BA Strike [Merged]

[Hatterlovesbrighton]

I also heard some rumour that UNITE had proposed saving the same amount of money (as the reduction in staff on long haul flights) by cutting the wages of staff at Gatwick.

Funny that Gatwick has very few UNITE members whereas Heathrow has lots.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

As I've said, to a degree it is none of our business. If the cabin staff elect to use their democratic right to strike then that is up to them. It's a private company and not essential to the nation's well being. It's just another airline. BA are not special. Let them fight it out amongst themselves. If you have an affected ticket get a refund and fly with someone else...there's plenty to choose from.

 

[Uncle C]

I also heard some rumour that UNITE had proposed saving the same amount of money (as the reduction in staff on long haul flights) by cutting the wages of staff at Gatwick.

Funny that Gatwick has very few UNITE members whereas Heathrow has lots.

No wonder there's more planes flying out of Gatwick during the strike.

 

[Tooting Gull]

The lower salary scales are, as I understand it, for NEW employees to BA, not exisiting staff.

And as for the cost-cutting stopping them doing their jobs properly - from what I've read and heard on the news, its only bringing them closer in line with other airline practices. And even if it wasn't, we're in a bloomin RECESSION. Sacrifices have to be made, people have to be prepared to crack on and deal with it.

I'm currently on a 2 year pay freeze, and following redundencies here I've also have to take on other tasks that wern't previously my remit. Its a fact of life, the company either does something about it, or goes under. I've probably got just as much "right" to strike as the trolly dollys, but frankly, I'm just grateful to still be in a job.

Bullies like Walsh trade on those fears. People are only too aware we're in a recession, they have families/kids, and he will put them through the wringer. Every now and then, you're going to get a reaction.

And also, what's wrong with having an airline with high standards? Do we want them all to be like Ryanair?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Not quite sure how Archer has weaved his way into this thread tbh.

But the point is, if a business doesn't cut its cloth, then sooner or later it'll go bust and EVERYONE loses. Perhaps management at BA have been autocratic in the manner of how they've introduced these changes - perhaps staff wern't fully consulted first, which is one of the main bones of contention. It probably could have been handled better. But one thing is clear - BA, much like many other airlines, has been losing millions, so quite clearly something had to be done. If BA staff want to exist in a bubble, as though nothing going on in the world economy can ever affect them, then they're in for a shock.

Well, they're probably already getting one.

...or alternatively who not differentiate yourself in the market place and supply a slightly superior product? This is what BA used to do. Cutting their cloth has simply made them into just another airline. And there's a lot of competition....as they are now finding. Moving BA into a more competitive market place was not Walsh's best move in my mind.

 

[Deportivo Seagull]

I also heard some rumour that UNITE had proposed saving the same amount of money (as the reduction in staff on long haul flights) by cutting the wages of staff at Gatwick.

Funny that Gatwick has very few UNITE members whereas Heathrow has lots.

Heathrow staff view Gatwick staff as second class citizens, there is no love lost between them. UNITE have it in for Gatwick staff as they wouldn't join because they view UNITE with suspicion, however I can't see UNITE doing something as under hand as this. My understanding is that UNITE are very concerned that Gatwikc staff psill the beans regards there manning levels as it would totally undermind the strike, which is why I suspect Welsh is taking the stance that he is.

Bottom line, is that unless BA get there cost down they are f**ked, end of.
Walsh is a clown, the union short sighted and the staff are cloud cuckoo land. Every other airline is cutting costs drastically so why are we surprised.

BTW: BA staff,especially out of Heathrow have to be the most miserable in the industry apart from those you meet on internal US flights.

 

[casbom]

Bullies like Walsh trade on those fears. People are only too aware we're in a recession, they have families/kids, and he will put them through the wringer. Every now and then, you're going to get a reaction.

And also, what's wrong with having an airline with high standards? Do we want them all to be like Ryanair?

So what are you trying to say? Obviously you know the ins and outs of this dispute far better than anyone and you've come to conclusion that the cabin crew are being bullied? Is that it? How so?

