[Albion] Albion (Hughton?) performance - the short term effect of Ashworth's appointment?

[Papa Lazarou]

As [MENTION=19]Icy Gull[/MENTION] has written on another thread, there are rumours that training focused on defending alienating the attacking players.

Now all the players would know Ashworth is the senior figure reporting back to Barber/Bloom on all footballing matters through the club, from the U8s up to the senior side. Suddenly from getting on with training, there is a senior person observing, asking players their opinions etc. on all things, and all of a sudden you can create a culture of 'yeah, come to think of it, we do spend too much time on the defensive side in training'.

Not saying that has happened, but it would be close minded not to consider the many angles that may have led 2019 to be such a disappointment.

If that had happened, then we'd have seen an improvement in the 'lot' of the strikers. I'd suggest that suggests that Ashworth didn't intervene in this supposed issue; whether he should have, who knows?

 

[Deleted member 2719]

NooBHA thinks all this needs to remain confidential

Surprised you're still here

 

[Machiavelli]

If you don't know and you totally contradict yourself or try to sow seeds of doubt, what the hell is your thread actually about?

Do you know what a contradiction is? Perhaps you can inform us, while also indicating where the contradiction from the OP is.

 

[NooBHA]

yep. It's one thing a fan positing a possibility; it's quite another a person who may have actual factual knowledge confirming or denying!

Are you planning to post on NSC mid-long term now? Or will you transfer your allegiance to Chris' new club (when that happens)?

I, for one, would miss your posts if you move on, and thank you for your contributions since you joined.

Of course I will continue to post

 

[Goldstone1976]

I hope Chris Hughton has the sort of personality that doesn't fall to pieces when a new person joins the management team.

So, to be clear, are you suggesting Ashworth's mere presence could have adversely affected Chris' ability to manage the team, or do you think Ashworth has said / done / promised something that has caused this?

Just trying to get a steer on what you are suggesting / insinuating here.

I'm suggesting that prior to Ashworth joining, three people were covering the first team football-related tasks: Barber, Winstanley, and Hughton (with TB having final say, obvs). After his appointment, the number of people involved in those same tasks increased to four.

This increase in the number of people involved inevitably meant that the new guy (Ashworth) would have been rubbing up against the people who had previously done the bits of the tasks that he now wanted/had been told were his. This transfer of responsibility may have caused angst, &/or resistance, &/or a feeling of no longer being trusted. Those feelings, if felt, may have had a negative impact on the performance of one or more of the people so affected.

What is simply fact is that prior to Ashworth's arrival our PPG was 1.04. After his arrival, it fell to 0.75. That's a significant drop - but could be explained by other factors, sure. What is also fact is that there are countless examples of where a Director of Football (or similarly titled bod) has rocked up, and shortly after there have been departures of senior playing side of the club staff members.

We know that Chris is a decent human being. We know that he values integrity in himself and can therefore assume that he expects it from others. IF he felt that he hadn't been consulted appropriately about Ashworth's appointment, &/or about which of his tasks were going to be transferred to/heavily influenced by Ashworth, I don't believe it's a stretch to think that that would have negatively affected his performance.

 

[NooBHA]

Surprised you're still here

Stayed specifically to gain football knowledge from yourself

 

[Hampster Gull]

I'm suggesting that prior to Ashworth joining, three people were covering the first team football-related tasks: Barber, Winstanley, and Hughton (with TB having final say, obvs). After his appointment, the number of people involved in those same tasks increased to four.

This increase in the number of people involved inevitably meant that the new guy (Ashworth) would have been rubbing up against the people who had previously done the bits of the tasks that he now wanted/had been told were his. This transfer of responsibility may have caused angst, &/or resistance, &/or a feeling of no longer being trusted. Those feelings, if felt, may have had a negative impact on the performance of one or more of the people so affected.

What is simply fact is that prior to Ashworth's arrival our PPG was 1.04. After his arrival, it fell to 0.75. That's a significant drop - but could be explained by other factors, sure. What is also fact is that there are countless examples of where a Director of Football (or similarly titled bod) has rocked up, and shortly after there have been departures of senior playing side of the club staff members.

We know that Chris is a decent human being. We know that he values integrity in himself and can therefore assume that he expects it from others. IF he felt that he hadn't been consulted appropriately about Ashworth's appointment, &/or about which of his tasks were going to be transferred to/heavily influenced by Ashworth, I don't believe it's a stretch to think that that would have negatively affected his performance.

It is not a far fetched theory, I have seen similar things at work. It may not be right of course, cause and effect can be difficult to unpick but It’s for sure possible. And maybe why Chris didn't compromise with a leave my mutual consent agreement

 

[Deleted member 2719]

Stayed specifically to gain football knowledge from yourself

Glad I can help.

I do hope you have gained knowledge from our football forum.

I suppose my motto is defending is an art, but so is attacking.

Good luck with your next club no hard feelings.

 

[durrington gull]

It’s got Ashworths finger prints all over it - needs to justify his Johnny Big Bollocks reputation and salary so pulls the trigger

 

[Papa Lazarou]

I'm suggesting that prior to Ashworth joining, three people were covering the first team football-related tasks: Barber, Winstanley, and Hughton (with TB having final say, obvs). After his appointment, the number of people involved in those same tasks increased to four.

