[Politics] Brexit

[Blue Valkyrie]

Out of interest, what access would the UK get to the EU’s services markets (and, in particular, financial markets) if we were part of EFTA ?

That depends on how we set up the arrangement.

Norway has opted for full EEA access. Switzerland has 200 or so mini bilateral deals which they are currently negotiating into 1 agreement. Financial service access is a key goal for this negotiation. The EU hate the Switzerland arrangement by the way - so the negotiation would be ambitious, but still do-able.

The point of being in EFTA is the 29 off the shelf trade deals we get on day 1 - of which we take the ones we want - and can later negotiate our own, and also the option for differing levels of EEA access - through the EFTA pillar not the EU pillar ( EFTA court, not EU court rules on disputes, new laws introduced via genuine consensus not EU Qualified Majority Voting ). No CAP ( agriculture ). No CFP ( fisheries ). There is even no dreaded EU Army issue for EFTA states.

 

[WATFORD zero]

I agree but there seems to be an awful lot of complacency from some on here .... which is odd because they often bang on about death threats and abuse towards prominent remainers (+Jo Cox), the far right etc If it's bad now, how bad would it get if those that support betraying the referendum vote actually got their way?

Well with you, [MENTION=2719]Mouldy Boots[/MENTION] and [MENTION=35196]Is it PotG?[/MENTION] all now warning of 'blood on the streets now, I'm almost afraid to leave home



Almost

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Not really if he believes that is what his constituents want or that any deal is better than leaving with no deal, which seems to be getting more likely.

Those that have had time to look at the Withdrawal Agreement have said, once it's passed, the transition period to December 2020 will just lead the government prevaricating and lead to no deal anyway.
This is not the deal, but if it passes there's no turning back.

That MP is not representing his constituents nor the Labour Party in an honest way.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

That depends on how we set up the arrangement.

Norway has opted for full EEA access. Switzerland has 200 or so mini bilateral deals which they are currently negotiating into 1 agreement. Financial service access is a key goal for this negotiation. The EU hate the Switzerland arrangement by the way - so the negotiation would be ambitious, but still do-able.

The point of being in EFTA is the 29 off the shelf trade deals we get on day 1 - of which we take the ones we want - and can later negotiate our own, and also the option for differing levels of EEA access - through the EFTA pillar not the EU pillar ( EFTA court, not EU court rules on disputes, new laws introduced via genuine consensus not EU Qualified Majority Voting ). No CAP ( agriculture ). No CFP ( fisheries ). There is even no dreaded EU Army issue for EFTA states.

The one red line both May & Johnson have agreed on is no freedom of movement. That rules out any Swiss or Norway deal.

 

[Stat Brother]

Those that have had time to look at the Withdrawal Agreement have said, once it's passed, the transition period to December 2020 will just lead the government prevaricating and lead to no deal anyway.
This is not the deal, but if it passes there's no turning back.

That MP is not representing his constituents nor the Labour Party in an honest way.

That voted 70% Remain.

I guess that's why he isn't seeking re-election.

BG wanted Nick Soames hung drawn and quartered for his betrayal of Haywards Heath, yet seemingly doesn't have a problem if the considerably bigger betrayal goes in 'his' favour.

 

[nicko31]

Those that have had time to look at the Withdrawal Agreement have said, once it's passed, the transition period to December 2020 will just lead the government prevaricating and lead to no deal anyway.
This is not the deal, but if it passes there's no turning back.

That MP is not representing his constituents nor the Labour Party in an honest way.

Incredibly poor...

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/en...zL7n7t92RvvI_DbnWMRm3P7lHhzQJ14oOEwYOcQ-UKR5C

 

[WATFORD zero]

That depends on how we set up the arrangement.

Norway has opted for full EEA access. Switzerland has 200 or so mini bilateral deals which they are currently negotiating into 1 agreement. Financial service access is a key goal for this negotiation. The EU hate the Switzerland arrangement by the way - so the negotiation would be ambitious, but still do-able.

The point of being in EFTA is the 29 off the shelf trade deals we get on day 1 - of which we take the ones we want - and can later negotiate our own, and also the option for differing levels of EEA access - through the EFTA pillar not the EU pillar ( EFTA court, not EU court rules on disputes, new laws introduced via genuine consensus not EU Qualified Majority Voting ). No CAP ( agriculture ). No CFP ( fisheries ). There is even no dreaded EU Army issue for EFTA states.

It's just that I thought it would rely on ‘equivalence’.

And, given that there are really no existing financial industries that rely on equivalence (although US clearance houses used it in a piecemeal fashion).To use this as permanent arrangement for the UK, the EU would have to grant the UK similar rights to those granted to EU Member States. Crucially, it also requires the EU to change its mind, after recently having rejected a similar proposal from Norway, which had problems in accepting that an organisation that they are not a member of can have supervisory powers in its jurisdiction. (Something that may sound familiar )

It's just that I can't see any straightforward solution to the UK's services sector accessing the EU's services sector outside of full membership. And, as you know, this is a major part of the UKs trade

 

[ManOfSussex]

Well with you, [MENTION=2719]Mouldy Boots[/MENTION] and [MENTION=35196]Is it PotG?[/MENTION] all now warning of 'blood on the streets now, I'm almost afraid to leave home

Almost

There's also the very real risk on the streets that Farage might go for a walk again dressed as Alan Partridge.

