[Politics] Brexit

[ManOfSussex]

Leave.EU are fuming.

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[Two Professors]

Ah. Regis etc were at West Brom 5 years later in 1977. The article relates to a period 5 years after you claim. None of this stacks up. You’re definitely bullshitting.

You really must cut back on the drinking,it has obviously started to damage your brain.Where did I mention drinking with Regis?The article was just to show the Four in Hand was the players local.Hope you recover quickly.

 

[beorhthelm]

I think he's saying it's a waste of money because it looks likely that we are paying a lot of money to basically still abide by plenty of EU laws and regulations, yet have no say over them anymore

we dont really know what we will or wont abide by, good bad or ugly yet, just what we have to settle up. lets break it down a bit. we leave and there's 18mths of budget period left, we are asking for a transition period of a couple of years, in which time we are told (not directly of course) by the EU that we're committed to some projects. then pensions and some technical arrangments on Eurozone bailouts and similar. half of the amount is just on the remaining budget period, then some reduced rate for the transition period. we dont have any say over this expenditure anyway and its not dependent on abiding to any regulations either.

 

[Ernest]

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[Mellotron]

we dont really know what we will or wont abide by, good bad or ugly yet, just what we have to settle up. lets break it down a bit. we leave and there's 18mths of budget period left, we are asking for a transition period of a couple of years, in which time we are told (not directly of course) by the EU that we're committed to some projects. then pensions and some technical arrangments on Eurozone bailouts and similar. half of the amount is just on the remaining budget period, then some reduced rate for the transition period. we dont have any say over this expenditure anyway and its not dependent on abiding to any regulations either.

So you disagree with the commentators on both sides of the Leave/Remain spectrum who are in agreement this looks very, very much like a soft/nonexistent Brexit, as was always suspected/expected by the majority?

 

[CHAPPERS]

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[ManOfSussex]

Farage reckons the bill will be 60 Billion. He 'aint happy.

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[Dave the OAP]

Epic trolling from the EU to announce the free trade deal with Japan this morning.

They want japanese cars to be built in EU and it looks like this may be the sweetener?

For the people of Sunderland who voted out btw, lets hope this doesn't come back to bite them on the bum!

 

[Ernest]

Problem for Farage is that UKIP barely exists as a political party so unless him and the other Brexit headbangers like IDS, Jenkin etc take over the Tory Party there is little he can do but grizzle on the TV

 

[Dave the OAP]

it certainly does open a route to a softer Brexit, though it doesnt prescribe that it as it not the final agreement. anything that ruled out form of exit at this stage would be daft for all concerned, since we havent got to negotiating all the trade, market and cross boarder arrangements yet. its quite possible to have an arrangement on the Irish border involving available technology, that falls short of lasers and pixies. agreement and time to implement are the obstacles.

you just know that the "hard brexit" people like Rees Mogg will all gang up and vote against the government at some time...that would appear to be May's fate

 

[pastafarian]

If I was a Leave voter I would be absolutely fuming right now - plenty are on Twitter and Facebook, this place seems to have avoided the meltdown somehow...touch of the Comical Ali I suspect.

Why?
That joint report recognises we are leaving the customs union and single market(article 45), recognises ECJ will have primacy on judicial procedures up to and including the day of withdrawal, but not after(article 93), recognises free movement will be ending on a specified date( the withdrawal date) as EU citizens will need new agreed protections (articles 6,7,8). There has been a compromise on the specifics of citizens rights, May wanted 5 years of ECJ involvement in citizens rights,EU wanted 15. They have compromised on 8. The UK courts will make decisions on EU citizens rights here but have due regard to whether relevant EU case-law exists and ask the CJEU questions of interpretation, after 8 years the ECJ has no more influence on the subject of citizens rights if queries arise(article 38)

Your "we must be fuming" seems to be more wishful thinking more than anything
We are still leaving the EU, things moving on nicely
Tick tock as they say

 

[Dave the OAP]

Quite.

