[Albion] Ansu Fati **Signed On Loan 01/09**

[Beanstalk]

It doesn't matter if he's right. We ain't getting the fella for free however it was structured

There was no fee for the loan. It equated to about £7m in wages over the season, a chunk will have been partly covered by insurance (as has become standard in the Premier League) for the three month injury so the actual outlay is likely to be lower.

Ultimately, it was a big outlay on wages for a club like us, immediately becoming the highest earner and quite dramatically breaking the structure in place, and he hasn't outperformed everyone else so there is a feeling of being short-changed. Lallana was reportedly our highest earner for his first two seasons at the club and he didn't really shine at all until RDZ came in (59 appearances, 1 goal, 2 assists) so highest earner isn't really a great indicator of performance anyway.

 

[A1X]

I rate Sarmiento, but that is nonsense. Don't remember Sarmiento scoring against Ajax.

To be fair, Sarmiento hasn’t had the chance to score against Ajax, so it’s quite harsh to hold that against him.

 

[Beanstalk]

I'd be all for keeping Fate next season. I think we have seen flashes of what he can do and the ceiling is high. That said surely he'd have to take a pay cut as we cannot afford Barca wages on a permanent basis.

I guess it's all about the new manager who comes in at Barca and their finances. Their wage limit has been decreased by 25% from €270million to €204million by the league for the forthcoming season and they'll have to let quite a few players go to be able to fit in to this structure. Whoever the new manager is, they've got to make some very big decisions about the squad and about players, like Fati, who are on a considerable wage.

Personally, I think that he'll be moved on for a fee and to get the wages off of their books, and that probably rules us out. Spurs almost had him before we swooped in so I wouldn't be shocked if they go back for him on a permanent.

 

[Reddleman]

I don’t agree that Sarmiento is better than Fati. One thing is for sure though Sarmiento directly contributed to us winning a crucial three points last season with a last minute assist. None of Fati’s goal or assist contributions have contributed to any points in the league.

 

[albionalex]

I rate Sarmiento, but that is nonsense. Don't remember Sarmiento scoring against Ajax.

Last season, Sarmiento played 176 minutes in the Prem and 176 minutes in the FA+League cups.

This Season, Fati has played 476 minutes in the Prem, 365 minutes in the Europa League and 114 minutes in the FA+League cups.

Obviously it is a small sample size but whenever I saw Sarmiento (while definitely not the finished product) I thought he looked capable of doing something (like his assist vs Ballmouth).

If we had kept him rather than Fati, I think he could have provided similar output to Fati this season.

 

[albionalex]

What a load of tosh. Sarmiento with his 2 assists in 19 appearances for the Albion, vs Fati's 4 goals and 1 assist in 23 appearances for the Albion.

Fati may not have lived up to the very high expectations he came with (so far), but some of the crap people have come out with to criticise him is insane.

Fati has played twice as many games in his career as Sarmiento, including in the Champions League and World Cup. This season, he has played almost 3x as much as Sarmiento did last season.

I don't think the stats you provided paint Fati in a very good light...

 

[albionalex]

I don’t agree that Sarmiento is better than Fati. One thing is for sure though Sarmiento directly contributed to us winning a crucial three points last season with a last minute assist. None of Fati’s goal or assist contributions have contributed to any points in the league.

I don't think Sarmiento is better than Fati.

Do I think Sarmiento could have done what Fati has this season? Probably.

 

[Beanstalk]

Fati has played twice as many games in his career as Sarmiento, including in the Champions League and World Cup. This season, he has played almost 3x as much as Sarmiento did last season.

I don't think the stats you provided paint Fati in a very good light...

Let me get this straight… your argument is that because Sarmiento has played less games overall, at a lower level than Fati, despite being older, he could’ve performed at a higher level than Fati this season?

Genuinely, where is the logic in that?