 

[Is it PotG?]

Well with you, [MENTION=2719]Mouldy Boots[/MENTION] and [MENTION=35196]Is it PotG?[/MENTION] all now warning of 'blood on the streets now, I'm almost afraid to leave home

View attachment 116436

Almost

Now that, is BRILLIANT.

 

[Hampster Gull]

I agree but there seems to be an awful lot of complacency from some on here .... which is odd because they often bang on about death threats and abuse towards prominent remainers (+Jo Cox), the far right etc If it's bad now, how bad would it get if those that support betraying the referendum vote actually got their way?

I don’t believe you can betray something that was based on a series of lies. There is no betrayal. What we are seeing is what happens through due diligence

 

[Is it PotG?]

I don’t believe you can betray something that was based on a series of lies. There is no betrayal. This 8s what happens through due diligence

Leading to a possible CRASHING (Corbyn's words, not mine) out with No Deal.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

The one red line both May & Johnson have agreed on is no freedom of movement. That rules out any Swiss or Norway deal.

Yes - it's a negotiation, and the Swiss arn't too happy with their FOM deal - but they are negotiating.

And Norway has an emergency break on FOM - I can't remember the exact clause.

If we know 1 certainty - it's that what Johnson rules out today, he may well rule in tomorrow.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

That voted 70% Remain.

I guess that's why he isn't seeking re-election.

BG wanted Nick Soames hung drawn and quartered for his betrayal of Haywards Heath, yet seemingly doesn't have a problem if the considerably bigger betrayal goes in 'his' favour.

My MP is a member of the ERG despite Lewes voting Remain. She just spouts the party line every time I email her. She's a qualified nurse but voted against the nurses pay rise, when May said there was no magic money tree.
It's astounding how that Magic money tree grew to spend over £90B on leaving the EU.
Hypocrites the lot of them.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Yes - it's a negotiation, and the Swiss arn't too happy with their FOM deal - but they are negotiating.

And Norway has an emergency break on FOM - I can't remember the exact clause.

If we know 1 certainty - it's that what Johnson rules out today, he may well rule in tomorrow.

They are both in Schengen!

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Didn't see any English flags in London on Saturday, wonder why...

Pretty obvious, not many proud Englishman were going to go on that march ....

Time for you to finally come to terms with the fact we are a decent, fair-minded, democratic country that enacts democratic results nicko. Hopefully you can get on with your life and do something worthwhile with all your spare time.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

They are both in Schengen!

But they do not have to be. There is no EFTA requirement for that. Some Norway territories are outside it.

And Switzerland only joined Schengen in 2008.

The point is we negotiate what we want, and then take the compromises we need to make. There has been none of this negotiation / thought yet except a quick trip to Switzerland so far.

It has not been seriously considered because of the hatchet job from all sides, and because of May's blundering head down charge forward with her red lines.

It'll look a lot more attractive when ERG plans go wrong.

 

[WATFORD zero]

If unamended we're looking at a 14 month countdown to a no deal, should boost the economy. Scotland will be desperate to get off the sinking ship Britannia

If I have understood clause 30 correctly,

I think you're right and, if we haven't negotiated a deal we could well go 'no deal' on 31st December 2020.

However, given that we currently have 14 months of 'implementation period' left to negotiate the most complex full trade deal in Britain's history and that may have to include time to get the WA through parliament and hold a general Election, Shirley no idiot would seriously think this can happen, so there will obviously have to be an extension to the 'implementation period'.

It's just that the £39B that Johnson wasn't going to pay, but has now decided to pay, only covers us up to 31st December 2020. If we extend beyond that, then the EU can charge us whatever they like, as there is no framework for further payments

It's obviously been well thought through, this 'deal'

 

[JC Footy Genius]

I don’t believe you can betray something that was based on a series of lies. There is no betrayal. What we are seeing is what happens through due diligence

It doesn't matter what you believe. Many people would feel betrayed and there would be damaging consequences, fortunately I believe the moderate forces of democracy, fairness and freedom will prevail and we will leave.

 

[nicko31]

Pretty obvious, not many proud Englishman were going to go on that march ....

Time for you to finally come to terms with the fact we are a decent, fair-minded, democratic country that enacts democratic results nicko. Hopefully you can get on with your life and do something worthwhile with all your spare time.

Funny how there were flags from all of the Union, bar England. Some leavers have made the English flag toxic due to your isolationist attitude.

Parallel's of what the BNP did to Union Jack.

Do you remember the days when there were England flags everywhere during World Cup's? Not anymore....

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

Public opinion on NSC is that you are a pathetic little insect.
But you are still here posting your ignorant drivel.
How out of touch do you want to be.
No offence.
Regards
RC

Ithe only one taking offence is you , time and time again you've shown yourself up for what you are
An undemocratic loon that takes to insults as some kind of there to go I told you so to ease the pain of coming to terms with leaving the EU
Get ready for Brexit
Regards
DF