stock market”​


I remember someone predicting this a few years ago.
 




Simster

"the man's an arse"
Jul 7, 2003
54,947
Surrey
What worries me is Starmer's refusal to look at reversing elements of Brexit when he absolutely should be. Rejoin is running at 60% and climbing (which isn't surprising as Brexiteers can't point to any successes), and the economy is going into recession, partly induced by Brexit and other similar acts of Tory incompetence.

Meanwhile, these stories of Brexit disasters are not going to be hard to come by. It's just an absolute f***ing shambles. As such, I'll try and ignore this thread. I don't want to keep reading ever increasing proof of the damage it is doing.
 


schmunk

Why oh why oh why?
Jan 19, 2018
10,338
Mid mid mid Sussex


schmunk

Why oh why oh why?
Jan 19, 2018
10,338
Mid mid mid Sussex
What worries me is Starmer's refusal to look at reversing elements of Brexit when he absolutely should be. Rejoin is running at 60% and climbing (which isn't surprising as Brexiteers can't point to any successes), and the economy is going into recession, partly induced by Brexit and other similar acts of Tory incompetence.
The problem is that those who Starmer is struggling to convince (those on the left of the party) and those who come out to vote in numbers (old people) are still more likely to be pro-Brexit. He risks (further) alienating both by the merest suggestion that it was the wrong thing to do.
 




Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
62,677
The Fatherland
"Good - It'll teach those fatcat bankers a lesson..."
i agree with this in principle but given the mess the UK economy is in, this is another set back in the long list of set backs and will prove costly, especially as it’s a a sector the UK is reliant on; it’s not just “fat cat bankers” who will be impacted. You can’t just casually brush this off with a flippant comment.
 
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nicko31

Well-known member
Jan 7, 2010
18,570
Gods country fortnightly
The problem is that those who Starmer is struggling to convince (those on the left of the party) and those who come out to vote in numbers (old people) are still more likely to be pro-Brexit. He risks (further) alienating both by the merest suggestion that it was the wrong thing to do.
I don't think re-joining is an option in the near term, you can not underestimate the trust that has been eroded by our leaders ridiculous behaviour. If it ever does happen we won't be gifted the special terms and opt outs we had which were the best of any member.

Whilst I hate to say this, Starmer strategy is correct. Winning an election first has to be a priority and then work on improving on the absolutely piss poor TCA Johnson negotiated.
 


Baldseagull

Well-known member
Jan 26, 2012
11,839
Crawley
I don't think re-joining is an option in the near term, you can not underestimate the trust that has been eroded by our leaders ridiculous behaviour. If it ever does happen we won't be gifted the special terms and opt outs we had which were the best of any member.

Whilst I hate to say this, Starmer strategy is correct. Winning an election first has to be a priority and then work on improving on the absolutely piss poor TCA Johnson negotiated.
Even I do not want the divisive debate again just yet, though I hope the next Parliament will take us towards it.
 




WATFORD zero

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 10, 2003
27,747
I don't think re-joining is an option in the near term, you can not underestimate the trust that has been eroded by our leaders ridiculous behaviour. If it ever does happen we won't be gifted the special terms and opt outs we had which were the best of any member.

Whilst I hate to say this, Starmer strategy is correct. Winning an election first has to be a priority and then work on improving on the absolutely piss poor TCA Johnson negotiated.
I think even mentioning the word Brexit would alienate (what is sadly still a not insignificant and disproportionately noisy) part of the electorate. I suspect that we will negotiate a 'special' customs union (which will look exactly like the EU one) but will be 'a British customs union' to recognise the fact that we are British. We will then gradually put back all of the sensible regulations, rules and processes to allow business to continue and maybe, just maybe, actually grow the economy ???

Unfortunately as you rightly point out, and is abundantly clear to anyone who understands the very basics of what has happened over the last 6 years, we'll never get anywhere close to the brilliant deal British politicians of all colours had managed to negotiate over the last 40 years, but let's keep that to ourselves because after all, It's in everybody's interests to 'move forward' :wink:
 
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Springal

Well-known member
Feb 12, 2005
24,779
GOSBTS
Famous lefty rag the Telegraph reporting the Paris Stock Exchange has overtaken London as Europes largest stock market

B7544AF5-3CA4-4516-A599-853D41775E50.jpeg
 






CheeseRolls

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jan 27, 2009
6,229
Shoreham Beach
Just a quick recap.

We gained the ability to negotiate our own trade deals. and then f'ed up the only ones we have managed to negotiate.
https://news.sky.com/story/george-e...failure-in-brutal-swipe-at-liz-truss-12747723

We gained back our sovereignty and then made sure that this passed through parliament without any scrutiny, when everyone knew it was sh1t.
Then the concept of collective responsibility meant that even ministers who knew we were polishing a turd, didn't speak out!

Finally you just have to love the Animal Farm twist, where everything bad gets laid at the expelled Liz Truss's door, excusing the rest of the swivel eyed collective.
 


Simster

"the man's an arse"
Jul 7, 2003
54,947
Surrey
Just a quick recap.

We gained the ability to negotiate our own trade deals. and then f'ed up the only ones we have managed to negotiate.
https://news.sky.com/story/george-e...failure-in-brutal-swipe-at-liz-truss-12747723

We gained back our sovereignty and then made sure that this passed through parliament without any scrutiny, when everyone knew it was sh1t.
Then the concept of collective responsibility meant that even ministers who knew we were polishing a turd, didn't speak out!

Finally you just have to love the Animal Farm twist, where everything bad gets laid at the expelled Liz Truss's door, excusing the rest of the swivel eyed collective.
Indeed, although Liz Truss's political incompetence cannot be overstated.

Although that doesn't mean the rest of the tory sad saps won't give it a ruddy good go.
 


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