Ban Fox Hunting Forever

[caz99]

Absolutely. That's what I said on page 1 - and I was being serious. If we're going to get all self-righteous about torturing animals for fun then it is the next logical step. You could argue that we do eat some of the fish and that others, after being tortured, are put back. So what? Surely it's the enjoyment of torturing animals we're protesting about?

It's not today's debate but the 'killing animals for food is ok' arguement will also be challenged soon. After all the fox doesn't know if it's being killed for food or fun. Is it better to be a 'free range' fox who until the last few hours lives all it's life as nature intended or a battery chicken or caged pig?

PS - I have no axe to grind, I don't give stuff about hunting one way or the other. Can we discuss something important now like Transport or the NHS?

so just because the fox doesn't know what is being ripped to shreds for its ok?

 

[Dr Schnell]

i would agree to a certain extent with you yes. and i am a hyprocrite in that i do eat chicken, which is the worst as they are bread in appalling conditions. not red meat mind, however you are talking about fox hunting which is a sport. usually animals are bred for meat, not any better however we don't chase cows and chickens across the countryside and then rip them to shreds and then not eat them. beagles are also bred especially for foxhunting and when they are no longer any good disposed of.i don't necessarily agree that we don't need meat to survive as i think man has been eating meat for centuries however it was probably more out of necessity then than it is now.

i agree i don't like shooting for example pheasants, hare coarsing, badger baiting although now supposedly illegal, bullfighting which is also now banned in a lot of areas of spain. i do not therefore agree with any sort of 'sport' involving animals. the same as any cruelty to humans would repel me.

so yes i am hypocritical from the point that i eat some meat and i am honest and hold my hands up to that. however i do not know how you can justify fox hunting.

Caz 99 I am not trying to justify fox hunting, just considering what implications a ban on it will have for other sports, pastimes etc

 

[Brovion]

....
so yes i am hypocritical from the point that i eat some meat and i am honest and hold my hands up to that. however i do not know how you can justify fox hunting.

Well done caz, most people won't admit to being hypocrites. On a similar subject it's like the debate over leather and fur. Some people think wearing leather is great but wearing fur is DISGUSTING! What they're saying in effect is "It's ok to wear animal skins so long as you wear them inside out."

 

[Dr Schnell]

It really shouldn't need explaining, Dr Schnell.

A fox is chased across the countryside by a pack of hounds. It is pursued until it is exhausted. The hounds eventually descend on the exhausted fox and inflict the most terrifying, agonising death imaginable on any living creature, by surrounding it and tearing it to pieces while it is still alive. The fox is completely shredded by dozens of snapping, snarling jaws. And this isn't done for food. It isn't done out of necessity. It is done for fun.

Now if you actually need someone to sit down with you and carefully explain to you why that activity is evil, then you sadly seem to have the same mental defect which seems to be present in the people who are dumping dead animals all over Brighton today.

Thanks Easy 10. See subsequent posts

 

[Dr Schnell]

Well done caz, most people won't admit to being hypocrites. On a similar subject it's like the debate over leather and fur. Some people think wearing leather is great but wearing fur is DISGUSTING! What they're saying in effect is "It's ok to wear animal skins so long as you wear them inside out."

Good point Brovian

 

[caz99]

Well done caz, most people won't admit to being hypocrites. On a similar subject it's like the debate over leather and fur. Some people think wearing leather is great but wearing fur is DISGUSTING! What they're saying in effect is "It's ok to wear animal skins so long as you wear them inside out."

except leather comes from cows and one way of putting it is that we kill cows for food therefore using skin.
furhunting is again unnecessary in this day and age. they are hunted and killed purely for fur, the cow population is not going to become extinct any time soon but mink, seal are

 

[Brovion]

so just because the fox doesn't know what is being ripped to shreds for its ok?

No! How on earth did you come to that conclusion?

 

[lost in london]

I am clearly insane (cue comments of "you said it"). I am not really that bothered about a fox being chased across a field. I know people who go 'hunting', they get no-where near the fox and just enjoy going for a ride across the countryside with their mates. I am not a bloodthirsty lunatic toff, I just don't see animals like foxes as being on a similar level to humans and deserving the same protection.

