[Politics] Brexit

[The Clamp]

Bloomin' heck, he's not on your Christmas card list is he?

He's a racist dick.

 

[Lever]

Hmmm ........

What does DR stand for Westdene Seagull?
Pleased you are making your own personal effort to avoid your past crudities.

 

[Lever]

Nope, tried that.

Still a c0ck.

You obviously have limited powers of expression at the moment, but don't give up.... I am sure you will make progress and improve. It may take time though.

 

[Is it PotG?]

You obviously have limited powers of expression at the moment, but don't give up.... I am sure you will make progress and improve. It may take time though.

Patience is a virtue, and Billy Bragg told me that a virtue never tested is no virtue at all.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Dunno, I was merely pointing out that Das Reich, the racist little c0cksucker will be in the shit when he gets his precious no-deal. Normally I genuinely feel very bad for people forced to live on benefits and the hardship they suffer but when it comes to that Nazi scumbag I wouldn't feel the least bit sad if I heard the racist little twerp had starved to death in his council flat with the gas fire on, post piling up behind the door and the Christmas decorations still up.
Have I made myself clear?

Ouch. Nobody, no matter how vile their political views deserves that.

 

[Sorrel]

I see this thread remains full of the usual level of erudition and polite discourse.

 

[The Clamp]

Ouch. Nobody, no matter how vile their political views deserves that.

Oh wind your neck in TB.

 

[Lever]

Patience is a virtue, and Billy Bragg told me that a virtue never tested is no virtue at all.

He's a good speaker, performer and political activist...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNERA3KHlEU

 

[Is it PotG?]

He's a good speaker, performer and political activist...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNERA3KHlEU

Indeed, a clever and respected writer/speaker.

A line or so from Ideology, with a reference to Brexit and adhering to the referendum possibly.

'God bless the civil service
The nation's saving grace
While we expect democracy
They're laughing in our face
And although our cries get louder
Their laughter gets louder still
Above the sound of ideologies clashing'

 

[GrizzlingGammon]

He's carrying out the Referendum result put forward by the The Tories, remind me of the result of that referendum
regards
DR

So it is OK to take away sovereignty and democracy as long as it suits your agenda?

So all this Brexiteer bleating about wanting democracy and giving back sovereignty to our parliament is actually more Brexiteer bullcrap.
Thank you for clearing that up.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Not fair or true at all.

Not everybody who voted to Leave was thick. Some were, for sure, just as some were simply bigots or racists. Others were taking a blind swing at the status quo, with little thought or understanding of the real issues. The fact that so many didn't properly understand though is more a failing of those who failed to properly present the case for staying, and those who willfully spread misinformation, than a true reflection on the intelligence of the voters.

So, I'll not have it that all Leave voters were thick.


However, those who STILL now, think it is a good idea - well yes - absolute morons.

Very well put.

I do remain baffled, though, by politicians who campaigned for remain, yet now repeat the mantra that we must leave because of the outcome of the vote, and are bound to sit on their hands if Boris the liar does allow the nation to sleepwalk into a no deal Brexit.

I suppose it is another expression of the same mentality that makes some MPs, when in opposition, vote against every government bill, no matter how much they agree with it, simply because they see it as a duty when in opposition to oppose the government in all circumstances.

We don't need MPs like this. Given that their every vote is predictable, and their every stance predicated by whether or not the people voted for it in a referendum, or it is or is not government policy, their personal statement on their electioneering material could be reduced to one sentence 'I will support my party, and the outcome of any referendom, and that's it'.

Having an independent mind and no fear of voting on government bills using conviction and conscience only, without heed of the greater goals of your own party, on the other hand, is also not desirable. Any such candidate should really put in their electioneering statement 'I will always vote with my conscience so please don't vote for me if you want me to support your party, even when the issue is one of party policy or an election promise'. I wonder whether Corbyn has been honest enough to write such stuff in his personal election pamphlets It wouldn't surprise me if this is just what he does do....ironic, really, given how much he is disliked (including by me).

I think I'd prefer something in between. The trouble is such a politician who lacks dogma, broadly supports his own party yet changes his mind according to circumstances (need), and has sufficient charisma to woo votes even from folk who'd normally vote for the other main party, will always find that the opposing pulls he or she faces will force him or her into incongruous positions, perhaps forcing them to confabulate (lie) and present arguments that simply don't add up. Any examples of such a politician, successful but in the end doomed to ignnominy? Yep. Boris Johnson. And before him, Tony Blair.

