Any news on Wendy?

[BigGully]

Well I think that the point was that no players were produced that were sold on for substantial fees or have gone on to cement a regular first team place.

He stayed within the game at this club for 25 years. That is evidence of the jobs for the boys mentality. Not many clubs would have worn that. When he was released no one came straight in for him and he didnt get anywhere else himself until pardew belled him.

I think in order to be headhunted you need to be in a job, as far as Im aware Poyet wasnt, he applied for and got it?

Rather the see Wilkins record as a failure, I see it more as not nearly as good as too many people make out. To look back through rose tinted spectacles at his time at the club is to forget the sighs that would echo around the Goldstone many times a game due to his 'contribution'. The fact he was held in any esteem at all as a player was down to ONE certain free kick.

Wilkins was a full time scout for Fulham before Southampton by the way.

I think you will find Virgo and Harding went for something like £1.5m

Elphick and Al-ebd are currently playing for our first team.

Whilst Hammond and Harding are Captain and Left back for SSC.

Cox, Robinson etc ............

Now your saying that Wilkins 20 odd years of service at the club represents nepotism and 1 freekick represents his whole playing career with us !!!

I am afraid with your logic, I aint gonna sway you on this one ;-)

 

[The French Mistress]

Nor me old chap. OK, granted Virgo went to Celtic, but soon got found out and plummetted down the leagues, Hammond ahd Harding didn't exactly set the Championship alight and the others you've highlighted are average League 1 / 2 players.
I think the name Wilkins is synonymous with the 'free kick' against Ipswich,I'm afraid and his cv does not take a lot of reading!
Any mug can be a full time scout can't think who he recommended to Fulham that has pulled up trees in the Premiershite?

 

[Brovion]

...

He stayed within the game at this club for 25 years. That is evidence of the jobs for the boys mentality. Not many clubs would have worn that. When he was released no one came straight in for him and he didnt get anywhere else himself until pardew belled him.

...

It wasn't 25 year continuous was it? he left and came back. Anyway I can assure you he WAS highly-thought of within the game. He completely turned around the Brighton youth system; people are mentioning names like El-abd, Virgo, Harding, Hammond, Fraser etc and sneering that none of them went on to become premiership superstars. Well how many players came through the youth ranks under the old regime prior to Wilkins involvement? Tom Fraser was originally picked up by Portsmouth but moved to Brighton when word of Wilkins' abilities spread because the coaching was 'streets ahead' of what Pompey were doing.

Before his elevation to the first team his reputation as a youth coach was so good that Manchester United were sniffing around - not sure if that's why he was 'moved up' or not.

 

[El Presidente]

I think he did pretty well as youth coach, and he should be given credit where it is due.

As a player, he clocked up a lot of games, was a gazelle in a team of wildebeests a lot of the time.

 

[BigGully]

Nor me old chap. OK, granted Virgo went to Celtic, but soon got found out and plummetted down the leagues, Hammond ahd Harding didn't exactly set the Championship alight and the others you've highlighted are average League 1 / 2 players.
I think the name Wilkins is synonymous with the 'free kick' against Ipswich,I'm afraid and his cv does not take a lot of reading!
Any mug can be a full time scout can't think who he recommended to Fulham that has pulled up trees in the Premiershite?

You serious !!

As for Virgo and Celtic, you cannot at one point dismiss Wilkins input on Virgo's initial £1.5m fee received and then blame Wilkins for his supposed demise once he left, your argument lacks consistency.

I think fee's for Harding were around £800 000 and £250 000 for Hammond, but maybe more important is the stat that whilst he was the main player in the youth set up and during his stints as 1st team coach and manager he overlooked a total of 25 local youngsters making their first team debuts, including current first team regulars Elphick and El-Abd.

His youth team reached the 6th round of the FA Youth Cup for the first time in our clubs history.

Whatever your view of the man, to somehow dismiss those statistics is bewildering.

For the record his total appearances for us totalled 330 including 28 goals and yes including that free kick that was rather good.

Promotion 87-88 from League 1 to the Championship and captained the side in the play off final at the old Wembley 1990-1991, I think he may of scored there too.

Prior to this he played over 100 games in the Dutch Premier League and has gained his UEFA A License his UEFA B Licensed.

But like you say any Mug can then be offered a full time scouting role with a Premier League Club.

 

[El Presidente]

captained the side in the play off final at the old Wembley 1990-1991, I think he may of scored there too.

He certainly did score there,in the 89th minute, it was the unveiling of the legendary 'Raspberry Chewits' strip too at Wembley.

 

[El Presidente]

Nor me old chap. OK, granted Virgo went to Celtic, but soon got found out and plummetted down the leagues,

Bit harsh to blame that on Wendy, just as it is also lunacy to give him the full credit for the £1.5million transfer fee in the first place.

The credit should go (in no particular order) to Virgo himself, McGhee for picking him in the first place and persuading his mate Strachan to shell out a huge fee for him, Wilkins, Vic Bragg.

Criticism should go to Strachan for signing him and playing him out of position at right back, Mickey Adams for doing the same, Steve Coppell for thinking he was shit and farming him out to Exeter.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

Most youth team players at a club don't make it AT ALL. Most of Wilkins' played in the football league and many are still doing so. Others are professionals in the Conference. So there isn't one STAR? That might be because most of the potential stars are snapped up by premiership clubs at a very early age, ala Gareth Barry.

Sullivan, Harding, Lynch, Elphick, Hinshelwood, El-Abd, Fraser, Hammond, Cox, Loft, Robinson.

