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[Politics] Are Labour going to turn this country around?

Is Labour going to turn the country around

  • Yes

    Votes: 98 28.1%
  • No

    Votes: 203 58.2%
  • Fence

    Votes: 48 13.8%

  • Total voters
    349


Is it PotG?

Thrifty non-licker
Feb 20, 2017
25,733
Sussex by the Sea
The thing is about the WFA I haven’t met anyone who actually needs it, I have had loads of folks moaning to me about it and when I say just apply for pension credit you might be eligible and they come back with “ well I don’t need it really” I am quite awear that loads of poorer elderly will need it though. I just feel the anger has been whipped up by the right.
They're mostly on cruises all winter anyway. :facepalm:
 




Lenny Rider

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2010
6,087
If they don't, we're f***ed.

The economy
The boats
Law and Order
The 8 million adults in the benefit system
The NHS


He must wake up in a cold sweat almost every night and think, "Why did I ever win?"
 


Chicken Run

Member Since Jul 2003
NSC Patron
Jul 17, 2003
19,964
Valley of Hangleton
If they don't, we're f***ed.

The economy
The boats
Law and Order
The 8 million adults in the benefit system
The NHS


He must wake up in a cold sweat almost every night and think, "Why did I ever win?"
Yep, pretty much this, i bet he’s thinking why didn’t anyone tell me that being in opposition hurling shit at the government without fear of actual accountability was way more fun. The way this is all going this version of the PLP will be one term wonders ffs.
 


Flounce

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Nov 15, 2006
4,605
Yep, pretty much this, i bet he’s thinking why didn’t anyone tell me that being in opposition hurling shit at the government without fear of actual accountability was way more fun. The way this is all going this version of the PLP will be one term wonders ffs.
Yep Capt Hindsight no longer seems to have the foresight he suggested he had when in opposition
 






WATFORD zero

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 10, 2003
27,942
Yep, pretty much this, i bet he’s thinking why didn’t anyone tell me that being in opposition hurling shit at the government without fear of actual accountability was way more fun. The way this is all going this version of the PLP will be one term wonders ffs.

I can't help but see the funny side of watching you (and one or two others) constantly moaning on this thread, that the New Government haven't managed to reverse everything you've consistently campaigned and voted for, for the last 8 years, in a few months :lolol:

Can we merge this with the meltdown thread or the general Labour thread pleeeeeeeeaase @Bozza

It's been requested that they all get merged before, but the problem is
I guess it depends on whether people want separate cheerleading and critiquing threads or have it all mashed together.

See if you can guess which is which is which :wink:
 


Chicken Run

Member Since Jul 2003
NSC Patron
Jul 17, 2003
19,964
Valley of Hangleton
I can't help but see the funny side of watching you (and one or two others) constantly moaning on this thread, that the New Government haven't managed to reverse everything you've consistently campaigned and voted for, for the last 8 years, in a few months :lolol:



It's been requested that they all get merged before, but the problem is


See if you can guess which is which is which :wink:
I can’t help see the funny side of your advice to me only a few days ago…..

IMG_1966.jpeg

It’s almost like you’re doing an excited puppy every time I post, now run along and continue your prep on the inevitable bs 15 course Christmas day taster menu woof woof 😉
 


tigertim68

Well-known member
Sep 3, 2012
2,678
Depends what you mean by turn the country around; hopefully they can arrest the slide which those despicable Tories oversaw, but it's going to be a slow and panful process. So many towns and cities in the UK are now disaster zones, and so many of its institutions are in a mess, from the railways to the armed-forces to the NHS. I am confident that Labour will make things less bad, but will need 3 terms in office to make significant progress.
You must be dreaming mate , this country started going downhill when Blair and his cronies were in government,
and this Labour government will make it even worse , most of the towns and cities are run by Labour and as you said most are a disaster zone , what this country needs is a proper change with neither Tory or Labour in power
 




Weststander

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 25, 2011
69,867
Withdean area
Can we merge this with the meltdown thread or the general Labour thread pleeeeeeeeaase @Bozza

Seconded, please @Bozza. Making a one-stop shop.

Initially it may’ve been hoped that one thread was for positive achievements (first 100 days type stuff), the other critiques and nsc rows.

In reality both are now essentially the same thing.
 
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Pavilionaire

Well-known member
Jul 7, 2003
31,312
I've gone 'fence'. I think there are two issues that have contributed massively to this situation of statis. They go beyond party politics and desperately need addressing:

1. Economic black holes: Commentators on the left say the £22 billion black hole was the legacy left by the Tories, something they didn't know about. Tackling it has changed everything they planned to do in their first 6 months. However, commentators on the right either say the black hole doesn't exist, or it does but Labour have known about it for a long time. This just leaves voters confused and disillusioned.

2. Setting traps: It was apparent during the last General Election campaign that the Tories were hammering Labour that they would increase taxes, to the extent that Labour committed in their manifesto not to increase taxes "for working people" and so we get the shitshow of Winter Fuel Payments and Employer's NI hikes because Labour hands are tied on how they can pay for our current economic malaise.

For there to be ANY trust between politicians and the electorate there has to be full economic transparency so that all parties have access to accurate figures. Any changes to government policy, whether actual or in draft, must be costed at the outset and made available to all political parties.

On the second point, I cast my mind back to Rishi Sunak's manic series of machine gun accusations - 12 in total - that Starmer was going to put up taxes by £2,000 per household. This statement had not been costed properly, yet was the biggest takeaway of the first leadership debate. It may have been great politics by the Tories to set a trap but it is the height of irresponsibility from a national perspective.

