[News] 15 yr school girl stabbed to death Croydon

[Cornwallboy]

Really simple solution: Stop and search those who the statistics based on perpetrators and victims are most likely to carry a knife. I'm not saying it would stop it but if you fall within that demographic you will know there is a good chance you will be stopped and searched it may deter you from carrying a knife.

How? You’re not the police or the CPS. You’re not the accused lad’s solicitor. Only the perpetrator will ever know.

Let’s make it an easier question. How, in your opinion, should we stop teenage boys carrying knives?

 

[Guinness Boy]

Really simple solution: Stop and search those who the statistics based on perpetrators and victims are most likely to carry a knife. I'm not saying it would stop it but if you fall within that demographic you will know there is a good chance you will be stopped and searched it may deter you from carrying a knife.

Currently:

A police officer has powers to stop and search you if they have ‘reasonable grounds’ to suspect you’re carrying:

• illegal drugs
• a weapon
• stolen property
• something which could be used to commit a crime, such as a crowbar

Police powers to stop and search: your rights

The police can stop and question you at any time - they can search you depending on the situation.

www.gov.uk

Are you suggesting the police go out with crime statistic spreadsheets?

 

[Cornwallboy]

I'm suggesting exactly what I said in my last post.

 

[Live by the sea]

are your friends right wing extremeists?

do you think your priviledged upbringing clouds your decision making process?

No certainty not , I don’t have friends that are extremist right or left .

 

[Guinness Boy]

I'm suggesting exactly what I said in my last post.

Bit airy fairy though, isn't it? You said "Stop and search those who the statistics based on perpetrators and victims are most likely to carry a knife."

The demographics for that are different in different cities and different parts of cities. Additionally the age, gender and race of someone who's wearing a black hoodie in the dark is pretty undeterminable. How do you suggest the police best overcome those problems?

 

[Cornwallboy]

I'm sure for London it would be a fairly simple task to come up with a profile of those most likely to carry a knife. As for hoodies: search at your discretion.

Would what you suggest to solve knife crime in London?

Bit airy fairy though, isn't it? You said "Stop and search those who the statistics based on perpetrators and victims are most likely to carry a knife."

The demographics for that are different in different cities and different parts of cities. Additionally the age, gender and race of someone who's wearing a black hoodie in the dark is pretty undeterminable. How do you suggest the police best overcome those problems?

 

[Guinness Boy]

I'm sure for London it would be a fairly simple task to come up with a profile of those most likely to carry a knife. As for hoodies: search at your discretion.

Would what you suggest to solve knife crime in London?

It’s a nationwide issue. Worst of all in the West Midlands. Pretty bad in Glasgow. Dealers have attacked people with knives in Portslade. I don’t think a London only solution works. Why are you only interested in young people’s lives in London

 

[Happy Exile]

I'm sure for London it would be a fairly simple task to come up with a profile of those most likely to carry a knife. As for hoodies: search at your discretion.

Would what you suggest to solve knife crime in London?

Why just London? The most risky demographic to be in for knife crime in the UK is to be a young white male in Glasgow, where you're twice as likely to be knifed by another white male than any other demographic anywhere in the country. I'm not sure stopping and searching everyone white and under 28 who looks poor in Glasgow is a practical solution.

The only constant in perpetrators (and often victims) of knife crime in the UK is poverty and reduced educational opportunity, and to a slightly lesser degree, age. So to answer your question, lifting people out of poverty is generally the solution to a lot of societal ills and knife crime correlates with increased levels of poverty.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Why just London? The most risky demographic to be in for knife crime in the UK is to be a young white male in Glasgow, where you're twice as likely to be knifed by another white male than any other demographic anywhere in the country. I'm not sure stopping and searching everyone white and under 28 who looks poor in Glasgow is a practical solution.

The only constant in perpetrators (and often victims) of knife crime in the UK is poverty and reduced educational opportunity, and to a slightly lesser degree, age. So to answer your question, lifting people out of poverty is generally the solution to a lot of societal ills and knife crime correlates with increased levels of poverty.

Well exactly. Glasgow seems to be statistically the most risky, on Today this morning on R4 they said the West Midlands now had the worst problem with "knife crime". Either way, neither is in London.

 

[Bakero]

The last line isn’t one I agree with either . I’ve been to other countries like India & various Islands in the Caribbean etc where there is extreme inequality but teenagers don’t go around knifing each other .

8 of the countries in the top 10 for murder rates worldwide are in the Caribbean (mostly islands, 2 mainland Central American) with plenty more in the top 50. I guess the waiters and maids weren't stabbing each other in your hotel but the Dominican Republic comes in at 30, slightly ahead of the USA 34. India is 50, UK 69.