£35 billion for what? To reach alignment with what we already have but then have zero input on what follows?

To be fair Chappers, we were always going to have to pay our dues. We signed off the EU budget until 2020() and we will have to pay our proportion of that. Its the old argument about getting a bar bill after drinking your share and then walking away without paying. The interesting point in all of this is how the EU will continue and to what point will they pay fro schemes in teh UK that they have given grants and commitments for. On a very minor point, we have seen this already with the European City of Culture, where they disqualified UK cities ( even though we are technically still in the EU until 2019)...and we will still be regarded as an island off the continent of Europe....or are they saying that now we wont be regarded as European?

 

[CHAPPERS]

Owen Jones (I know, I know) makes this very valid point

It’s clear what the Tories’ hard Brexiteer game is now. The major battles should all be delayed for the second phase. And that indeed is the problem. To keep this mess on the road, May has, as Philip Hammond pointed out, prevented her ministers from discussing the Brexit “end state”. Negotiations over what a final Brexit deal really looks like haven’t even begun within the British government, let alone between it and the EU. This agreement paves the way for the softest, “Brexit means Brexit in name only” deal. Will those who have made a hard Brexit their defining life mission really stomach such a proposition?

 

[ManOfSussex]

Problem for Farage is that UKIP barely exists as a political party so unless him and the other Brexit headbangers like IDS, Jenkin etc take over the Tory Party there is little he can do but grizzle on the TV

The 'leave means leave'/European Research Group lot generally seem quiet this morning, though I have noticed Owen Paterson isn't quite as enamoured with the agreement as the cabinet.

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[pastafarian]

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Two glaring omissions obviously
EU compromised/caved in on wanting 15 years oversight for ECJ on the matter of citizens rights against May`s 5 years preference, they have backed down to 8 years.
EU compromised/caved in on not wanting criminal checks involved in the procedure of those seeking settled status here, they will now be subject to criminal and security checks.

Carry on with your twitter memes though, gives manofsussex some pictures to look at.

 

[beorhthelm]

So you disagree with the commentators on both sides of the Leave/Remain spectrum who are in agreement this looks very, very much like a soft/nonexistent Brexit, as was always suspected/expected by the majority?

you've just switched from debating the financial settlement to the overall agreement. on that wider issue i'm disagreeing only to the extent that this is not the final agreement. we dont know what the future trade/market interactions will be, because they have not yet been discussed remember.

 

[ManOfSussex]

Carry on with your twitter memes though, gives manofsussex some pictures to look at.

Better than looking at the 'spare porn' and all the rest of the filth a posh boy, saddo like you looks at on the internet.

 

[pastafarian]

Better than looking at the 'spare porn' and all the rest of the filth a posh boy, saddo like you looks at on the internet.

Do keep up my little Class Warrior, i mentioned ages ago the "spare porn" is no longer "spare"

 

[ManOfSussex]

Your "we must be fuming" seems to be more wishful thinking more than anything
We are still leaving the EU, things moving on nicely
Tick tock as they say

Have a look at some of the many comments on here - https://www.facebook.com/leaveeuofficial/

Plenty of people fuming.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

You really must cut back on the drinking,it has obviously started to damage your brain.Where did I mention drinking with Regis?The article was just to show the Four in Hand was the players local.Hope you recover quickly.

You really are a moron.

1) You claim you were drinking in a certain pub with Bryan Robson in 1972.
2) I state he was just 15 in 1972 and call bullshit on your story.
3) You then post a Guardian article about “the three degrees” who were Regis, Batson and Cunningham to back up your story. This article, by virtue of the fact it involves these players, relates to 1977 at the earliest. It does not relate to Bryan Robson in 1972.
4) You know full well I did not state, or even imply, you were boozing with Regis. You are using diversionary tactics from the main thrust of my argument which is.....you’re a liar.

Now, is that simple enough for your pea-sized bull shitting brain?