Of course the biggest bind of all is that neither party know how to handle the elephant in the room, which is Brexit. The only leader whose hands are not tied on this issue is Reform, and I expect their support to grow in 2025, particularly as Farage will milk his 'friendship' with Trump for all it is worth.

I fear that no politician will be brave enough to tell it like it is, which is that Brexit has simply not delivered the 'Brexit Dividends', the 'Controlling Our Borders' benefits that were promised, and to change course. I don't see Starmer saying that, or anyone else in the Labour camp, and while the Lib Dems are likely to be the first main party to make 'ReJoin' party policy they will get a very tough ride.

It is hard to come to any other conclusion that the county is f*cked, so put on your tin hat and it's every man for himself.
 


Weststander

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 25, 2011
69,867
Withdean area
I've gone 'fence'. I think there are two issues that have contributed massively to this situation of statis. They go beyond party politics and desperately need addressing:

1. Economic black holes: Commentators on the left say the £22 billion black hole was the legacy left by the Tories, something they didn't know about. Tackling it has changed everything they planned to do in their first 6 months. However, commentators on the right either say the black hole doesn't exist, or it does but Labour have known about it for a long time. This just leaves voters confused and disillusioned.

2. Setting traps: It was apparent during the last General Election campaign that the Tories were hammering Labour that they would increase taxes, to the extent that Labour committed in their manifesto not to increase taxes "for working people" and so we get the shitshow of Winter Fuel Payments and Employer's NI hikes because Labour hands are tied on how they can pay for our current economic malaise.

For there to be ANY trust between politicians and the electorate there has to be full economic transparency so that all parties have access to accurate figures. Any changes to government policy, whether actual or in draft, must be costed at the outset and made available to all political parties.

On the second point, I cast my mind back to Rishi Sunak's manic series of machine gun accusations - 12 in total - that Starmer was going to put up taxes by £2,000 per household. This statement had not been costed properly, yet was the biggest takeaway of the first leadership debate. It may have been great politics by the Tories to set a trap but it is the height of irresponsibility from a national perspective.

Of course the biggest bind of all is that neither party know how to handle the elephant in the room, which is Brexit. The only leader whose hands are not tied on this issue is Reform, and I expect their support to grow in 2025, particularly as Farage will milk his 'friendship' with Trump for all it is worth.

I fear that no politician will be brave enough to tell it like it is, which is that Brexit has simply not delivered the 'Brexit Dividends', the 'Controlling Our Borders' benefits that were promised, and to change course. I don't see Starmer saying that, or anyone else in the Labour camp, and while the Lib Dems are likely to be the first main party to make 'ReJoin' party policy they will get a very tough ride.

It is hard to come to any other conclusion that the county is f*cked, so put on your tin hat and it's every man for himself.

Funny you should say that about (1). The excellent R4 prog More Or Less examined the £22b blackhole claim, concluding it wasn’t. It was a combination of; items fully known to all pre GE, the post GE wage awards and some unknowns.

Rarely are these things black n white.
 




Chicken Run

Member Since Jul 2003
NSC Patron
Jul 17, 2003
19,964
Valley of Hangleton
Funny you should say that about (1). The excellent R4 prog More Or Less examined the £22b blackhole claim, concluding it wasn’t. It was a combination of; items fully known to all pre GE, the post GE wage awards and some unknowns.

Rarely are these things black n white.
Or indeed actually Party Politics which would be iirc the second time @Pavilionaire has tried to stray from Party Political stuff but its front centre stage in his post 😂
 


A1X

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Sep 1, 2017
20,798
Deepest, darkest Sussex
Going great.

UK economy had zero growth between July and September

UK economy showed no growth in last quarter, revised figures show

Early estimates show that real GDP per head fell by 0.2% in the third quarter of 2024, and is 0.2% lower compared with the same quarter a year ago.

The UK and Italy had the lowest growth in the G7 in the third quarter, both flatlining.

Good job the 'grown-ups are back in the room'.
This is a revision of the Q3 figures so pre-budget, so the Tory plans were clearly working a treat
 


Is it PotG?

Thrifty non-licker
Feb 20, 2017
25,733
Sussex by the Sea
Last edited:




dsr-burnley

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2014
2,680
Quoting from the article, not from PotG's post:
https://www.theguardian.com/busines...-in-uk-business-activity-forecast-cbi-economy

A Treasury spokesperson said: “We had to make difficult decisions at the budget to fix the economy and the £22bn black hole this government inherited. We have wiped the slate clean and delivered the stability businesses so desperately need.

“More than half of employers will either see a cut or no change in their National Insurance bills.
How can this be true? The NIC rate has gone up and the threshhold at which it kicks in has gone down. Is there any way (other than laying off staff) that employers' National Insurance bills can drop?

[Edit] it#s the National Insurance allowance - employers can waive their first £11k of employer's NIC payments, rather than just £5k at present. so if they have about 6 or fewer employees at minimum wage, they'll be no worse off. It's when they fancy employing a seventh that the extra bill hits.
 
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Blue3

Well-known member
Jan 27, 2014
5,852
Lancing
I hope labour can turn things around currently the UKs growth rate is 0.4% twice that of the Ukraine
 


Cheshire Cat

The most curious thing..
Labour just isn't very good at politics.

The Conservatives are not good at anything.

Reform are very good at creating a shitstorm, but nothing else.

The LibDems are quite good at publicity stunts.

There is a story somewhere about Starmer in his days as a prosecutor. If he argued a case in front of a judge, he would invariably win because his reasoning and logic was very good. If he argued a case in front of a jury, he would invariably lose because his empathy and charisma was very poor.
 


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