[Politics] Brexit

[GT49er]

You seem to overlook the fact that a high percentage of leve voters were Labour voters. The referendum vote was a cross party result. Just saying.

It might be a tad more accurate to say that a high percentage of leve [sic] voters were New Labour voters?

 

[ManOfSussex]

Would have happened anyway - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40811712

 

[Baldseagull]

This answer indicates that poor sovereign countries like Uganda don't get a fair deal from the EU, which (if that is what you mean) is quite possibly the first post you have made on this thread that I agree with. They don't get a fair deal, in some fairness to the EU they will be fairer to Uganda than Russia or China, but they will not be fair.

African countries are hamstrung by EU trade deals, whether due to unfair trade tariffs, cheap dumping or even its aid programs. These all make those poor countries ability (like Uganda) to help itself much more difficult. For example even second hand clothing donations from charities have had a profound effect on local clothing business in African countries, many of these go bust in the face of literally free second hand clothes.

They need fair trade, not aid.........that will never happen all the while the EU remains aggressively protectionist with CAP at the centre of that protectionist stance.

One last point, the UK is not Uganda......not even remotely.

You want to argue both sides of the coin, on the one hand the EU is too liberal and allows free labour and trade markets across the EU, something you have repeatedly argued is a bad thing, and simultaneously want to open up EU economy to poorer nations.
For me, the barrier to poorer African nations is an unfortunate side effect of the EU policy of ensuring working practices, animal welfare, environmental issues, product safety etc are up to scratch before letting any old Tom Dick or Harry sell their wares here. Aid could be directed at helping these countries to reach compliance.
It is something that needs to be addressed, if we remained as EU members you could lobby your MEP and MP to push this agenda, but as it is, we are leaving and could maybe do something as the UK alone, but I am betting we will be talking to the US and China etc for a long while and trying to maintain a standard of living here rather than making sure Uganda is getting a fair deal.

No one thinks the EU is without problems, just as the UK system of governance is not, but just ditching creates bigger problems than any it may solve.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

It might be a tad more accurate to say that a high percentage of leve [sic] voters were New Labour voters?

Evidence? (In any case, compare and contrast with fellow-Brexiteer CF's view that being anti-EU is among the oldest of old Labour traditions.)

 

[GT49er]

Evidence? (In any case, compare and contrast with fellow-Brexiteer CF's view that being anti-EU is among the oldest of old Labour traditions.)

You sound as if you are trying to set an A level question. Very boring. I never claimed to have evidence - I was part posing a question, part making a suggestion. As a suggestion, I suggest it is one which many reasonable people, both on the remain and leave sides, might find feasible. The fact that I support Brexit has no bearing on my feeling that the Labour leave vote may have been substantially New Labour.

 

[nicko31]

Would have happened anyway - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40811712

Suggests 1.2% growth in the next 2 quarters. Have I missed something but does that seems a tadge optimistic, that would be same as Q3 / Q4 2016?

 

[Baldseagull]

I have a feeling that if we changed the name of the European Union to The British Empire, there would be a lot less people in the UK worried about it becoming a superstate.

 

[studio150]

Would have happened anyway - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40811712

The following from the Sky report is interesting

The Bank also pointed out that household disposable incomes were likely to fall, in real terms, this year, as the squeeze caused by the rising pound found its way into consumers' pockets.

A subtle change in language also suggested that the Bank may be increasingly worried about the chances of Britain securing a smooth transition out of the EU.

While in its last set of minutes the Bank said that its forecasts were "conditioned on the assumption that the adjustment to the UK's new relationship with the EU is smooth", this time it said that the "projections assume that, in the interim, households and companies base their decisions on the expectation of a smooth adjustment."

In other words, while households may be expecting a smooth transition, the Bank may no longer be.



Realism hitting home

 

[Westdene Seagull]

I honestly never get bored of reminding you Thatcher boys these lessons, because they are undeniably true; it was the Tories that took us in under Heath and it was then the Tories that campaigned to remain in the EEC with Thatcher at the helm of the campaign in the 70s. It may be a boring repetitive refrain to you but it is the truth, only a cretin would argue that it's not true.

Who, after he left power, admitted in a TV interview that the aim was always full political and financial integration - a United States of Europe. He also admitted that they couldn't mention this during the referendum campaign because it would probably have meant we didn't join.

 

[ManOfSussex]

For me, the barrier to poorer African nations is an unfortunate side effect of the EU policy of ensuring working practices, animal welfare, environmental issues, product safety etc are up to scratch before letting any old Tom Dick or Harry sell their wares here. Aid could be directed at helping these countries to reach compliance.

Nail on head and it's not just poorer ones. When I lived in Botswana there was a Sunday newspaper expose that The Government and Botswana Meat Commission (BMC - Which is a national abattoir) was fabricating records in respect of Cattle history and passports, in regards to a potential EU export deal. When livestock is crossing the border into Zimbabwe where foot and mouth is endemic, and coming into contact with wild and bush animals that carry all sorts of diseases, there are problems which may never be resolved in regards to that and DEFRA or any supermarket here, whether we're EU members or not, is going to take the risk with the liabilities involved. The foot and mouth outbreak here in 2001 had its roots in contraband pig swill from there. I can remember an outbreak of swine disease when I was there and the shops were empty of pig products for 2 months.

