[Politics] Brexit

[Blue Valkyrie]

I thought that were already some mutterings of an extension not being granted, as the EU want it completed either way.

Whatever the EU decide it won't be finalised until the last minute.

Plenty of time before their decision for Johnson to bring his deal to a vote.

 

[ROKERITE]

Don't forget the cold hard lies

Indeed, the "no plans for an EU army" being a particular whopper from Remain. Of course they must have an army; how could Verhofstadt have an empire without one?

 

[The Clamp]

It doesn't matter. I've made my point.

And you have made yours.

Quite.

I would imagine we’ll be leaving anyway at some point so my opinion matters not in the big scheme of things.
Unless someone grows a spine and revoked A50 I cannot see it going any other way.
The morons won. So be it.

 

[The Clamp]

Indeed, the "no plans for an EU army" being a particular whopper from Remain. Of course they must have an army; how could Verhofstadt have an empire without one?

You’re peddling lies. Utter rubbish.


From FullFact

Whether or not EU nations wish to create an “EU army”, and regardless of what that might actually entail, the European Commission can’t propose laws about security or defence. On issues like this, member countries effectively have a veto, so the UK would only take part if it chose to.

There are no formal plans in place for an EU army, and so there are no “EU regulations” on drafting people into it.

https://fullfact.org/online/EU-army-conscription/

Hmmm. Not quite what you said, is it now?

 

[ROKERITE]

Quite.

I would imagine we’ll be leaving anyway at some point so my opinion matters not in the big scheme of things.
So be it.

I hope you're right for once. If so I predict a decade or so from now people like you will deny ever having been bedazzled by Brussels.

 

[The Clamp]

I hope you're right for once. If so I predict a decade or so from now people like you will deny ever having been bedazzled by Brussels.

Yeah well, you’re a proven liar, making your predictions pretty bootless.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

It does seem that the struggle to understand other peoples' reasons for how they view this situation has caused incorrect motives to be assigned in an attempt to rationalise.

It is far better to accept that someone voted a particular way - if to understand why is proving too hard.


From that position it doesn't matter how 'thick' they are, or how 'taken in' they were.


Now I know that malign foreign actors were meddling... but we had a contract with the population. We need to (1) fulfill that contract with minimum initial damage, and (2) fix the fall out as soon as possible ( no silly minimum 40 years or whatever, just as and when it appears that things need fixing - and then fix them fast ).

 

[clapham_gull]

If I was in Boris shoes I would be on the phone to Merkel and Macron plus a couple of others and ask for their assurance that they will vote against an extension and it made known that will happen, and if so I would suggest that I put the deal back to parliament on Tuesday. It will then be take this deal or no deal and so will probably win the day.

Thankfully you are nowhere a position of power.

 

[ROKERITE]

Thankfully you are nowhere a position of power.

Thankfully no-one on this message-board is. That goes for all the many football message-boards I've ever read.

 

[Lever]

Indeed, the "no plans for an EU army" being a particular whopper from Remain. Of course they must have an army; how could Verhofstadt have an empire without one?

You must have some evidence for this claim.... what is that evidence and where does it come from?

 

[The Clamp]

You must have some evidence for this claim.... what is that evidence and where does it come from?

It’s total bullshit.

 

[ROKERITE]

You must have some evidence for this claim.... what is that evidence and where does it come from?

Just this week from Verhofstadt's own lips, or his fingertips on twitter to be exact.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

You aren't really trying very hard, the start of your post raised my hopes, but then you get sarcastic. Do you think I want to get rid of workers rights? Do you think I hate clean beaches?

The principle is what is important. I have explained this so many times on here, but it never matters. But Ok, I want to be constructive so I'll do it again, but I have a feeling in 10-15 pages time it won't matter and I'll be asked again to explain myself.

The EU could have only 100% laws which I personally agree with. But that doesn't make it Ok that laws are not made by people I (or you) have the power to elect or remove. An EU which has laws I 100% agree with today, may have laws I don't agree with (or you don't agree with) tomorrow. Who makes the law is more important than what the law currently is.

I don't know what your personal politics are, but I want you to be able, if you elect a government, to determine what the laws in this country are, even if I don't personally agree with them. The point is that if the laws are not what you feel they should be, or what I feel they should be, we can debate, we can campaign, we can elect and through that we can decide. That is what I want. It is short sighted to say that the current laws of the EU are good and the current laws of the UK Government are bad. Tomorrow the UK Government might be your prefered choice, and the EU might be under the direction of people with whom you don't agree. Inside the EU you won't be able to change the laws made by people who don't share your values, even if you have the UK government of your choice.

It's not about this or that law, and it shouldn't be about the makeup of the current EU or UK governments. It is only about whether our elected officials decide our laws or not. And it is important that they do.

Hang on, that's why you don't like the EU? But no law can be made that isn't voted on by the EU parliament, and that isn't subject to the veto of the UK government - so your issue is unfounded?

 

[Lever]

It’s total bullshit.

I believe you but I would like the 'bullshitter' to provide the evidence if s/he has any......

 

[Lever]

Just this week from Verhofstadt's own lips, or his fingertips on twitter to be exact.

Link?

 

[The Clamp]

Just this week from Verhofstadt's own lips, or his fingertips on twitter to be exact.

As I posted, they cannot force any member state to join an EU army. Whether it’s posted on twitter or not

 

[ROKERITE]

Link?

Just google it.

 

[Lever]

Just google it.

...and this is to create his own Empire, according to your claim... Evidence?

 

[Weststander]

Thankfully no-one on this message-board is. That goes for all the many football message-boards I've ever read.

True.

Muzza, Stephens and March would’ve been hounded out of the club (Albion in our case) a long time ago.

 

[The Clamp]

Hang on, that's why you don't like the EU? But no law can be made that isn't voted on by the EU parliament, and that isn't subject to the veto of the UK government - so your issue is unfounded?

He doesn’t seem to understand this.