[Politics] Brexit

[BadFish]

Or even communism!

Oh sweet irony, as your previous post served as a fine example of his description.

 

[El Presidente]

Completely agree. I think this illustrates the point about the relative merits of skilled and
unskilled immigration. Skilled people have been traveling between countries for centuries. I think it should be encouraged and particularly with regard to India. As you say, that market is extremely challenging and we need all the local knowledge we can get ! If we can replace unskilled Euro area immigration with a smaller number of skilled workers and students from
India (and elsewhere, including the EU) our economy will benefit and we would not face the current downward pressure on the wages of the low skilled and low paid. Sounds simplistic but so is the free for all that comes with EU membership.

I understand where you are coming from in relation to unskilled EU labour, but everyone I speak to doesn't want their (British) kids to grow up to be fruit pickers, care assistants or hotel cleaners. So we have a paradox, those who want significant controls on migration tend to agree that skilled labour from overseas is desireable, but equally don't want to do the unskilled vacancies that are likely to exist if it becomes more difficult for that sector of the workforce to come to the UK.

As for wage levels, the research work that has been done to date indicates that wages and only depressed for the lowest paid decile of the UK population, and that is by about 1% over 8 years. (see attached from the FT).

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

I understand where you are coming from in relation to unskilled EU labour, but everyone I speak to doesn't want their (British) kids to grow up to be fruit pickers, care assistants or hotel cleaners. So we have a paradox, those who want significant controls on migration tend to agree that skilled labour from overseas is desireable, but equally don't want to do the unskilled vacancies that are likely to exist if it becomes more difficult for that sector of the workforce to come to the UK.

As for wage levels, the research work that has been done to date indicates that wages and only depressed for the lowest paid decile of the UK population, and that is by about 1% over 8 years. (see attached from the FT).

View attachment 79252

It's not scientific but I have relatives in some of the low paid jobs you mention. Anecdotally, I have also
heard of the difficulty of students in getting low paid work that I took for granted at that age. The conundrum you mention though is I'm sure very real for many. However, when there are such large numbers of unskilled foreign workers here it is actually quite difficult to believe the 1% figure. The wages for this group of people are scandalous when compared to the cost of living
for families in this country. It is no exaggeration to say that for many people
from abroad sending wages home those wages represent relative riches. There must be assumptions used in that study that somehow do not quantify the likely wage effects of taking unskilled EU Labour out of the market completely. I know this is unrealistic and not even desirable but I would have thought that should be the closest measure of the wage impact.

 

[El Presidente]

It's not scientific but I have relatives in some of the low paid jobs you mention. Anecdotally, I have also
heard of the difficulty of students in getting low paid work that I took for granted at that age. The conundrum you mention though is I'm sure very real for many. However, when there are such large numbers of unskilled foreign workers here it is actually quite difficult to believe the 1% figure. The wages for this group of people are scandalous when compared to the cost of living
for families in this country. It is no exaggeration to say that for many people
from abroad sending wages home those wages represent relative riches. There must be assumptions used in that study that somehow do not quantify the likely wage effects of taking unskilled EU Labour out of the market completely. I know this is unrealistic and not even desirable but I would have thought that should be the closest measure of the wage impact.

Surely having minimum wage (and now living wage) legislation in existence is a form of safeguarding those most vulnerable to the excesses of employer bullying. There are still those who will find away around it (Amazon, Mike Ashley etc.) but it's a domestic rather than EU issue. The way the benefits system works it is not worthwhile moving away from JSA to paid employment for short term work sadly. EU migrant workers therefore fill these gaps.

 

[Hamilton]

Theresa May is way out of her depth

She is either a genius that is playing a long game, or an opportunist that now realises she has bitten off more than she can chew. But which?

 

[Mackenzie]

She is either a genius that is playing a long game, or an opportunist that now realises she has bitten off more than she can chew. But which?

Hopefully she'll get good advice from her ministers.....for all of our sakes!

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

She seems to be trying to go full tilt for something she didn't believe in in the first place..........

 

[Icy Gull]

Who wouldn't be out of their depth in this post Brexit shit storm?

 

[sir albion]

She's facing something that no other prime minister has faced....She's doing just fine considering all the "in" gloom merchants are crying like babies and will always attempt to make things difficult.Not to mention she's actually bigging up our country with positivity while the doom merchants are making us look like a bunch of pussies and that includes many of the mp's who're bitter because they want a piece of the EU gravy train.
It will all fall in place as I'm bored shitless of hearing people like Corbin banging on about she doesn't know what she's doing....she does and I have faith in her delivering what's required.It seems we're awash with lefty socialists nowadays who're derailing things because they always seem to be right all the bloody time....twats!!

 

[crookie]

She seems to be trying to go full tilt for something she didn't believe in in the first place..........

Yes, that is the strange thing for me. Yes we (myself included) voted out, but it was hardly a massive majority, and for the sake of some kind of National unity, she should be treading carefully, and trying to bring the whole country with her. I applaud her talking positively about the future, I'm sure we'll make the best of Brexit, but I can't see the point of jetsetting around talking trade deals whilst we are more than 2 years away from exiting the EU anyway. Far better to spend her time deciding what our actual negotiating strategy should be when we finally trigger article 50, and perhaps some discreet behind the scenes discussions with other EU leaders. It's all very well banging on about getting the 'Best Deal fro Britain', but the rest of the EU are hardly going to roll over and give us a deal that is in our best interests, unless it is very much in theirs as well.