When you've lived in a city that has cattle wandering down the street where you live, that 2 weeks before the police were called to and shot and killed a rabid dog that going mad at our Chinese neighbours dogs down the road, it's a big task to address the issues you rightly state.

 

[Two Professors]

I have a feeling that if we changed the name of the European Union to The British Empire, there would be a lot less people in the UK worried about it becoming a superstate.

There might be some ethnic and religious minority people in government if it did change.Bet Nehru wouldn't get a job in Brussels!

 

[Two Professors]

In other news,inflation has fallen back to 2.6%,as the BBC would say "despite Brexit".All these super EU regulations on food didn't stop the Rumanians,Hungarians,etc flogging horsemeat as beef,did it,until most of Europe had been consuming it for years!

 

[Albumen]

The following from the Sky report is interesting

The Bank also pointed out that household disposable incomes were likely to fall, in real terms, this year, as the squeeze caused by the rising pound found its way into consumers' pockets.

A subtle change in language also suggested that the Bank may be increasingly worried about the chances of Britain securing a smooth transition out of the EU.

While in its last set of minutes the Bank said that its forecasts were "conditioned on the assumption that the adjustment to the UK's new relationship with the EU is smooth", this time it said that the "projections assume that, in the interim, households and companies base their decisions on the expectation of a smooth adjustment."

In other words, while households may be expecting a smooth transition, the Bank may no longer be.



Realism hitting home

Those head in the sand households? There will be nothing smooth about his transition, should it crazily go ahead.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I have a feeling that if we changed the name of the European Union to The British Empire, there would be a lot less people in the UK worried about it becoming a superstate.

I think The Fourth Reich has a better ring to it.

 

[nicko31]

GBP / Euro - 1.10, a 7 year low. Fast becoming the poor man of Europe

Still the workshy Farage is doing OK, another couple of percent of his salary

 

[CheeseRolls]

So let me get this right, I have demonstrated the case for why euro scepticism has deep roots on the political left, but you don't think I support the objectives of the political left because my post lacks "conviction".

I am not sure how I can deal with that, maybe for you I will Ned to add in the odd reference to "comrade" or "eat the rich"......would that make you happy?

Try writing about stuff you give an sh1t about rather than regurgitating random this will piss off trendy lefties stuff. You are just oozing insincerity with this stuff.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

 

[Two Professors]

I think The Fourth Reich has a better ring to it.

Given the Third Reich only lasted 12 years,I can live with that.Hope the criminals get prosecuted a bit better than Lafarge,though!

 

[BigGully]

GBP / Euro - 1.10, a 7 year low. Fast becoming the poor man of Europe

Still the workshy Farage is doing OK, another couple of percent of his salary

I have noted that typically you swerve from one singular perceived economic indicator to another depending how it might be performing, the FTSE a favoured pre referendum indicator from the doom merchants is no longer mentioned [MENTION=267]TSB[/MENTION] still having sleepless nights no doubt, current fuel prices seem to be ditched too, employment figures also shoved to the side, my favourite was the supposed unsustainable holiday cost to the coasta bravas thankfully that never happened, inflation bobbing along just fine, no runaway double digit disaster, due to back within BoE targets by next year by all accounts that dastardly weaker pound just not delivering just yet, interest rates remain historically low, house prices ease, this has confused Remainers they are not sure if this should be hailed good or bad so they stay quiet and wait, how about GDP topping G7 2016 that was just funny but obviously irrelevent for Remainers until it became the lowest, then bingo, now the pound is at 7 year low and makes us the poor man of Europe, yeah righto.

 

[cunning fergus]

Try writing about stuff you give an sh1t about rather than regurgitating random this will piss off trendy lefties stuff. You are just oozing insincerity with this stuff.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

What a strange onion you are?

I thought we had agreed a consensus on the meaningful origins of left wing Eurosceptism, and why I continue to challenge the capitalist Tory shithouses that are manifesting themselves as lefties.

We both know they are in fact trendy righties. You can spot the type easily, they are on this thread pissing their pants about the loss of Banking jobs and the demise of the City. With their invectives they are evidently not trendy lefties.

I don't know you, and I don't care about what you ooze when you post.........I think it's always better to focus on the facts and keep your emotions under control.

 

[cunning fergus]

Who, after he left power, admitted in a TV interview that the aim was always full political and financial integration - a United States of Europe. He also admitted that they couldn't mention this during the referendum campaign because it would probably have meant we didn't join.

Indeed, agreed it with Pompidou and never even told the cabinet.

They only found out when the draft agenda for the first meeting arrived, it's why you can never trust the Tories.

Heath, Thatcher, Major, Blair, Mandelson, Kinnock, Brown et al.

All Tory b@stards.