Parliamentary democracy.....the best system we have? I guess so.....blimey, it is flawed though.

 

[theonlymikey]

So it is OK to take away sovereignty and democracy as long as it suits your agenda?

So all this Brexiteer bleating about wanting democracy and giving back sovereignty to our parliament is actually more Brexiteer bullcrap.
Thank you for clearing that up.

The whole thing is code for ridding the shores of none whites.

 

[The Clamp]

The whole thing is code for ridding the shores of none whites.

Possibly. It's more being seized upon as a golden opportunity for the elite to isolate themselves away from prying eyes and bleed the UK dry without restriction or accountability.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

The whole thing is code for ridding the shores of none whites.

The ridiculous thing is that Brexit will nothing to prevent illegal immigrants, and if Europeans aren't working in our hospitals, science labs and universities then we will need more non Europeans here to fill the gaps.

 

[Baldseagull]

Exactly my point 6 million people in this country are undemocratic.

The decision was made to Leave or Remain, we voted Leave and people like Bercow has been so biased, he needs to go, surely even you can see that through your remoaner specs?

The advice was given to Parliament, not a decision, Parliament cannot find a way that they can democratically agree on to do it, even though they have agreed to act on that advice and issued A50 notification. Bercow has acted to allow democratic process to take place where the Government has sought to avoid it, I understand you do not like that, but you have it backwards if you think he is acting un-democratically. He is not stopping Brexit, he is allowing MP's to decide democratically how it is done.

 

[The Clamp]

The advice was given to Parliament, not a decision, Parliament cannot find a way that they can democratically agree on to do it, even though they have agreed to act on that advice and issued A50 notification. Bercow has acted to allow democratic process to take place where the Government has sought to avoid it, I understand you do not like that, but you have it backwards if you think he is acting un-democratically. He is not stopping Brexit, he is allowing MP's to decide democratically how it is done.

Spot on.

 

[Baldseagull]

The BBC is biased .... YouGov is biased ... the referendum was unfair, whines the undemocratic loon ...

It wasn't fair because of illegal spending, illegal use of data, illegal harvesting of data, illegal donations, illegal collaboration and most of all, because so much of the campaign to leave was untrue, and you know this, which is why you have dropped the words "free and fair" when you say we should respect the results of elections.
There was no plan, there is no plan, except no deal, which was explicitly stated as not a possibility by the Leave campaign, I don't understand why leavers get so triggered by remainers when it is clear that the Vote leave politicians conned you.
The only argument that leavers have for legitimacy of no deal, is that the public were warned it could be pretty shitty, by the Remain campaign.
You are absurd.

 

[Lever]

It wasn't fair because of illegal spending, illegal use of data, illegal harvesting of data, illegal donations, illegal collaboration and most of all, because so much of the campaign to leave was untrue, and you know this, which is why you have dropped the words "free and fair" when you say we should respect the results of elections.
There was no plan, there is no plan, except no deal, which was explicitly stated as not a possibility by the Leave campaign, I don't understand why leavers get so triggered by remainers when it is clear that the Vote leave politicians conned you.
The only argument that leavers have for legitimacy of no deal, is that the public were warned it could be pretty shitty, by the Remain campaign.
You are absurd.

This is the truth and I find the constant dumbing down of the referendum debate to the level of referring blandly to 'winners' (the 2016 Leave vote) and 'losers' (the 2016 Remain vote) suits the Brexit lobby but deliberately misses the point that whatever happens, we will all be affected.

Writing about this as if it is a football result ('You lost, get over it!) was the start of the divisiveness and imbecility - and some people are STILL using it.

 

[Baldseagull]

Ok, fair enough.

I find his actions full of self-importance, the odious little man.

The smug grin whenever he speaks is almost laughable.

He is definitely a man with an ego he likes to have regularly stroked, I too find his persona a bit unpleasant, but his actions have not in any way affronted democracy.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

He is definitely a man with an ego he likes to have regularly stroked, I too find his persona a bit unpleasant, but his actions have not in any way affronted democracy.

The Speaker of the House has to have a big personality. Personally, I like him, especially when he puts down pompous MPs, who try to have a go at his wife.

Betty Boothroyd was never afraid to speak her mind and still does. I wish we had a lot more politicians like her.
https://www.newstatesman.com/politi...n-t-be-prime-minister-dear-he-ain-t-going-win