Stats from here: https://wisevoter.com/country-rankings/murder-rate-by-country/

 

[Bakero]

I’m not very technical I’m afraid . Other stuff I’ve read in the guardian has, not in those exact words but they talk about all the conditions that breed this type of behaviour apparently rather than it’s wrong to stab people - period

Does the Guardian or any other paper really need to tell their readers murder is wrong?

Surely, it's better to look at root causes than just say stabbing is bad.

You mentioned before some other European countries that also have poverty but lower murder rates. Interestingly, you neglected to mention that Latvia, Lithuania, Bulgaria and Romania have higher murder rates. What's more, they have greater levels of inequality. Makes you think, doesn't it? Or perhaps not.

 

[Hamilton]

I'm suggesting exactly what I said in my last post.

Ah, but by saying this you could mean young black men*.

Because the statistics may well say that most of the perpetrators are young, they are male, and they are black.

What are you going to do, stop all young black men?

Because not all young black men carry knives. The vast majority are law abiding citizens. Just as the vast majority of white people are not racist. Not saying anyone is btw, just using it to make the point that you can't jump to conclusions.

If we change it and say that most people who cause traffic accidents are old white women*, should we take the driving licenses of all old white women.

We can't go around stopping all people who fall into a profile just because we believe they may be about to commit a crime because, 'we don't like the look of them based on profile'.

*PS I have no idea what the data says.

 

[fly high]

8 of the countries in the top 10 for murder rates worldwide are in the Caribbean (mostly islands, 2 mainland Central American) with plenty more in the top 50. I guess the waiters and maids weren't stabbing each other in your hotel but the Dominican Republic comes in at 30, slightly ahead of the USA 34. India is 50, UK 69.

Stats from here: https://wisevoter.com/country-rankings/murder-rate-by-country/

45 years ago Jamaica tried to stamp out knife crime by giving anyone carrying one an automatic prison sentence, didn't work & has just got worse & worse.

 

[Cornwallboy]

Didn't say I was only interested in London but the thread started because of a knife crime in London. It does seem to me that London does seem to have more knife crimes than anywhere else in the country but maybe it's living down South so I'm more aware of it. Would you agree that targeting a specific age / sex / race in London based on statistics would make sense?

It’s a nationwide issue. Worst of all in the West Midlands. Pretty bad in Glasgow. Dealers have attacked people with knives in Portslade. I don’t think a London only solution works. Why are you only interested in young people’s lives in London

 

[Bakero]

Didn't say I was only interested in London but the thread started because of a knife crime in London. It does seem to me that London does seem to have more knife crimes than anywhere else in the country but maybe it's living down South so I'm more aware of it. Would you agree that targeting a specific age / sex / race in London based on statistics would make sense?

West Midlands has the highest rate of knife crime https://commonslibrary.parliament.u... the year ending March,higher than in 2010/11.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Didn't say I was only interested in London but the thread started because of a knife crime in London. It does seem to me that London does seem to have more knife crimes than anywhere else in the country but maybe it's living down South so I'm more aware of it. Would you agree that targeting a specific age / sex / race in London based on statistics would make sense?

Yes you did. You only mentioned London and not the two areas in the country which are far worse.

Suss / SaS laws are national, so no, it makes no sense to base it on London.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Just to be clear , I don’t think it’s only some black teenagers, I have not said that . Target everyone that fits the stats , Black , White & Asian . Tariq doesn’t for example fit the profile to be targeted , his vibe & language Wouldn’t match a gang members .

So we should statistically target the vibe and language

 

[WATFORD zero]

Didn't say I was only interested in London but the thread started because of a knife crime in London. It does seem to me that London does seem to have more knife crimes than anywhere else in the country but maybe it's living down South so I'm more aware of it. Would you agree that targeting a specific age / sex / race in London based on statistics would make sense?

In which case it's simply another example of your predisposed bigotry taking precedence over the actual facts which have been posted on this thread repeatedly

 

[Bakero]

So we should statistically target the vibe and language

You know. Kids with caps on backwards and no belts.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Ah, but by saying this you could mean young black men*.

Because the statistics may well say that most of the perpetrators are young, they are male, and they are black.

What are you going to do, stop all young black men?

Because not all young black men carry knives. The vast majority are law abiding citizens. Just as the vast majority of white people are not racist. Not saying anyone is btw, just using it to make the point that you can't jump to conclusions.

If we change it and say that most people who cause traffic accidents are old white women*, should we take the driving licenses of all old white women.

We can't go around stopping all people who fall into a profile just because we believe they may be about to commit a crime because, 'we don't like the look of them based on profile'.

*PS I have no idea what the data says.

Facts from an old white woman.


On a national scale, white males between 21 and 25 seem statistically more likely to get into a car crash with 3,036 car accidents in 2021, followed by 26- to 30-year-olds with 2,958 accidents and 31- to 35-year-olds in third place with 2,821.