[Politics] Brexit

[nicko31]

Cameron reminds me of one of those blokes who start a mass punch-up at a pub and, while it kicks-off, saunters off for a quiet pint elsewhere without a scratch on him.

Think it must be difficult for him to have a pint anywhere in this country

 

[ManOfSussex]

In other news that twit Cameron spotted at Wimbledon

He was sitting with Ma-Mah. Looks like Stephen Hammond and Justine Greening behind him.

 

[Billy the Fish]

Nailed it!!!

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Tell the EU to go and swivel, and refuse to give them anymore money. They have treated this country like shit, and you know it too.

 

[Ernest]

Any news

 

[Billy the Fish]

Over 5000 posts and my first on Brexit. Just an aside really. Met a French woman yesterday (while walking the dog) who was rabid anti-Brussels. She thought that a lot of Europeans were looking for the UK to tell Barnier to "**** Off" - her words - because without our money the whole thing becomes incredibly difficult to operate. It might lead to a real slimming down of Brussels bureaucratic power. Very surreal really because she spoke fabulous English and I just didn't expect the tirade she delivered.

Of the countries that were offered a referendum on the EU constitution the votes were quite evenly split.

There seems to be a myth over here that everyone in continental Europe supports the EU, and also that the EU = Europe rather than the self serving bureaucracy that it really is.

My uncle is French and has always been very anti.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Tell the EU to go and swivel, and refuse to give them anymore money. They have treated this country like shit, and you know it too.

You have obviously given this a lot more thought in order to decide that this is the moment to introduce the 'toys out the pram' strategy into the negotiations

Unfortunately, you will find that your hardline Brexiteer friend, Suella Braverman has already committed us to paying the divorce bill, in full, with no guarantee of a trade deal in return.

But at least she is 'getting on with it'

 

[ManOfSussex]

Any news

The 5pm paywall update of The Times has finally appeared online. No news from Chequers, but 2 things of note in summary:

1. Cameron and Johnson's meeting last night was basically Johnson blaming anyone and everyone other than himself for the current mess.
2. Theresa May's blueprint has been seen and analysed*. She wants single market for just for goods, customs union partnership but no free movement of people as it exists, as a trade off. EU very unlikely to agree apparently. As expected, no mention of what replaces Free Movement/future immigration in the blueprint though (Free Movement of EU workers registering for Settled Status as was previously muted as an eventual trade off perhaps) Brexiteers not happy with this as she might just go back on her word in October that Free Movement ends.

* Analysis provided by Sam Lowe, of the Centre for European Reform. Definitely an expert, probably a rabid europhile as well as a remoaner (not sure of his sexual orientation but this is The Times not The Daily Mail.)

 

[Ernest]

The 5pm paywall update of The Times has finally appeared online. No news from Chequers, but 2 things of note in summary:

1. Cameron and Johnson's meeting last night was basically Johnson blaming anyone and everyone other than himself for the current mess.
2. Theresa May's blueprint has been seen and analysed*. She wants single market for just for goods, customs union partnership but no free movement of people as it exists, as a trade off. EU very unlikely to agree apparently. As expected, no mention of what replaces Free Movement/future immigration in the blueprint though (Free Movement of EU workers registering for Settled Status as was previously muted as an eventual trade off perhaps) Brexiteers not happy with this as she might just go back on her word in October that Free Movement ends.

* Analysis provided by Sam Lowe, of the Centre for European Reform. Definitely an expert, probably a rabid europhile as well as a remoaner (not sure of his sexual orientation but this is The Times not The Daily Mail.)

In other words kicking the can down for another few weeks

 

[WATFORD zero]

The 5pm paywall update of The Times has finally appeared online. No news from Chequers, but 2 things of note in summary:

2. Theresa May's blueprint has been seen and analysed*. She wants single market for just for goods, customs union partnership but no free movement of people as it exists, as a trade off. EU very unlikely to agree apparently. As expected, no mention of what replaces Free Movement/future immigration in the blueprint though (Free Movement of EU workers registering for Settled Status as was previously muted as an eventual trade off perhaps) Brexiteers not happy with this as she might just go back on her word in October that Free Movement ends.