Could make a decent 4-5-1 out of that lot which would probably hold its own in League 2, and that's with Virgo on the bench.

 

[ROSM]

For all of Wilkins' faults as a manager (real and perceived) his record as a youth coach should never be forgotten. he was offered a move to Coventry under Adams as Youth team coach and also Newcastle were looking at him. It was for that reason he was offered the role of Assistant to McGhee (also partly to offset the criticism of MM from within the board who wanted change).

At times that may have blinded him (I recall that after we won promotion from the old 3rd division we played on the bank holiday monday and won convincingly). Afterwards the players and management were having a beer or two and I spoke to Wilkins who was happy but also bemoaning that not enough youth teamers had graduated through that season and Adams' had bought in a team. Please note I am not criticising Wilkins for saying that and he may well be right.

 

[Jim D]

.....most of the potential stars are snapped up by premiership clubs at a very early age, ala Gareth Barry....

I thought that Barry was only taken by Villa to accompany the guy they really wanted - the famous 'Dick Knights nephew' - so famous I've forgotten his name. They only found out what they had when he trained with them.

 

[Stoo82]

I thought that Barry was only taken by Villa to accompany the guy they really wanted - the famous 'Dick Knights nephew' - so famous I've forgotten his name. They only found out what they had when he trained with them.

John Sitdown.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

I thought that Barry was only taken by Villa to accompany the guy they really wanted - the famous 'Dick Knights nephew' - so famous I've forgotten his name. They only found out what they had when he trained with them.

Derek Kneeling

 

[Icy Gull]

Peter Crouching

 

[The French Mistress]

Bit harsh to blame that on Wendy, just as it is also lunacy to give him the full credit for the £1.5million transfer fee in the first place.

The credit should go (in no particular order) to Virgo himself, McGhee for picking him in the first place and persuading his mate Strachan to shell out a huge fee for him, Wilkins, Vic Bragg.

Criticism should go to Strachan for signing him and playing him out of position at right back, Mickey Adams for doing the same, Steve Coppell for thinking he was shit and farming him out to Exeter.

I'm not blaming Wendy, just stating the fact that he wasn't any great shakes.
In fact the more stats Big Gully comes out with emphasises my point that he wasn't really all that good, apart from producing average L1 players with the exception of a couple who went to the Championship , but found themselves back again in L1 .

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

I'm not blaming Wendy, just stating the fact that he wasn't any great shakes.
In fact the more stats Big Gully comes out with emphasises my point that he wasn't really all that good, apart from producing average L1 players with the exception of a couple who went to the Championship , but found themselves back again in L1 .

I think what we are saying is that, once the premiership big boys have poached all the outstanding talent (many of which don't make it) and then filled their teams and youth systems with foreigners, that producing a huge number of League 1 players from the rest in a short timespan is a big achievement.

 

[Brovion]

I'm not blaming Wendy, just stating the fact that he wasn't any great shakes.
In fact the more stats Big Gully comes out with emphasises my point that he wasn't really all that good, apart from producing average L1 players with the exception of a couple who went to the Championship , but found themselves back again in L1 .

You're still missing the point though. We NEVER had a youth coach as good as Wilkins before; I've been following the Albion since 1966 and I can't ever recall an era when we produced so many professional footballers. It was a veritable conveyor-belt.

 

[The French Mistress]

You're still missing the point though. We NEVER had a youth coach as good as Wilkins before; I've been following the Albion since 1966 and I can't ever recall an era when we produced so many professional footballers. It was a veritable conveyor-belt.

I've been following them for that long as well, and can't remember a stand out youth manager, but if we're only going to produce average L1 players then it ain't that good is it? I'm struggling to think of a youth team product ( ignoring Barry) who has gone on to better things and we can proudly congratulate Wilkins for his achievment?

 

[Brovion]

I've been following them for that long as well, and can't remember a stand out youth manager, but if we're only going to produce average L1 players then it ain't that good is it? I'm struggling to think of a youth team product ( ignoring Barry) who has gone on to better things and we can proudly congratulate Wilkins for his achievment?

Yeah, but we ARE producing them, which we didn't before! I think it's a bit much to expect to go from nothing to producing a string of Premiership players - especially as most Premiership players seem to come from abroad!

The Albion's previous youth set up (under John Jackson) was a joke. Not only did Wilkins turn it round he got the club producing Div 3 / Div 4 players on a regular basis which it had never done before. For a scabby little third divison club it was quite an achievement, which was recognised and noted by bigger clubs. Ergo you cannot say he was 'no great shakes' just because he didn't develop a Michael Owen or a Wayne Rooney.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

I've been following them for that long as well, and can't remember a stand out youth manager, but if we're only going to produce average L1 players then it ain't that good is it? I'm struggling to think of a youth team product ( ignoring Barry) who has gone on to better things and we can proudly congratulate Wilkins for his achievment?

You're very down on League 1, as if its no better than an amateur county league. Is the premier league awash with players developed in L1/2 youth systems?

Anyway, once these players graduated into the first team it became the manager's job to progress them further. So blame them instead if you must.

 

[Icy Gull]

I imagine Wilkin's brief was to produce players who would go on to claim a 1st team place and hence save his close to destitute club the transfer and signing on fees that would otherwise have been incurred. I doubt he was told or expected to produce Premier League players. He produced players who at one stage filled a large number of 1st team places and got them to 7th in League 1. Job well done imo, why all the sly digs?