 

[Simster]

Let me get this straight… your argument is that because Sarmiento has played less games overall, at a lower level than Fati, despite being older, he could’ve performed at a higher level than Fati this season?

Genuinely, where is the logic in that?

You're right.

On the other hand, surely the argument for retaining Sarmiento and not paying absurd wages/loan fee to Barcelona for a loan for one of their crocked players is that we'd have spent the season developing one of our own players instead. Look at how Goodnight has progressed this season with a more extended run in the first team.

This is all with the benefit of hindsight of course, and comes off the back of a seriously disappointing stint with us for Ansu Fati. He's done more than you'd maybe have expected of Sarmiento, but that's a seriously low bar for someone earning £300k a week at Barcelona last season.

So without arguing over who is better - Sarmiento or Fati (as that is an argument about as consequential as one between two tramps squabbling over a discarded cigarette butt) - Fati HAS been horribly disappointing this season so far. On balance, I'd much rather we hadn't have signed him. I hope that changes over the last dozen games or whatever it is.

 

[Beanstalk]

You're right.

On the other hand, surely the argument for retaining Sarmiento and not paying absurd wages/loan fee to Barcelona for a loan for one of their crocked players is that we'd have spent the season developing one of our own players instead. Look at how Goodnight has progressed this season with a more extended run in the first team.

This is all with the benefit of hindsight of course, and comes off the back of a seriously disappointing stint with us for Ansu Fati. He's done more than you'd maybe have expected of Sarmiento, but that's a seriously low bar for someone earning £300k a week at Barcelona last season.

So without arguing over who is better - Sarmiento or Fati (as that is an argument about as consequential as one between two tramps squabbling over a discarded cigarette butt) - Fati HAS been horribly disappointing this season so far. On balance, I'd much rather we hadn't have signed him. I hope that changes over the last dozen games or whatever it is.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing. RDZ openly had little faith that Sarmiento could stay fit for a full season (with pretty solid evidence). If we’d have kept him as a first team player, he may well have got injured again and half of NSC would be screaming that we should’ve got a decent player in on loan to cover that position. We also very obviously felt we needed a higher quality forward player than Sarmiento last summer as well so the club chased that position as the big money signing. We went for Palmer, Kudus and then managed to pull off a bit of a coup for Fati.

Has he been wonderful for us? Objectively no. And it’s a real shame. But without the mid season injury it might have been different, and we may have had more than a few brilliant moments here and there.

The club clearly felt that Sarmiento needed to go out on loan regardless of who came in. To me, there is no argument, their places at the Albion are completely unrelated. Sarmiento left in July, and Fati joined in September. Simply calling out how silly the posters logic was and what a weird stick it was to beat Fati with.

 

[albionalex]

Let me get this straight… your argument is that because Sarmiento has played less games overall, at a lower level than Fati, despite being older, he could’ve performed at a higher level than Fati this season?

Genuinely, where is the logic in that?

No, that is not what I said at all.

 

[GT49er]

"Surplus to requirements" at Barcelona. Off to Everton?

Barcelona offer Everton four players in swap deal for £80m star to kill Man Utd transfer hopes

Barcelona are among the clubs interested in Amadou Onana and will reportedly offer Everton the pick of four of their players as they try to sign him.

www.teamtalk.com

 

[dazzer6666]

"Surplus to requirements" at Barcelona. Off to Everton?

Barcelona offer Everton four players in swap deal for £80m star to kill Man Utd transfer hopes

Barcelona are among the clubs interested in Amadou Onana and will reportedly offer Everton the pick of four of their players as they try to sign him.

www.teamtalk.com

Barca won’t offer much ‘cash’ plus a player because they don’t have any
Everton won’t take much of a punt on Fati at the moment - his stock/value is way down due to injury and failure to prove him in the PL

 

[Insel affe]

"Surplus to requirements" at Barcelona. Off to Everton?