So she's cherry picked which parts of the EU she wants to be part of. Can't see any problems starting the negotiations with that, none at all

 

[ManOfSussex]

So she's cherry picked which parts of the EU she wants to be part of. Can't see any problems starting the negotiations with that, none at all

The 'expert' who analysed the blueprint refers to it as the 'Jersey Option' and had previously stated a while back The EU wouldn't go for it if it's suggested as a fudge option as it's cherry picking. What does he know though.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

So she's cherry picked which parts of the EU she wants to be part of. Can't see any problems starting the negotiations with that, none at all

If the EU still wants our money in the future, they would meet this country half way, but as you say they won't. I made my conclusion about how the EU deal with change long before the referendum, and was the reason I voted Leave. I ask myself over and over again, how can one organisation have so much power of everyone, it's simply not right. The EU needs to learn to listen, not just to the politicians of each member, but more importantly it needs to listen to us, the people. I know you won't agree.

 

[Gwylan]

The EU wouldn't go for it if it's suggested as a fudge option as it's cherry picking.

So, that's what we're going to be selling in the future? It's not just jam then, the UK is going to corner the market in fudge and preserves

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

If the EU still wants our money in the future, they would meet this country half way, but as you say they won't. I made my conclusion about how the EU deal with change long before the referendum, and was the reason I voted Leave. I ask myself over and over again, how can one organisation have so much power of everyone, it's simply not right. The EU needs to learn to listen, not just to the politicians of each member, but more importantly it needs to listen to us, the people. I know you won't agree.

Another notch on the desperation crank.

We are leaving, they don’t have to do anything.

 

[The Clamp]

Pathetic.

 

[WATFORD zero]

If the EU still wants our money in the future, they would meet this country half way, but as you say they won't. I made my conclusion about how the EU deal with change long before the referendum, and was the reason I voted Leave. I ask myself over and over again, how can one organisation have so much power of everyone, it's simply not right. The EU needs to learn to listen, not just to the politicians of each member, but more importantly it needs to listen to us, the people. I know you won't agree.

Funnily enough I do agree that the EU needs to listen more, but electing UKIP MEPs who don't turn up or vote was never the way to do it.

The reason it is so powerful is because it is one of the biggest economic and political organizations on the the planet. It is large, cumbersome and has a lot of things that need changing.

However, having a paddy and throwing the baby out with the bathwater is not the way to address a complex set of issues.

The referendum was always a recipe for disaster and so it has proven.

Anyway, I'm on holiday and Mrs Wz is waiting to go out for dinner away from any WIFI links. I'm afraid that I believe, being charitable, you have been gullible and possibly naive at best.

Sorry, but years of working with government and politicians have, I believe, given me a very good understanding of how both work.

 

[Baldseagull]

Tell the EU to go and swivel, and refuse to give them anymore money. They have treated this country like shit, and you know it too.

Don't see it myself, I think we have the best arrangements of any member.

 

[portslade seagull]

Don't see it myself, I think we have the best arrangements of any member.

Maybe because we pay the most in

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Maybe because we pay the most in

No we don't, we're third.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/316691/european-union-eu-budget-share-of-contributions/

 

[Baldseagull]

If the EU still wants our money in the future, they would meet this country half way, but as you say they won't. I made my conclusion about how the EU deal with change long before the referendum, and was the reason I voted Leave. I ask myself over and over again, how can one organisation have so much power of everyone, it's simply not right. The EU needs to learn to listen, not just to the politicians of each member, but more importantly it needs to listen to us, the people. I know you won't agree.

I can't see why we should expect to be met halfway, but if all we were asking for was halfway, we might have a chance. What we are asking for is to have it all our way.