The only thing that affects current LHR crew is the reduction of ONE person on long haul flights. No pay cuts, no redundancies. BA has to do something to cut costs and become more in line with other airlines costs otherwise it'll go broke. I know some of you won't care, but for the thousands of people who work for BA will care when their jobs go tits up due to this strike action.

 

[Easy 10]

Bullies like Walsh trade on those fears. People are only too aware we're in a recession, they have families/kids, and he will put them through the wringer. Every now and then, you're going to get a reaction.

And also, what's wrong with having an airline with high standards? Do we want them all to be like Ryanair?

...or alternatively who not differentiate yourself in the market place and supply a slightly superior product? This is what BA used to do. Cutting their cloth has simply made them into just another airline. And there's a lot of competition....as they are now finding. Moving BA into a more competitive market place was not Walsh's best move in my mind.

Well, times change and needs must. Of course ideally it would be lovely to still have the choice of an airline with higher standards than the rest, but the reality is that in the current climate, these days people are being a lot more careful with their cash and are therefore less likely to pay that bit extra for the likes of BA if they can get it cheaper elsewhere. And that goes for businesses using BA as well, obviously.

If due to the recession BA can no longer count on getting the bums on seats in the numbers they used to, then what else are they supposed to do other than cut costs to survive ?

 

[bhaexpress]

So what are you trying to say? Obviously you know the ins and outs of this dispute far better than anyone and you've come to conclusion that the cabin crew are being bullied? Is that it? How so?

The only thing that affects current LHR crew is the reduction of ONE person on long haul flights. No pay cuts, no redundancies. BA has to do something to cut costs and become more in line with other airlines costs otherwise it'll go broke. I know some of you won't care, but for the thousands of people who work for BA will care when their jobs go tits up due to this strike action.

Exactly. It's not like BA have a monopoly either. No doubt that if BA do get into serious financial bother the tax payer will be expected to bail them out. It's time some people had a spell in the real world. Also, I might add that one of the reasons that BA staff at Heathrow look down on Gatwick staff is that the nucleous of people there are ex BCal and Dan Air and to a lesser extent, Air Europe.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Im not sure it adds much.

However the cruise company I work for refuse to use BA now due to the strike. Im sure mine isnt the only company to do so.

As someone said keep this up and they wont have a comapny to strike about

 

[Easy 10]

Exactly. It's not like BA have a monopoly either. No doubt that if BA do get into serious financial bother the tax payer will be expected to bail them out.

Why should the taxpayer bail BA out ?
I can understand the banks (not that I liked it, but they couldn't be allowed to fail as the result of that would have been a national catastrophe). But I fail to see why an ailing airline would need to be saved.

 

[Tooting Gull]

So what are you trying to say? Obviously you know the ins and outs of this dispute far better than anyone and you've come to conclusion that the cabin crew are being bullied? Is that it? How so?

The only thing that affects current LHR crew is the reduction of ONE person on long haul flights. No pay cuts, no redundancies. BA has to do something to cut costs and become more in line with other airlines costs otherwise it'll go broke. I know some of you won't care, but for the thousands of people who work for BA will care when their jobs go tits up due to this strike action.

All I would say to you is this. If I was one of BA's spin doctors to Willie Walsh and I wanted some union concessions, I would tell him to put the fear of God into all his staff, keep banging on about the recession, and repeatedly suggest the whole company was on the brink and everyone would lose their jobs. And make sure it was in all the papers. Ultimately, you can't run a company on fear alone.

It wouldn't surprise me if Plan A all along was to make huge redundancies (which might even be necessary), but to do it by provoking the strike and then blaming the strikers. Gutless, but very Walsh and very BA.

 

[Easy 10]

So this recession, soaring fuel costs and the drastic drop in passenger numbers is something Walsh has made up so he can eventually slash staff numbers at BA ?

Seems a difficult and expensive way of going about it.