I just find it weird that there is not the same level of outrage and protests and debate in parliament and press coverage at the events in Sudan.

I also agree with Dr Schnell, where do we take all of this to? Banning everything that involves animals suffering? Fish in tanks? (They're rubbish in wartime situations anyway). As I said above I do feel that this is partly a class matter, sorry if you disagree.

I love NSC, but I hate the slagging off that goes on when someone dares to post an idea that may not match that of the vociferous and ruling minority.

 

[Brovion]

except leather comes from cows and one way of putting it is that we kill cows for food therefore using skin.
furhunting is again unnecessary in this day and age. they are hunted and killed purely for fur, the cow population is not going to become extinct any time soon but mink, seal are

We're posting across each other here!

Mink and seal are NOT going to become extinct - far from it. Bears and tigers - yes. However Also isn't it better to use natural, renewable sources for clothes as opposed to plastics? (Not bears and tigers obviously)

PS - I don't think there is much left of the fox for it to be made into a coat.

 

[Dr Schnell]

It really shouldn't need explaining, Dr Schnell.

A fox is chased across the countryside by a pack of hounds. It is pursued until it is exhausted. The hounds eventually descend on the exhausted fox and inflict the most terrifying, agonising death imaginable on any living creature, by surrounding it and tearing it to pieces while it is still alive. The fox is completely shredded by dozens of snapping, snarling jaws. And this isn't done for food. It isn't done out of necessity. It is done for fun.

Now if you actually need someone to sit down with you and carefully explain to you why that activity is evil, then you sadly seem to have the same mental defect which seems to be present in the people who are dumping dead animals all over Brighton today.

I am sitting conveniently on the fence on the subject of hunting and waiting for someone to knock me off either side. Unfortunately I have stumbled across a hurdle - as you will see from previous posts I am trying to see how eating animals can be justified in light of the bans on hunting. I like eating meat, I enjoy it. Particularly a nice piece of roast lamb. However, it is not necessary for me to eat meat. I could easily go veggie and stay perfectly healthy (maybe be more healthy). Think I am going to have to be a hyprocrite like Caz 99...

 

[caz99]

yes but the same argument arises how can you justify blood sports? they are done for enjoyment. i don necessarily think people in slaughterhouses enjoy their jobs they just do it.

once again as i eat chicken hypocritical.

 

[caz99]

We're posting across each other here!

Mink and seal are NOT going to become extinct - far from it. Bears and tigers - yes. However Also isn't it better to use natural, renewable sources for clothes as opposed to plastics? (Not bears and tigers obviously)

PS - I don't think there is much left of the fox for it to be made into a coat.

i agree but its just not realistic is it, in an ideal world we would all want to be saving the planet and recycling etc. but some people or rather some countries don't or won't do it.

i think you will find that mink and some seal are endangered in some areas. however more due to seal clubbing admittedly.

p.s they do actually make some coats out of fox fur as well.

 

[Meade's Ball]

I am clearly insane (cue comments of "you said it"). I am not really that bothered about a fox being chased across a field. I know people who go 'hunting', they get no-where near the fox and just enjoy going for a ride across the countryside with their mates. I am not a bloodthirsty lunatic toff, I just don't see animals like foxes as being on a similar level to humans and deserving the same protection.

I just find it weird that there is not the same level of outrage and protests and debate in parliament and press coverage at the events in Sudan.

I also agree with Dr Schnell, where do we take all of this to? Banning everything that involves animals suffering? Fish in tanks? (They're rubbish in wartime situations anyway). As I said above I do feel that this is partly a class matter, sorry if you disagree.

I love NSC, but I hate the slagging off that goes on when someone dares to post an idea that may not match that of the vociferous and ruling minority.

Personally, i am capable of being angry about a number of things at the same time. So, i demonstrate against fox-hunting alongside other things.
I'm a veggie and wouldn't mind fishing being banned. But i think that's a different argument really.

