Blair - He Don't Care Anymore - He's OUTTA There!

[Dandyman]

I do not believe Blair is a "twat" as you so elequently put it.

I think he is a genuine person who passionately believes in what he stands for. But therein lies the problem which affects almost every politician you can name. They go into government and are instantly ambushed by this huge civil service machine that really runs the country.

From all the writings of the "serious" papers, Blair did believe that there were WMD in Iraq. He was told this by the Security Services, the military and the Americans. He was told that Iraq had produced long range missiles that could hit British targets in Cyprus. Saddam made sure that the weapons inspectors were sent on wild goose chases and chose to push and push until the USA and GB/Spain/Australia finally said enough is enough and went in and bopped him.

Now we have people jumping up and down and crying "civil liberties" when people are detained by the security services as possible terrorists and blaming Blair for this. What should Blair and the Government do...wait for a bomb to go off in London comitting mass murder?

Getting back to Blair....he hasn't looked well for the last year or so and it would not surprise me in the slightest if he stepped down for his health sake. Who will replace him? Brown probably, but he is hardly Mr Personality is he? As for the Tories....Michael Howard as PM...God help us. Oliver Lewin etc etc. No thanks

The UK is currently the only EU nation holding people indefinitely without charge or trial. "We" are able to do so because we are the only European country to declare a state of emergency which in turn allows us to legally opt out our commitments to human rights.

The actual intelligence advice supplied to Blair seems to have been more nuanced than an actual declaration that saddam did have WMD and there was no evidence of these from Hans Blick or any of the UN weapons inspectors.

In terms of a replacement for Blair I would, however, have to admit that depressingly I think you are probably right in the shorter term at least.

 

[Mr C]

I do not believe Blair is a "twat" as you so elequently put it.

I think he is a genuine person who passionately believes in what he stands for.

As for the Tories....Michael Howard as PM...God help us. Oliver Lewin etc etc. No thanks

Have to totally disagree with your first point there. Unfortunately (for the country) I think the only thing Blair cares about is how he looks to the public, his PR, and how his actions are perceived. Most of his (and the government's) actions are defined merely by whether they'll look good - they are the criteria behind decisions.

As for the Tories - well, can't be worse than this joke we have now really

 

[Dave the OAP]

Perhaps that is about perception and how the media manipulate the world we live in.

Everything these days is "sound bites" "the quick fix", "spin".

The image that Blair and his party were looking for when they were elected was young, vibrant, go ahead....in fact everything the tories under major were not. They played on this and the public swallowed it.

At the end of the day, the majority of senior politicians who get on in Parliament are all Lawyers. Its all about being able to project your argement well for the cameras.

That may be a scinical view but whne you have seen as many general elections and the crap that they spout you get very disheartened.

the ultimate irony is that not only have we put our lives in his hands by stirring up the Arabs, but we have put our future as a football club in his deputy's hands. Doesn't that make you feel good?

 

[Mr C]

I agree there is always going to be a certain amount of spin and PR associated with governments, but this one seems to have far too much of it. The substance/style ratio should be 80/20 perhaps, but New Labour seem to have it the other way round in my opinion. And for the record, I do think the Conservatives under Michael Howard would make a much better government and handle the country in a far more responsible and democratic manner.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Tom - are you a Margaret Thatchers secret lovechild?

Yeah, right. Voted Labour every election since I was old enough. If B.Liar's stood down in time for the next one (preferably because he's got a prior engagement in front of a War Crimes Commission), then I'll vote Labour at the next election too. Else I'll just abstain. Won't be hel[ping elect a Labour Prime Minister who sucked up to a Right Wing US Oil Sponsored Moron and led the UK into an illegal and immoral invasion of a sovereign state against the wishes of the church, the United Nations and the vast majority of the electorate.

As for being Margaret Thatcher's secret lovechild

 

[GNF on Tour]

Yeah, right. Voted Labour every election since I was old enough. If B.Liar's stood down in time for the next one (preferably because he's got a prior engagement in front of a War Crimes Commission), then I'll vote Labour at the next election too. Else I'll just abstain. Won't be hel[ping elect a Labour Prime Minister who sucked up to a Right Wing US Oil Sponsored Moron and led the UK into an illegal and immoral invasion of a sovereign state against the wishes of the church, the United Nations and the vast majority of the electorate.