This increase in the number of people involved inevitably meant that the new guy (Ashworth) would have been rubbing up against the people who had previously done the bits of the tasks that he now wanted/had been told were his. This transfer of responsibility may have caused angst, &/or resistance, &/or a feeling of no longer being trusted. Those feelings, if felt, may have had a negative impact on the performance of one or more of the people so affected.

What is simply fact is that prior to Ashworth's arrival our PPG was 1.04. After his arrival, it fell to 0.75. That's a significant drop - but could be explained by other factors, sure. What is also fact is that there are countless examples of where a Director of Football (or similarly titled bod) has rocked up, and shortly after there have been departures of senior playing side of the club staff members.

We know that Chris is a decent human being. We know that he values integrity in himself and can therefore assume that he expects it from others. IF he felt that he hadn't been consulted appropriately about Ashworth's appointment, &/or about which of his tasks were going to be transferred to/heavily influenced by Ashworth, I don't believe it's a stretch to think that that would have negatively affected his performance.

Thanks.

 

[seagull_special]

Dan Ashworth started work with the Albion on 12 Feb 2019.

There were 26 matches in the 2018/19 PL season before 12 Feb 2019. At that point we were 14th in the League, with 27 points. PPG = 1.04.

Since 12 Feb 2019, there have been 12 PL games. We finished in 17th, having achieved a further 9 points from those 12 games. PPG = 0.75.


And people said that the appointment of Ashworth wouldn't upset the applecart.

Some, including me, said it would, at least in the short term, and these stats would support the argument that it did. And, arguably, Hughton lost his job as a consequence.

Note: I am not saying that Ashworth's a bad bloke, nor that his appointment isn't in the best mid/long-term interest of the club as I simply don't know. Rather, I'm simply saying that I called it as a "fudge" at the time of his appointment (albeit with my predicted victim being Winstanley, not Hughton), and that (tongue firmly in cheek) "...after all there’s no history of an incoming Technical Director having caused internal ructions in other pro football clubs..."

Tony Bloom is a fan and I think the reason that Chris has gone is that the football this year has been terrible to watch. I think he envisaged them working together to move the club forward but he couldn’t see the club/progressing. TB who cannot be described as trigger happy only wants the very best for this club and is a lot more ambitious than those saying we should know our place and be satisfied with 17th.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Of course I will continue to post

Excellent. A lot of us would miss you if you disappeared. I predict an interesting summer on NSC anyway!

 

[Weststander]

I hope Chris Hughton has the sort of personality that doesn't fall to pieces when a new person joins the management team.

So, to be clear, are you suggesting Ashworth's mere presence could have adversely affected Chris' ability to manage the team, or do you think Ashworth has said / done / promised something that has caused this?

Just trying to get a steer on what you are suggesting / insinuating here.

This.

Wild guessing, which the club (through Naylor) put firmly to bed.

 

[Kosh]

Nah; I don’t buy any correlation, three of our ‘wins’ pre Christmas we’re utter flukes... we were getting very lucky indeed, the match stats really back this up. All I see is a non CH scapegoat, as CH couldn’t be wholly to blame, or could he? The players stopped trying too, which has far more bearing on the fallout we’ve seen today.

The Ashworth appointment is just an unfortunate and badly timed coincidence and nothing more.

CH lost the majority of the dressing room, the recent (winger/forward) signings in particular, Kayal et al too, and was forced to revert to a team carried by the ageing Bong, Bruno and Murray FFS.

Ashworth played no part in the downfall and downturn, but MAY have had a say in the last 24 hours.... that is all.

 

[Albion Prem]

I think there are a number of people who will be looking over their shoulders when Ashworth is around, this is not going to be a happy period over the next two/three months

 

[Perkino]

Ridiculous claim. The problem is the change of formation to a 4-3-3 which left us exposed and we were unable to retain possession. The first half of the season we were gaining excellent results and I'm disappointed CH hasn't had more of a chance to move us forward

 

[Weststander]

I think there are a number of people who will be looking over their shoulders when Ashworth is around, this is not going to be a happy period over the next two/three months

If TB/PB/DA identify significant deficiencies, they will deal with it. As Albion fans, shirley we want that.

 

[Guinness Boy]

I think there are a number of people who will be looking over their shoulders when Ashworth is around, this is not going to be a happy period over the next two/three months

Like who?

No one's claiming he actually got CH the sack. The very clear premise is that it accidentally disrupted things and allowed divisions that were there under the surface to fester, That's literally it. Based on two things, the stats that back it up and the OPs business experience.

 

[Stat Brother]

Like who?

No one's claiming he actually got CH the sack. The very clear premise is that it accidentally disrupted things and allowed divisions that were there under the surface to fester, That's literally it. Based on two things, the stats that back it up and the OPs business experience.

and the stats don't even back it up.

The team had been shithouse since the middle of December.
Posters considerably more thoughtful than me were saying the team was shithouse throughout November's 1-0athons.

 

[Guinness Boy]

and the stats don't even back it up.

The team had been shithouse since the middle of December.
Posters considerably more thoughtful than me were saying the team was shithouse throughout November's 1-0athons.

Which bit of

There were 26 matches in the 2018/19 PL season before 12 Feb 2019. At that point we were 14th in the League, with 27 points. PPG = 1.04.

Since 12 Feb 2019, there have been 12 PL games. We finished in 17th, having achieved a further 9 points from those 12 games. PPG = 0.75.


don't you understand?