I'd wholeheartedly support demonstrations and public pressure being put on the Government to force them to aid the situation in Sudan. And if you set anything up to do something about it, advertise it on NSC because lots of people will get involved.


Your friends can go for a ride without a pack of dogs next to them. So that's really something of a nonsense.

 

[Meade's Ball]

I am sitting conveniently on the fence on the subject of hunting and waiting for someone to knock me off either side. Unfortunately I have stumbled across a hurdle - as you will see from previous posts I am trying to see how eating animals can be justified in light of the bans on hunting. I like eating meat, I enjoy it. Particularly a nice piece of roast lamb. However, it is not necessary for me to eat meat. I could easily go veggie and stay perfectly healthy (maybe be more healthy). Think I am going to have to be a hyprocrite like Caz 99...

That's an argument i used to give to friends when i was a little more militant.
Nowadays, i wear the badge of the hypocrite too. But i challenge anyone to point out a single non-contradictory human. We pick and choose our values, just like the religious recite certain psalms or prayers that reinforce their priorities.
So, perhaps you're looking for logic in the wrong place. I don't know.

 

[caz99]

Personally, i am capable of being angry about a number of things at the same time. So, i demonstrate against fox-hunting alongside other things.
I'm a veggie and wouldn't mind fishing being banned. But i think that's a different argument really.

I'd wholeheartedly support demonstrations and public pressure being put on the Government to force them to aid the situation in Sudan. And if you set anything up to do something about it, advertise it on NSC because lots of people will get involved.


Your friends can go for a ride without a pack of dogs next to them. So that's really something of a nonsense.

thank you thats what i have been trying to say but couldnt quite get it out

 

[Dr Schnell]

Personally, i am capable of being angry about a number of things at the same time. So, i demonstrate against fox-hunting alongside other things.
I'm a veggie and wouldn't mind fishing being banned. But i think that's a different argument really.

I'd wholeheartedly support demonstrations and public pressure being put on the Government to force them to aid the situation in Sudan. And if you set anything up to do something about it, advertise it on NSC because lots of people will get involved.


Your friends can go for a ride without a pack of dogs next to them. So that's really something of a nonsense.

In light of recent scientific evidence which suggests that fish do in fact suffer when they are caught, I don't think slapping a ban on fishing is a different argument...

 

[SK1NT]

That's an argument i used to give to friends when i was a little more militant.
Nowadays, i wear the badge of the hypocrite too. But i challenge anyone to point out a single non-contradictory human. We pick and choose our values, just like the religious recite certain psalms or prayers that reinforce their priorities.
So, perhaps you're looking for logic in the wrong place. I don't know.

im the same, but hunting for fun, thats a joke, its not for food but fun? and the fox isnt humanly killed but torn aprt by a pack of dogs! how can anyone find this fun to do, savages!

 

[Easy 10]

I am sitting conveniently on the fence on the subject of hunting and waiting for someone to knock me off either side. Unfortunately I have stumbled across a hurdle - as you will see from previous posts I am trying to see how eating animals can be justified in light of the bans on hunting. I like eating meat, I enjoy it. Particularly a nice piece of roast lamb. However, it is not necessary for me to eat meat. I could easily go veggie and stay perfectly healthy (maybe be more healthy). Think I am going to have to be a hyprocrite like Caz 99...

I eat meat too. But at least animals which are killed for our consumption are destroyed in a more humane manner, and there is actually a PURPOSE to the creatures demise other than the fun and amusement of some toffs on a horse.

And before someone comes up with the "do you eat veal ?" question, no I don't. And before someone posts up some anecdotal horror stories about the conditions in an abbatoir somewhere in Wales, yes, I'm sure there are cases where animals suffer unnecessarily before being killed for food. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't still feel utter revulsion at the savagery of fox-hunting as well.

 

[Hungry Joe.]

Well said Easy, a sensible post on the subject.

 

[ben andrews' girlfriend]

I think that there's a definite difference between killing for food or killing for sport. I really find it repulsive that people can fox hunt, the last of the other blood sports were made illegal years ago - im glad that labour has finally caught up with fox hunting - its really callous