[Politics] Brexit

[WATFORD zero]

Yes, but new competition rules introduced in 2016 aim to copy the UK (passengers using SASTA may have to stifle a laugh at this point, but the British model is seen as way that railways should be run). Most European railways will continue to be state run but a single 100% state-owned company operating trains, running stations and controlling the track will not be allowed.

I know that's not what was in the Labour manifesto, but if it was, it wouldn't be allowed while the UK remained a member of the EU.

I have to say, I'm surprised that an organisation that has a vast majority of state owned railways would make it illegal. Do you know what Germany are going to do about their 100% state owned railways?

 

[Gwylan]

I have to say, I'm surprised that an organisation that has a vast majority of state owned railways would make it illegal. Do you know what Germany are going to do about their 100% state owned railways?

The EU is very much about competition and is very suspicious of state aid to industries. The original scheme, unveiled in 2013, was very much on the British model but this was watered down. What the EC is proposing is a scheme where there's an element of competition introduced, as in the UK. What this probably means in practice is that an state-run organisation will probably win out against any new operator (unless the government wants to load the dice in favour of the new operator).

But, by definition, it means that a single state-owned operator like BR wouldn't be allowed. It's one of the reasons why Corbyn and all left wing parties are so opposed to the EU

 

[WATFORD zero]

The EU is very much about competition and is very suspicious of state aid to industries. The original scheme, unveiled in 2013, was very much on the British model but this was watered down. What the EC is proposing is a scheme where there's an element of competition introduced, as in the UK. What this probably means in practice is that an state-run organisation will probably win out against any new operator (unless the government wants to load the dice in favour of the new operator).

But, by definition, it means that a single state-owned operator like BR wouldn't be allowed. It's one of the reasons why Corbyn and all left wing parties are so opposed to the EU

The EU is at the end of the day a set of politicians from the member countries all trying to get the best deal for their prospective countries.(Plus the occasional loon elected by a member that has thrown their toys out the pram). So I find it hard to believe that a collection of states are wary of state aiding industry. (Unless it's cross border to the ddetriment of other states).

Since Germany are the most powerful force in there, I think it is highly unlikely that they would make their own 100% state owned railways illegal. I think there may be more than one interpretation of these changes.

If Germany could favour their state owned company, we could do exactly the same.

Maybe I've answered my own question and it's the state subsidies on cross border operations that the EU are trying to stop.

 

[Berty23]

So you're saying that nobody can leave the European Union because Brussels have all the cards and power to do as they wish?
Isn't this the reason why most voted "out" as no organisation should not have this kind of power it's just bloody ridiculous.The reason why it's a mess is because...
Internal bickering and moaning from remainer politicians
A government leader incapable of being strong and direct
Constant votes on what we can and can't do in parliament
The EU telling us to do everything while they do fack all as always
Big business wants uncontrolled immigration as it suits their need and the liberals also want this even though our infrastructure is creaking at the seems.For a better quality of life you need less people instead of saturating the country with low earners and a poor quality of life.

Just get on with it and leave fully and then we can then start to progress as a nation !!
People are doing everything they can to sabotage it and these politicians are paid by the tax payer and we voted democratically to LEAVE and if they can't do what the voters voted for then they need to be outed ASAP so we can actually do what is required.

What's so great about Europe at the moment or years gone by as it's in a terrible state and is declining at a rate of knots.
The problem with Brussels is that year after year they've gained to much control to quickly and the sooner it's abolished the better Europe will be.

Erm. No. I am saying that you can't undo a country's entire legal and physical infrastructure in a few months. This is because before triggering article 50 you need a plan but leavers were demanding it. The EU understood how long it would take so now knows that they can simply refuse anything that is not in their interest because we don't have an option. No deal is simply not an option. I would suggest a lack of understanding about what leaving entailed led to people calling for article 50 trigger before we were ready - in fact read Cummings on this.