Barcelona offer Everton four players in swap deal for £80m star to kill Man Utd transfer hopes

Barcelona are among the clubs interested in Amadou Onana and will reportedly offer Everton the pick of four of their players as they try to sign him.

www.teamtalk.com

Everton can not afford his wages, doubt he will take a drop too much, PSG or Germany beckon

 

[Questions]

If all things were equal you‘d have a point , but another 21 year old , say a graduate from the youth team, would be getting paid a tiny tiny fraction of what Fati reportedly is.
That’s not Fati’s fault (he must have a good agent) but presumably when we agreed to pay him the amount we did, relative to other players, we expected his contribution to the team to be proportional.
I also think you’re being generous about his future prospects. at this point he is more likely to fade off to a random league and then obscurity. He will have it all prove if he wants a top career, if he fails to make impression at Brighton.
But like you, I would also be happy if we signed him permanently if the money was right. It never will be though, because he’s on massive money and probably isn’t inclined to take a big pay cut.
Who can blame him?

He’ll get very well paid all the time he is within contract. After that we’ll see.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Every five weeks or so, Ansu Fati earns £1m. Over one year, he pockets £10m.

At the age of 21 he has already earned more money than he, and his extended entourage, could ever need.

I genuinely don’t see why he would be that bothered if his next contract earned him ‘only’ £50k a week.

 

[GT49er]

Everton can not afford his wages, doubt he will take a drop too much, PSG or Germany beckon

My point was more about Barca wanting to off-load him than Everton wanting him! I'm not sure they would want him either!

He's one of the ones I'm interested to see what happens when they run down their contract and become unemployed. They won't need money, that's for sure, but how much will their entitlement be in their own eyes?
Just hope, for the sake of the game, that clubs take one look at what their agent is demanding (My client is a £165K a week Barcelona player, and expects at least the same) and say, "No chance, move on."

 

[Justice]

Every five weeks or so, Ansu Fati earns £1m. Over one year, he pockets £10m.

At the age of 21 he has already earned more money than he, and his extended entourage, could ever need.

I genuinely don’t see why he would be that bothered if his next contract earned him ‘only’ £50k a week.

I don’t think life works like that you are essentially asking someone who’s been on £100k a year for 5 years to do the same job for £25k a year it’s not going to happen.
Let take into consideration tax so he’s now down to £100k a week and probably has a life style built around that £100k a week just like the average person does with whatever wage they earn. £50k a week becomes £25k after tax that’s a big step down.

 

[Wardy's twin]

I'm pretty critical of Fati, but I totally accept injuries and inexperience will have played a part. As has being shunted out on the left.

The reason i'm critical is that I think we should expect a higher standard from loan players. If they aren't well ahead of what we've got, then let's not bother.

We're a buy young players and sell most of them type club yeh? So every time we're playing one, there's the opportunity cost. We're not bringing through one of our own.

So even though Colwill did well for us, I think it was a mistake. Van Hecke would be bossing it even more now had he had an extra season of PL experience.

And with Fati I think the same thing applies. Had he been exceptional, then yes, let's send Sarmiento on loan and look after the short term while we're in Europe. But even though he's offering us more than Sarmiento probably would now, we're better off bringing through our own.

There's also the opportunity cost in terms of money. That extra £10m or whatever the fee was, could have been spent on landing one of our targets. Again, a player we can play, bring through then sell if we need to

Possibly, or he could have made more mistakes and shown the door or he saw what happened and was more determined to play which made him better in long run.

Difficult to predict , personally think Colwill was not a bad decision and had he stayed would have been great part of the future partnership with an Hecke.

All opinions though,,,

 

[deletebeepbeepbeep]

Every five weeks or so, Ansu Fati earns £1m. Over one year, he pockets £10m.

At the age of 21 he has already earned more money than he, and his extended entourage, could ever need.

I genuinely don’t see why he would be that bothered if his next contract earned him ‘only’ £50k a week.

Because the number must always go up faster than the next man