As for being Margaret Thatcher's secret lovechild

Listen, I know how you feel, I wept when Kinnock failed and wept with joy when Blair truimphed. I hate the Tories with a fury and always will, I guess I'm not ready to give up on Labour yet and don;t blissfully ignore all the good that has been done since they took power, minimum wage, Northern Island, Social Charter, education funding etc etc. I think its it just a bit too "trendy student" to keep slagging him off when in fact I feel he was responding to some very genuine concerns. If you want the British to submit to liberal European wims then go and live in Strasbourg, as for being a Bush apoligist, wake up you idiot, don't you remeber 9/11, don't you remember 5,000 gassed Kurds, torture, religious persectiuon, rape and exploitation. But, hey thats ok lets just stand back and let him get on with it.

War for Oil - just PROVE it Tom, so far its all just your pontification, no substance mate.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

War for Oil - just PROVE it Tom, so far its all just your pontification, no substance mate.

GNF - the proof is being dug out bit by bit - there's some very smart people on the case. It was War for Oil just as surely as there were no WMDs that justified the war in the first place. At best, B.Liar was conned by Bush and dragged the UK into his crappy gung-ho adventure against the wishes of the British people. At worst he's right up there with the guilty Texan rednecks. Either way, the world's a far more dangerous place than it ever was before the illegal and immoral invasion.

 

[GNF on Tour]

GNF - the proof is being dug out bit by bit - there's some very smart people on the case. It was War for Oil just as surely as there were no WMDs that justified the war in the first place. At best, B.Liar was conned by Bush and dragged the UK into his crappy gung-ho adventure against the wishes of the British people. At worst he's right up there with the guilty Texan rednecks. Either way, the world's a far more dangerous place than it ever was before the illegal and immoral invasion.

I respect you point of view but don't agree with a word of it. If you stepped back from your obvious patholoical hatred of Bush then you might see you are being a little over-zealous. Even if WMD's were not there and had been used as the reason for war (and I beleive Blair honestly beleived they existed) then the fact this guy practiceed extermination WITH WMDs at one time was reason enough to send troops in.

The truth is being dig out bit by bit! Fine, but what is it?

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

The problem with Tony is that he thinks he is right and we simply need persuading of his view. He struggles with the fact it is not all obvious to us as well. He has decome confused over what is good for the country and what is good for Tony Blair.

I think he has stopped listening to those around him. If he cares for social justice in this country he would stand down now and let someone else lead the Labour party into the next election.

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

then the fact this guy practiceed extermination WITH WMDs at one time was reason enough to send troops in.

tosh. You would be prepared to lay down your life, or the life of your son or daughter for the use of WMD's ten years ago, which it appears we in the west sold him in the first place ?

I doubt it. Sanctimonious clap-trap.

 

[perseus]

Intelligence? It was complete fabrication!
The only army with weapons of mass destruction were the Americans.

Number 90 for Plymouth Argyle knew the score.

 

[Mr C]

I think he has stopped listening to those around him. If he cares for social justice in this country he would stand down now and let someone else lead the Labour party into the next election.

Well, I for one hope he stays and does not step down. If he steps down and (for example) Gordon Brown takes over, we may have another term of this godforsaken administration to put up with. At least if Blair stays he will lose Labour the next election. Here's hoping anyway

 

[fatbadger]

Ithe fact this guy practiceed extermination WITH WMDs at one time was reason enough to send troops in.

The first politician to order the gassing of the Kurds was Winston Churchill, in 1920.

But, hey, he is the 'Greatest Briton' according to last year's nationwide BBC poll.

 

[Brighton Breezy]

Tony Blair is great.

 

[Hunting 784561]

The Daily Express has ditched Blair and has decided to support Howard.

Blair must be quaking in his boots

 

[Dandyman]

Tony Blair is great.

Students. dontcha lurve 'em ?

 

[fatbadger]

Students. dontcha lurve 'em ?

No. But then, I have to teach the fuckers.

 

[Dave the OAP]

That was the same Winston Churchill that led the UK in its darkest hour against the Facists looking to invade our country

I suppose Mr fatbadger, it was a good thing that he did, or you and I would probably not be around to have our left wing views

 

[fatbadger]

That was the same Winston Churchill that led the UK in its darkest hour against the Facists looking to invade our country

I suppose Mr fatbadger, it was a good thing that he did, or you and I would probably not be around to have our left wing views

My point was not about Churchill, but rather about the constructions of Saddam.

 

[Locky]

FFS don't you people have memories..................
This labour government had to adopt all the Tory policies just to get elected in the first place...................they promised (as always) how they were going to improve our education and health systems, how they were not going to increase tax, and how they were going to pump loads of money into just about everything.
They took over when our economy was on the up and have benefited from it (or at least Brown has)
As far as Europe is concerned Blair is on a mission, and he seems intent on carrying it out, with or without the agreement of the British public...................In his eyes ......he knows best.

If he goes soon, or at the next election .....good riddance !!