 

[Raleigh Chopper]

She's facing something that no other prime minister has faced....She's doing just fine considering all the "in" gloom merchants are crying like babies and will always attempt to make things difficult.Not to mention she's actually bigging up our country with positivity while the doom merchants are making us look like a bunch of pussies and that includes many of the mp's who're bitter because they want a piece of the EU gravy train.
It will all fall in place as I'm bored shitless of hearing people like Corbin banging on about she doesn't know what she's doing....she does and I have faith in her delivering what's required.It seems we're awash with lefty socialists nowadays who're derailing things because they always seem to be right all the bloody time....twats!!

Another embarrassing rant.
She and the Government have not got a clue what they are going to do.

 

[Buzzer]

Another embarrassing rant.
She and the Government have not got a clue what they are going to do.

And yet she will still win the next election by a huge margin over Labour. Ouch!

 

[Baldseagull]

She seems to be trying to go full tilt for something she didn't believe in in the first place..........

I think she is just a loyal Tory, she would have been pro leave if that was what the leadership was pushing.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

She's facing something that no other prime minister has faced....She's doing just fine considering all the "in" gloom merchants are crying like babies and will always attempt to make things difficult.Not to mention she's actually bigging up our country with positivity while the doom merchants are making us look like a bunch of pussies and that includes many of the mp's who're bitter because they want a piece of the EU gravy train.
It will all fall in place as I'm bored shitless of hearing people like Corbin banging on about she doesn't know what she's doing....she does and I have faith in her delivering what's required.It seems we're awash with lefty socialists nowadays who're derailing things because they always seem to be right all the bloody time....twats!!

You have been sniffing too much of the wet ink of the Daily Mail again. 'Corbin banging on' is probably one of the most deluded and asinine three words I have ever encountered. 'Man mounting Ronnie Corbit' is on about the same level of cuntwittery. Carry on 'sir' titwinkle

 

[Mental Lental]

EU migrant workers therefore fill these gaps.

Yeah but immigration is evil. All the papers say so.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

And yet she will still win the next election by a huge margin over Labour. Ouch!

Quite. If only Corbyn were banging on . . . . but insted he is in a deep deep sleep, probably in a library somewhere in Islington . . .

 

[FatSuperman]

I wouldn't say she's bitten off more than she can chew given she's not chosen this path herself. Equally however I don't think the type of person that can make PM would ever realise they are out of their depth.

I am sure she's very pro-Britain and I hope that patriotism transpires into positive action for Britain. As our firgurehead she certainly does need to get about pressing flesh - it's vital to show respect to our trading partners.

It's probably not worth mentioning the bizarre rant above, but I'll bite. I really don't get the rabid behaviour from both camps (only one camp now folks), clearly a load of nonsense based on no facts at all, just bile spewed out onto the screen. An MP that doesn't agree with it doesn't automatically mean they want to be on the gravy train. Jesus they are all soiled, even if they don't start that way they certainly end that way. It's part of the sordid game.

 

[beorhthelm]

She and the Government have not got a clue what they are going to do.

how do you know, isnt the central charge that they arent tell us anything? think you mean you dont know what they are going to do.

 

[heathgate]

It would be churlish for anyone to want a free trade greement to be unsuccessful. There are however a number of significant hurdles to overcome first. India has high tariffs and barriers to the domestic market, and has had significant GDP growth during that period. So the benefits to India for a free trade agreement must be significant for India before they sign up, as otherwise, why bother?

One of the concessions that Modi wants is more flexibility in relation to student visas. When May was Home Secretary she oversaw a regime which reduced these from 68,000 in 2010 to less than 12,000 by 2015. The average international student is paying £15,000 a year to study in the UK, so the HE sector is losing £840 million a year purely from fees, plus the ancillary amounts they spend in terms of transport, housing and ad hoc purchases.

Once these students graduate (and IMO they tend to be pretty good as a rule) then if there are graduate jobs available, then it makes sense to give them to the best candidates, regardless of birthplace, as grads tend to earn more and therefore pay more in tax than non-grads.

May is proposing a golden ticket in terms of speeding up the visa process for rich businessmen, but not much more. These businessmen didn't have many problems getting visas historically anyway.

Surely if British business expects to sell to India then it needs the knowledge of the market that comes from having, say, Indian MBA graduates working for British companies in the UK? Knowledge of the local market is essential, and so is networking. These students have both, which is why I can't understand the government's approach.

The offshoreing market for IT on its own is worth billions to Indian companies... I think Tata, Cognizant, Wipro and HCL have a lot at stake, I predict a deal will be done.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

 

[ThePompousPaladin]

She's facing something that no other prime minister has faced....She's doing just fine considering all the "in" gloom merchants are crying like babies and will always attempt to make things difficult.Not to mention she's actually bigging up our country with positivity while the doom merchants are making us look like a bunch of pussies and that includes many of the mp's who're bitter because they want a piece of the EU gravy train.
It will all fall in place as I'm bored shitless of hearing people like Corbin banging on about she doesn't know what she's doing....she does and I have faith in her delivering what's required.It seems we're awash with lefty socialists nowadays who're derailing things because they always seem to be right all the bloody time....twats!!

1st sentence very good, engaging.
After that, very little fact content, mainly emotions and mind reading. Entertaining, but not my cup of tea.