 

[Deportivo Seagull]

All I would say to you is this. If I was one of BA's spin doctors to Willie Walsh and I wanted some union concessions, I would tell him to put the fear of God into all his staff, keep banging on about the recession, and repeatedly suggest the whole company was on the brink and everyone would lose their jobs. And make sure it was in all the papers. Ultimately, you can't run a company on fear alone.

It wouldn't surprise me if Plan A all along was to make huge redundancies (which might even be necessary), but to do it by provoking the strike and then blaming the strikers. Gutless, but very Walsh and very BA.

Strikes normally brings out the pinky commie subversive in me, however in this case the cabin crew have no support from me, which is hard for me to say as I dispise BA with a vengence ... which says a lot.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Well, times change and needs must. Of course ideally it would be lovely to still have the choice of an airline with higher standards than the rest, but the reality is that in the current climate, these days people are being a lot more careful with their cash and are therefore less likely to pay that bit extra for the likes of BA if they can get it cheaper elsewhere. And that goes for businesses using BA as well, obviously.

If due to the recession BA can no longer count on getting the bums on seats in the numbers they used to, then what else are they supposed to do other than cut costs to survive ?

There are numerous premium businesses and products which are riding this recession though. I was reading the other day that a lot of high end business have slightly lowered their prices but maintained their high standard. Thus bringing in a new strata of customers who will now be getting more for their same buck (which was previously spent elsewhere on lower end goods) ..and hopefully gain repeat custom when things get better and their prices return to their normal level.

 

[Tooting Gull]

So this recession, soaring fuel costs and the drastic drop in passenger numbers is something Walsh has made up so he can eventually slash staff numbers at BA ?

Seems a difficult and expensive way of going about it.

Poor. Where did I say he 'made up' the recession? Nothing like reminding all your employees several times a day, though, and fuelling the climate of fear which you admitted earlier left you just grateful to have a job. I wonder if the recession has affected Walsh's remuneration. I believe he is on £750k basic, and a bonus of up to 150 per cent of that.

 

[Hatterlovesbrighton]

Poor. Where did I say he 'made up' the recession? Nothing like reminding all your employees several times a day, though, and fuelling the climate of fear which you admitted earlier left you just grateful to have a job. I wonder if the recession has affected Walsh's remuneration. I believe he is on £750k basic, and a bonus of up to 150 per cent of that.

Didn't Walsh work for free for one month last year? Maybe he was in a position to do so because he gets paid so much, but pretty harsh to throw the fat cat jibe at him and the recession has certainly affected his renumeration.

 

[Tooting Gull]

Didn't Walsh work for free for one month last year? Maybe he was in a position to do so because he gets paid so much, but pretty harsh to throw the fat cat jibe at him and the recession has certainly affected his renumeration.

Well, I didn't want to be harsh to the poor little cherub. Bless him. You've got me almost feeling sorry for the oppressed little multi-millionaire.

 

[casbom]

Poor. Where did I say he 'made up' the recession? Nothing like reminding all your employees several times a day, though, and fuelling the climate of fear which you admitted earlier left you just grateful to have a job. I wonder if the recession has affected Walsh's remuneration. I believe he is on £750k basic, and a bonus of up to 150 per cent of that.

But if you work in the travel industry at the moment then you ARE grateful to have job! There have been plenty of airlines that have gone bust over the last couple of years and without the initiatives to save money within the airline then BA would have been one of them.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Poor. Where did I say he 'made up' the recession? Nothing like reminding all your employees several times a day, though, and fuelling the climate of fear which you admitted earlier left you just grateful to have a job. I wonder if the recession has affected Walsh's remuneration. I believe he is on £750k basic, and a bonus of up to 150 per cent of that.

I think the drastic drop in passengers is partly Walsh's doing. Customers were deserting BA before the recession. Originally BA were a premium brand...with a premium price. Then he cut corners so they were a run-o-the-mill airline but still claiming to be a premium carrier and still charging premium rates (cue customers leaving). Now they are a run-o-the-mill airline charging run-o-the-mill prices. He really needs to decide what he BA wants to be. He's very directionless and reactionary when it comes to placing his brand.