[Politics] Brexit

[Pretty pink fairy]

I will happily admit to that. I would hope that parliament overturns it rather than another referendum, and I'll tell you for why. We are, on the whole, simply not intelligent or informed enough to even begin to understand what it takes to enact a successful separation from the EU. We haven't the first clue about the economics or legalities, the nuances and caveats it takes to achieve such things and certainly no idea of the impact it will have. We should never have been trusted with this. The result proved that. Another consideration is of course, if we got it wrong again, people like you would be achingly smug and unbearable and your bigoted, ill informed behaviour would multiply a thousand fold. Unbearable!

No, far better to let experts and better educated and informed people make the decision. Let the government we elected to make huge decisions like this make huge decisions like this

ding dong merrily on high the Christmas Goon has arrived
regards
DR

 

[The Clamp]

You're in the same camp as @Lincoln Imp then ... General elections aren't good enough nor are referendums (frightfully democratic) and you both can't provide a coherent response to the points I raise so divert elsewhere. At least you didn't head in the direction of The Clamp to try and rescue your democratically bankrupt position.

Democracy is two foxes and a chicken deciding what to eat for lunch.

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

still leaving by the way
regards
DR

 

[The Clamp]

ding dong merrily on high the Christmas Goon has arrived
regards
DR

Yes. He has hasn't he. How are you today, ya daft racist?

 

[The Clamp]

still leaving by the way
regards
DR

Are you? Piss off then

TBTC

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

JUST REMEMBER FOLKS ,THE SOUTH EAST VOTED TO LEAVE THE EU, you can't let a few lefty /Green individuals on here tell you anything different, keep it real and be seeing you .
regards
DR

 

[dazzer6666]

I will happily admit to that. I would hope that parliament overturns it rather than another referendum, and I'll tell you for why. We are, on the whole, simply not intelligent or informed enough to even begin to understand what it takes to enact a successful separation from the EU. We haven't the first clue about the economics or legalities, the nuances and caveats it takes to achieve such things and certainly no idea of the impact it will have. We should never have been trusted with this. The result proved that. Another consideration is of course, if we got it wrong again, people like you would be achingly smug and unbearable and your bigoted, ill informed behaviour would multiply a thousand fold. Unbearable!

No, far better to let experts and better educated and informed people make the decision. Let the government we elected to make huge decisions like this make huge decisions like this. The referendum showed one thing and one thing only. 52% of British people are stupid enough to protest vote us out of the strongest union we have ever known.

Did the same considerations apply to the referendum result that took us in to the EU in the 70s or does this only work one way ?

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

**** OFF did it.

I know it's hard to take in isn't it
regards
DR

 

[The Clamp]

Did the same considerations apply to the referendum result that took us in to the EU in the 70s or does this only work one way ?

I'll repeat. I don't think the general public are intelligent enough to vote on such matters.

 

[portslade seagull]

A simplistic response that ignores the central point that if the question was asked again there would be far more information available to voters, and a far clearer perspective on the likely effects of voting one way or the other, than there was 18 months ago.
If, in these circumstances, people voted to Leave the EU then that would clearly be that.

You imply in your post that anyone voting for a particular party in a general election by definition supports every aspect of that party's manifesto. I think you're wrong but perhaps we should agree to disagree.

Finally, there have been occasions when voters have been faced with second referendums on EU issues but in most of these cases - Ireland and Denmark particularly spring to mind - the second referendum followed major policy changes designed to meet the voters' stated concerns.

If people still voted out which I think they would with a greater majority you would still bleat. So let's not go down that path

 

[portslade seagull]

And previously the people democratically decided on NINE occasions, since we had the referendum on joining the common market, that we should have pro EU governments in place.

So on nine occasions we voted to effectively remain in the EU, but you wanted the question asked again, how very EU.

When were they? Must have missed them all. Was it a general vote

 

[Lincoln Imp]

Yes it will. By something happening you mean one of the main parties reneging on their manifesto commitment/electoral mandate. Democracy my arse.

But the only reason one of the main parties would adopt a new policy on the implementation of Brexit would be as a result of the people's view on the matter changing... Democracy.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

You're in the same camp as @Lincoln Imp then ... General elections aren't good enough nor are referendums (frightfully democratic) and you both can't provide a coherent response to the points I raise so divert elsewhere. At least you didn't head in the direction of The Clamp to try and rescue your democratically bankrupt position.

Sorry, I didn't realise you were still raising points - I thought you were on endless loop repeat. Anyway, the last time I asked you a quietly put question on the subject you completely ignored it and went off on one of your na-na-na rants, delivered at volume.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

Did the same considerations apply to the referendum result that took us in to the EU in the 70s or does this only work one way ?

I take your point of course but you rather proved the point you're arguing against - the 70s referendum didn't take us into the EU.

 

[WATFORD zero]

The bottom line is that if sufficient politicians (of whichever political hue) think that sufficient people have more information and have changed their minds, there will be another vote. No matter who rants and rages on here

 

[pastafarian]

Not true. The 1983 Labour Manifesto was for pulling out of Europe.
So, the electorate could have voted for anti-EU major party.
It was Labour's lowest vote for decades

The 83 manifesto was a socialist manifesto to pull out of the EEC that at that time was only a handful of countries, it wasnt really to pull out of the European Union that came into being later after Maastricht in 1993. The political union we have now is vastly different from what was voted in the original referendum or what could even be imagined in 1983.

 

[The Clamp]

IMF has a very special, very clear message to Brexiteers; Brexit is damaging the economy.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/b...recasts-eu-referendum-forecasts-a8119886.html

 

[pastafarian]

I'll repeat. I don't think the general public are intelligent enough to vote on such matters.

You have shown time and again that you yourself are not intelligent enough to vote on such matters, the rest of your remain colleagues and leave voters on here are intellectually capable enough to discuss brexit with viewpoints aided by references and then vote (even though they are contradictory). Perhaps just try and recognise your own failings of dimwitterey before tarring everyone with the same brush because you are embarrassed at your own obvious inadequacy.

 

[Driver8]

I'll repeat. I don't think the general public are intelligent enough to vote on such matters.

I don’t think it’s intelligence, more that the public don’t have the knowledge or expertise. Such an important decision shouldn’t have been decided on emotional themes like immigration but on the facts, about which we know very little.

 

[Gwylan]

The 83 manifesto was a socialist manifesto to pull out of the EEC that at that time was only a handful of countries, it wasnt really to pull out of the European Union that came into being later after Maastricht in 1993. The political union we have now is vastly different from what was voted in the original referendum or what could even be imagined in 1983.

That completely ignores the point.

"And previously the people democratically decided on NINE occasions, since we had the referendum on joining the common market, that we should have pro EU governments in place."

I was replying to the specific point that in every election since the referendum, the two major parties were pro-Europe. That clearly wasn't the case

(And I disagree that present Europe is different what could have been imagined back in the 80s, the aim has been ever closer political union since 1957, it's not something that's been sneaked in)