 

[Ernest]

I have to say, I'm surprised that an organisation that has a vast majority of state owned railways would make it illegal. Do you know what Germany are going to do about their 100% state owned railways?

They have private companies running in competition on some routes, way different from what we do

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

The EU is very much about competition and is very suspicious of state aid to industries. The original scheme, unveiled in 2013, was very much on the British model but this was watered down. What the EC is proposing is a scheme where there's an element of competition introduced, as in the UK. What this probably means in practice is that an state-run organisation will probably win out against any new operator (unless the government wants to load the dice in favour of the new operator).

But, by definition, it means that a single state-owned operator like BR wouldn't be allowed. It's one of the reasons why Corbyn and all left wing parties are so opposed to the EU

State run doesn’t necessarily mean state aid though. If they have an issue with state aid then the solution doesn’t need to be preventing state run public utilities. I find it very hard to believe they’d bring in legislation which prohibits state run public services.

 

[WATFORD zero]

They have private companies running in competition on some routes, way different from what we do

I never thought the day would come, but I bow to your greater knowledge Enrest

 

[beorhthelm]

Not an area I know well but I thought the majority of countries in the EU ran state operated railways?

you can have state owned organisations as long as you dont carry out direct subsidies (or at least arent seen to be overtly...). nationalisation is direct state aid. good example is RBS, as a result of nationalisation EU directed the business must divest some of its assets, leading to TSB branch network being sold off. didnt work out so well for anyone involved.

State run doesn’t necessarily mean state aid though. If they have an issue with state aid then the solution doesn’t need to be preventing state run public utilities. I find it very hard to believe they’d bring in legislation which prohibits state run public services.

the idea is that its not very fair on say Czech or Portugese utility companies if they want to run the Swedish or Irish utilities, because those countries block entrants to the market by having a national monopoly. of course many nations drag their feet, put up internal structrual barriers or find ways of fudging the rules, golden shares, national security etc.

 

[Bwian]

Just because most people voted to leave, and some of those want a complete/hard brexit doesn't mean it's easy, or even possible.

IMO the hard brexiters are hoping for some kind of utopian outcome, and are living in a fantasy land. Gove may just be coming round to the realisation that you can't always get what you want.

It wasn't 'most people voted to leave'. It was a ridiculously low majority.

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[Baldseagull]

How do you know what the consequences will be?
Maybe when we leave we can really start to spread our wings and be in control of our own destiny just like all the other big guns outside Europe but the problem is the weak liberals and remainers don't have the ambition or desire to progress and they're followers not leaders !!

Read the thread mate, this has been covered and only the very thickest of Leavers ever thought that we can just walk away without it being a disaster, you must be at the dull end of that group if you still think it now. At the very start most leavers said it was just a negotiating stance to say we would walk away, we would not actually do it.
I will no doubt be told off by a self righteous leaver bellend for saying "thick", just because leavers have a different opinion it doesn't make them thick, well yes it ****ing does if your opinion is that we can just walk away, do what we want and it will all work out fine.

 

[Dorset Seagull]

It wasn't 'most people voted to leave'. It was a ridiculously low majority.

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A ridiculously low majority IS most people

 

[pastafarian]

You sound desperate

yeah ok
Mostly just still laughing at your idiot lapdog clampy for thinking the chequers statement meant freedom of movement was remaining.
Notice you didnt agree with his groundbreaking perception.......wonder why?

 

[pastafarian]

This is what we have been trying to say all along. The buzz phrase Take back Control is one big deception. We've always had control.

Ah, our resident fibber has now moved onto laws

Try and understand the difference between EU Regulations, EU Directives, EU Decisions and EU Recommendations


THE TREATY ON THE FUNCTIONING OF THE EUROPEAN UNION
SECTION 1
THE LEGAL ACTS OF THE UNION

Article 288
(ex Article 249 TEC)

To exercise the Union's competences, the institutions shall adopt regulations, directives, decisions, recommendations and opinions.

A regulation shall have general application. It shall be binding in its entirety and directly applicable in all Member States.

