[Politics] Brexit

[heathgate]

Since the referendum over 8 months ago they have had ample opportunity to tell them they can stay, and they haven't yet. I don't know.

..... and Merkel and Juncker have had nothing to say about UK citizens living in EU, have they? They insist nothing can be discussed until A50 is invoked.

.... again, why give away a bargaining chip for when we are allowed to negotiate?



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[Herr Tubthumper]

It's pointless gesture politics...... why give away a bargaining chip before negotiations have begun? Do a deal that benefits UK citizens abroad the same as EU citizens here.... simple.

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Why? Because it's immoral to trade human lives like this and as I said surely not the British way. I'm disgusted that May is using decent families in this way to some how protect people like me who have decided to leave the UK.

 

[heathgate]

Why? Because it's immoral to trade human lives like this and as I said surely not the British way.

So the UK human lives are less of a moral dilemma than the EU human lives then?

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[JC Footy Genius]

I don't think it's as much a case of needing the EUs, as you put it. It's more about doing the decent and moral thing. Holding these people to ransom, using families as bargaining chips, is totally and utterly disgusting behaviour. And above all it's not the British way of doing things.

More like the German/EU way of doing things ..

Angela Merkel says 'nein' to Theresa May's calls for early deal on rights of EU migrants and British ex-pats

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...ritish-voters-backed-brexit-creating-anxiety/

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

So the UK human lives are less of a moral dilemma than the EU human lives then?

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I'm not sure what you mean. Care to explain?

 

[heathgate]

More like the German/EU way of doing things ..

Angela Merkel says 'nein' to Theresa May's calls for early deal on rights of EU migrants and British ex-pats

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...ritish-voters-backed-brexit-creating-anxiety/

...and in one post, clearly highlights how blinded and corrupted [MENTION=409]Herr Tubthumper[/MENTION] has become in his 'Fatherland Utopia'... his views so out of touch with reality, that clearly make his contributions on this subject, invalid.

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[cheshunt seagull]

It's pointless gesture politics...... why give away a bargaining chip before negotiations have begun? Do a deal that benefits UK citizens abroad the same as EU citizens here.... simple.

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I'm sure that the 3 bargaining chips in my team will understand this when I meet them in the office later..these are real, decent, people who came to a country that they massively respected.

Alternatively a simple message that individual rights will be respected by all could set a civilised tone that this whole process needs and one which could start to ease the tribalism that characterises the attitudes of both camps in the UK.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

More like the German/EU way of doing things ..

Angela Merkel says 'nein' to Theresa May's calls for early deal on rights of EU migrants and British ex-pats

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...ritish-voters-backed-brexit-creating-anxiety/

We are talking about the UK, the country May has control over. Let's stick to the case in point eh.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

...and in one post, clearly highlights how blinded and corrupted [MENTION=409]Herr Tubthumper[/MENTION] has become in his 'Fatherland Utopia'... his views so out of touch with reality, that clearly make his contributions on this subject, invalid.

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I'm happy to take abuse...as long as I can fully understand it. Again, I'm not clear what your point is....this is incoherent. Have you been drinking? Or just incapable of stringing a clear sentence together?

 

[JC Footy Genius]

...and in one post, clearly highlights how blinded and corrupted [MENTION=409]Herr Tubthumper[/MENTION] has become in his 'Fatherland Utopia'... his views so out of touch with reality, that clearly make his contributions on this subject, invalid.

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The William Joyce of NSC?

 

[daveinprague]

...and in one post, clearly highlights how blinded and corrupted [MENTION=409]Herr Tubthumper[/MENTION] has become in his 'Fatherland Utopia'... his views so out of touch with reality, that clearly make his contributions on this subject, invalid.

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Maybe, because the Article 50 hasnt been triggered. Then it will be, im sure. This is not about the EU. It is about the intentions of the UK Government.
Why would the British Government be 'disappointed' about having to guarantee the rights of EU citizens in the UK, and seek to overturn it?

 

[heathgate]

I'm sure that the 3 bargaining chips in my team will understand this when I meet them in the office later..these are real, decent, people who came to a country that they massively respected.

Alternatively a simple message that individual rights will be respected by all could set a civilised tone that this whole process needs and one which could start to ease the tribalism that characterises the attitudes of both camps in the UK.

But the 9 bargaining chips ( 1 French, 6, Dutch, 2 Spanish) who work in my team, all fully understand that you cannot do a deal that doesn't include reciprocal arrangements... common sense, you can't run a negotiation of this importance on one sided goodwill gestures and emotional aspirations.

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[heathgate]

So the UK human lives are less of a moral dilemma than the EU human lives then?

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.... because you don't seem to be demanding a similar statement from your beloved Juncker about the guaranteed status of UK citizens in EU... do you?

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[Herr Tubthumper]

But the 9 bargaining chips ( 1 French, 6, Dutch, 2 Spanish) who work in my team, all fully understand that you cannot do a deal that doesn't include reciprocal arrangements... common sense, you can't run a negotiation of this importance on one sided goodwill gestures and emotional aspirations.

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Yes you can. You do the decent and honourable thing and lay down a very clear marker to the EU by stating all EU citizens can stay. There are many strategies in negotiation and this particular approach seems the most decent and most appropriate one for this situation.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

We are talking about the UK, the country May has control over. Let's stick to the case in point eh.

Thought we were talking about 'Holding these people to ransom, using families as bargaining chips' The British tried to do the right thing and nullify this issue at the earliest opportunity but were blocked by people you have yet to condemn who are obviously intent on Holding these people to ransom, using families as bargaining chips.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

.... because you don't seem to be demanding a similar statement from your beloved Juncker about the guaranteed status of UK citizens in EU... do you?

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You're now quoting yourself? Can you just stop for a few minutes, take a few deep breaths and have a think about what it is you are actually trying to say.

You will benefit from this just as much as we will.

 

[heathgate]

Maybe, because the Article 50 hasnt been triggered. Then it will be, im sure. This is not about the EU. It is about the intentions of the UK Government.
Why would the British Government be 'disappointed' about having to guarantee the rights of EU citizens in the UK, and seek to overturn it?

Indeed... A50 hasn't yet been triggered, Juncker keeps telling us nothing can be discussed until then,..... so let's wait and see how it evolves once our gentle peers on the red benches are bypassed and the bill gives us forward momentum.

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[Herr Tubthumper]

Thought we were talking about 'Holding these people to ransom, using families as bargaining chips' The British tried to do the right thing and nullify this issue at the earliest opportunity but were blocked by people you have yet to condemn who are obviously intent on Holding these people to ransom, using families as bargaining chips.

Blaming others, in this case nations over which you have no control, IS a very British thing to do. Stop pointing the finger and take control of the UK.....after all this is what was promised.

 

[daveinprague]

Indeed... A50 hasn't yet been triggered, Juncker keeps telling us nothing can be discussed until then,..... so let's wait and see how it evolves once our gentle peers on the red benches are bypassed and the bill gives us forward momentum.

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but, why would the British government, be disappointed by the Lords, and seek to overturn a guarantee of EU citizens rights in the UK, following Brexit. This has nothing to do with the EU. It is about the British governments intent, post Brexit.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

The William Joyce of NSC?

I'm not American.