[Politics] Brexit

[Pavilionaire]

Had the government, 3 years ago, said:-

- So we're leaving.
- We've formed a cross party oversight committee.
- We've put together a team of public and private sector negotiators.
- We will return to parliament for the final rubber stamp.


We would have left a good 18 months ago with a decent deal.

I don't agree with this. The UK wants the freedom to deals with the rest of the world, while the EU wants to protect the integrity of the Single Market.

Part of EU membership is paying in to get the benefits. Not paying the EU anything was a central pillar of the Leave campaign (i.e. let's not send £350 million a week to the EU, let's spend it on the NHS instead). Having a softer form of Brexit necessitates not only payment to the EU but also acceptance of standards and that ECJ will ultimately decide in disputes.

Therefore, all this talk of a free trade deal is pie in the sky unless the UK is prepared to move on red lines, and I don't see how the aims of the ERG can be reconciled with the rules and the precedents for other trade deals the EU have set.

Logically, you only get total freedom from the EU by having a Hard Brexit. That is the only thing that I agree with Nigel Farage on.

There is no version of Soft Brexit that meets David Cameron's explanation of what a tick in the box for 'Leave'. The bottom line is Leavers promised something that was undeliverable, i.e. a 'cake and eat it' free trade deal.

Whatever we end up with will not resemble the Brexit espoused by the Leave Campaign in 2016. This is why I suspect the Tories are now ripping up the Austerity Manual and making big spending commitments to take attention away from Brexit.

 

[beorhthelm]

This has been dealt with so many times that I can only assume you're trolling.

if its "dealt with" we've presumably reached agreement to have one or not?

 

[Stat Brother]

I don't agree with this. The UK wants the freedom to deals with the rest of the world, while the EU wants to protect the integrity of the Single Market.

Part of EU membership is paying in to get the benefits. Not paying the EU anything was a central pillar of the Leave campaign (i.e. let's not send £350 million a week to the EU, let's spend it on the NHS instead). Having a softer form of Brexit necessitates not only payment to the EU but also acceptance of standards and that ECJ will ultimately decide in disputes.

Therefore, all this talk of a free trade deal is pie in the sky unless the UK is prepared to move on red lines, and I don't see how the aims of the ERG can be reconciled with the rules and the precedents for other trade deals the EU have set.

Logically, you only get total freedom from the EU by having a Hard Brexit. That is the only thing that I agree with Nigel Farage on.

There is no version of Soft Brexit that meets David Cameron's explanation of what a tick in the box for 'Leave'. The bottom line is Leavers promised something that was undeliverable, i.e. a 'cake and eat it' free trade deal.

Whatever we end up with will not resemble the Brexit espoused by the Leave Campaign in 2016. This is why I suspect the Tories are now ripping up the Austerity Manual and making big spending commitments to take attention away from Brexit.

I'm not entirely sure you have quoted the right post?

I have no idea what a deal my proposal would have gained.
I'm just saying had the then government removed ego and handed the whole process over to professionals, we wouldn't be where we are now.

 

[Mellotron]

Jean-Claude Juncker spent years in his previous role as Luxembourg’s prime minister secretly blocking EU efforts to tackle tax avoidance by multinational corporations, I wonder what job he will get when he steps down on the 1st of November.

Secretly? So no one knows about this?

Wow, how the **** did you find this out?! This is huge news. You need to go to the press immediately, you'll get paid big time if you've just bust open a big conspiracy theory!!!

 

[Bold Seagull]

So the Tories have negotiated 2 deals with the threat of exiting with No Deal hanging over the EU. Those negotiations are done and dusted. If ever No Deal was a bargaining chip, it's been cashed.

So if Boris wants his election, why not call on JC's request and now take No Deal off the table? If Boris cannot take us out of the EU as he promised, and is telling us his government cannot function and will ask for a GE everyday - raise the opposition's stake and give JC what he is asking for. No Deal is a dead duck because it isn't going to happen. We could go on another decade with extensions and rejected deals and it won't happen.

If you want your GE, call it in.

 

[Chicken Run]

The Tory Party brought in the fixed term Parliaments act, presumably because they thought it good for them. Why would the opposition agree to an election when it isn't in their interests to have one.

I get that but why isn’t in their interest, I thought they all want to see the back of this horrible government and the clown IC?

 

[ManOfSussex]

Forget to mention a couple of fun facts related to this

The last President of the European Commission went straight into a very well paid job at Goldmann Sachs and the current President of the European Commission, Jean-Claude Juncker, spent years in his previous role as Luxembourg’s prime minister secretly blocking EU efforts to tackle tax avoidance by multinational corporations, I wonder what job he will get when he steps down on the 1st of November.

What's your view on the moon landings and the death of Diana, Princess of Wales?

 

[Lever]

The cost of Brexit.... please watch

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rS45IoJAVug

 

[Is it PotG?]