A directive shall be binding, as to the result to be achieved, upon each Member State to which it is addressed, but shall leave to the national authorities the choice of form and methods.

A decision shall be binding in its entirety. A decision which specifies those to whom it is addressed shall be binding only on them.

Recommendations and opinions shall have no binding force.


Try and understand the difference between those laws that must be transposed into UK law with parliamentary input and domestic legislation and those EU laws backed up by the competence contained in the treaties and the rulings of the ECJ where they are directly applicable onto a member state and bypass parliamentary enactments.

http://researchbriefings.parliament.uk/ResearchBriefing/Summary/CBP-7863

Parliament must be free to take back control of its domestic laws free from threats of punishment by EU bodies.

It really is time for you to question who is telling you these porkers and question why you believe these lies as gospel without question……..is it twatter? …..Its twatter isn’t it?


Talking about rubbish, did you ever find that EU mechanism you tried to find and thought you had(but failed) that gives us control of our EU borders, you know real border controls like quotas and permissions to enter via visas and permits, you have gone silent on that like many before you, have you given up and concede we never had these sort of controls in the first place, therefore your lie we always had control of our borders is still a big fat whopper.

 

[Gwylan]

I find it very hard to believe they’d bring in legislation which prohibits state run public services.

I didn't say that. I said they can't introduce a state-run monopoly, there needs to be a competitive structure. I'd fully expect the status quo to persist - because of the cost of introducing competition.

 

[Baldseagull]

We can send people and cargo up to the ISS, but we can't leave the EU. It does sound ridicolous. The EU doesn't own us. Nothing is impossible.

Do you like your job? Is your boss perfect? Hours suit you? NO? what is it you want from it? I see, all the pay, health insurance and company car, but you only want to work the hours you want, when you feel like it, and have the right to decide not to do anything he says at all if you don't want to, and work for other people. Well if he says you can't have that, just ****ing leave it then, he doesn't own you, just tell him to stick it, don't worry about the money, never mind about the debts you have already, just borrow a shit ton more, let your kids pay it off. You will get another job eventually, maybe even a better one if you negotiate hard for ten years, but most likely you will take a couple of crappy part time jobs cleaning at first, just to bring in enough to pay the interest on the mortgage, not the capital but the kids can deal with that, and grow your own veg for eating,and keep chickens for eggs and meat.

Just get on with it you gutless turd, do it, do it, do it, do it.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Do you like your job? Is your boss perfect? Hours suit you? NO? what is it you want from it? I see, all the pay, health insurance and company car, but you only want to work the hours you want, when you feel like it, and have the right to decide not to do anything he says at all if you don't want to, and work for other people. Well if he says you can't have that, just ****ing leave it then, he doesn't own you, just tell him to stick it, don't worry about the money, never mind about the debts you have already, just borrow a shit ton more, let your kids pay it off. You will get another job eventually, maybe even a better one if you negotiate hard for ten years, but most likely you will take a couple of crappy part time jobs cleaning at first, just to bring in enough to pay the interest on the mortgage, not the capital but the kids can deal with that, and grow your own veg for eating,and keep chickens for eggs and meat.

Just get on with it you gutless turd, do it, do it, do it, do it.

Bloody hell.

 

[Baldseagull]

Bloody hell.

Sick of it pal, just do it, it's so ****ing easy.

 

[Two Professors]

Lots of this from the moaners,but who cares?Wonder who will be first to reject Theresa's fudge?Barmier,Junker,or the Gnome?Hope they do it soon,then we will have a nice clean break.

 

[Baldseagull]

View attachment 98500

Lots of this from the moaners,but who cares?Wonder who will be first to reject Theresa's fudge?Barmier,Junker,or the Gnome?Hope they do it soon,then we will have a nice clean break.

You can **** off as well you utter bell end.

 

[Stat Brother]

Wonder who will be first to reject Theresa's fudge?

Isn't the answer to that, Boris?