The cost of Brexit.... please watch

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rS45IoJAVug

Whoever he is, his soft furnishings match the nice marine Albion training kit.

That sigh at the end was like Travolta's in Summer Nights.

 

[Lever]

Whoever he is, his soft furnishings match the nice marine Albion training kit.

That sigh at the end was like Travolta's in Summer Nights.

Classic Leaver-informed response where it's all about the style rather than the substance.
Thanks for watching though (assuming you did)

 

[JC Footy Genius]

British politicians would never go into well paid jobs post their political careers cough cough

On J-C J allegation i suggest you take him to court, would be interested in the outcome

You will be astonished to learn that the EU closed ranks around their man ..

https://www.icij.org/investigations...-claude-juncker-admits-he-made-major-mistake/

https://www.icij.org/investigations...mission-not-investigated-lux-leaks-tax-deals/

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Secretly? So no one knows about this?

Wow, how the **** did you find this out?! This is huge news. You need to go to the press immediately, you'll get paid big time if you've just bust open a big conspiracy theory!!!

I read a newspaper article some time ago and it's not a conspiracy theory ... https://www.theguardian.com/busines...blocked-eu-curbs-on-tax-avoidance-cables-show

 

[The Clamp]

Dear oh dear. What an expensive, shitty, mess you leave voters have made. Because you didn’t have the guile to figure out what Cameron was up to or the opportunity racists like Farage would seize to take advantage of you.
You won’t admit it but you’ll all be feeling like right mugs now.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

What's your view on the moon landings and the death of Diana, Princess of Wales?

Many remainers on this thread are woefully ignorant .... the Truth is out there Scully

 

[Mellotron]

I read a newspaper article some time ago and it's not a conspiracy theory ... https://www.theguardian.com/busines...blocked-eu-curbs-on-tax-avoidance-cables-show

So it's not secret.

 

[The Clamp]

So it's not secret.

And there we have it.

 

[ManOfSussex]

Many remainers on this thread are woefully ignorant .... the Truth is out there Scully

As the internet took off in the early part of this century, a lot of people had great ideas and cashed in accordingly. I just wish I'd have thought up the 'Paranoid conspiracy theories + Establishment cover ups = ££££$$$$' one first and monopolised it.

I wouldn't have got greedy either. I'd have just thanked the many leave voters responsible on my website before closing it down, then I would have gone back to Africa, took up Bridge and become Lord Lucan's Tuesday afternoon partner............

 

[Deleted member 2719]

It's quite cute that you still think it's all Labour's fault. I mean you're wrong, but it's still cute.

I like the fact that you think I am cute. So I will drop the blame on Labour to 92% and 4% to the Lib Undems and the other 4% to SNP. ( It would have been just 2% but Blackford is a ****)

Do you do stand up comedy?

I would pay to come and laugh at you!

Many a top comedian get people to laugh at them and not others, I know you are the sort just to abuse to get your kicks.

Come and heckle me, Lever, if you feel it will increase the length of your penis, and I will be ready to cut you down.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I don't agree with this. The UK wants the freedom to deals with the rest of the world, while the EU wants to protect the integrity of the Single Market.

Part of EU membership is paying in to get the benefits. Not paying the EU anything was a central pillar of the Leave campaign (i.e. let's not send £350 million a week to the EU, let's spend it on the NHS instead). Having a softer form of Brexit necessitates not only payment to the EU but also acceptance of standards and that ECJ will ultimately decide in disputes.

Therefore, all this talk of a free trade deal is pie in the sky unless the UK is prepared to move on red lines, and I don't see how the aims of the ERG can be reconciled with the rules and the precedents for other trade deals the EU have set.

Logically, you only get total freedom from the EU by having a Hard Brexit. That is the only thing that I agree with Nigel Farage on.

There is no version of Soft Brexit that meets David Cameron's explanation of what a tick in the box for 'Leave'. The bottom line is Leavers promised something that was undeliverable, i.e. a 'cake and eat it' free trade deal.

Whatever we end up with will not resemble the Brexit espoused by the Leave Campaign in 2016. This is why I suspect the Tories are now ripping up the Austerity Manual and making big spending commitments to take attention away from Brexit.

Exactly. If people thought they could vote for a unicorn ride, and an unscrupulous politician gave them a vote . . . .no need for me to finish the sentence.

The thing I find odd is that surely Boris must have a picture in his mind of what a successful Brexit looks like in order to justify his decision to back it (at the 11th hour) and stake his career on it. And yet....aside from throwing the Ulster Unionists to the wolves and hoping the Europeans will be nice to us over trade....there is nothing. It is a sort of collective madness - total and utter King's New Clothes. Perhaps the nation needs the wisdom of a naive child to point out the obvious....

 

[Baldseagull]

This is further useful info, for those interested in modern democracy;

Rees-Mogg used to be a fan of the idea that two referendums make more sense, in the circumstances described.