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[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)



raymondo

Well-known member
Apr 26, 2017
8,058
Wiltshire




Eric the meek

Fiveways Wilf
NSC Patron
Aug 24, 2020
7,726
This wasn't such a good read though.

The war has gone on for too long. It needs to end.

I don't think Putin sees it like this though. I think he sees it as an existential war. Not for Ukraine, but for himself, his legacy and possibly, Russia itself.

I think he is right.
 


papachris

Well-known member
In our news today. Looks like they couldn't find anything with this one
 


Sirnormangall

Well-known member
Sep 21, 2017
3,294
The strength of this thread, now 1000 pages long, is that we get a huge variety of input from a huge variety of sources.

Political interviews, geopolitical analyses, drone geek stuff, bavovnas, front line combat, and a few friendly Russian interlopers. And if that's not enough, we also have that crazy long haired economist. Something for everyone.
That this thread is now over 1000 pages is largely down to you and Raymondo - thank you for keeping it going. It’s become my primary source of info on the war and there’s a good flow of balanced views from you and several others.

…..and on a day like today this thread is also a welcome distraction from all matters nottingham
 


Eric the meek

Fiveways Wilf
NSC Patron
Aug 24, 2020
7,726
That this thread is now over 1000 pages is largely down to you and Raymondo - thank you for keeping it going. It’s become my primary source of info on the war and there’s a good flow of balanced views from you and several others.

…..and on a day like today this thread is also a welcome distraction from all matters nottingham
Thank you for your kind words. I appreciate you taking the time and effort to post them, more than I can say.

Like many/most of us, I am hurting today. But then I read a tweet like the one below, which prompted me to question 'what am I doing'? Some things don't matter. There is always someone worse off than me.

 




Eric the meek

Fiveways Wilf
NSC Patron
Aug 24, 2020
7,726
It would seem that Russia is resorting to attacking its own civilians. This time, a boarding school in Sudzha, Kursk.

If anyone thinks this is unlikely, Russia has previous - in the winter war against Finland, the 1999 Chechen war (Putin) and in the days leading up to the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

 


fly high

Well-known member
Aug 25, 2011
1,878
in a house
It would seem that Russia is resorting to attacking its own civilians. This time, a boarding school in Sudzha, Kursk.

If anyone thinks this is unlikely, Russia has previous - in the winter war against Finland, the 1999 Chechen war (Putin) and in the days leading up to the Russian invasion of Ukraine.


Just when you think Russia can't sink any lower they show they are more than capable of being worse. They will of cause claim it was Ukraine what done it.
 


Eric the meek

Fiveways Wilf
NSC Patron
Aug 24, 2020
7,726
Just when you think Russia can't sink any lower they show they are more than capable of being worse. They will of cause claim it was Ukraine what done it.
We should expect more to come from Russia, as the pressure builds, and the options narrow for Putin.

Considering his attacks on the Rheinmettall-linked plants in Spain and Italy, he may be trying to widen the war, bring in Nato, and unite Russians against the enemy he has been telling them all about throughout the war.
 








crookie

Well-known member
Jun 14, 2013
3,399
Back in Sussex
A very tough read. The transition that Ukraine is trying to make...from a Soviet legacy type army environment, into a more western style.
Blimey, it's hard for them all.
I do find it a little surprising that Ukraine have not mobilised 18-25 year olds. It's a war of National survival and could massively increase the manpower pool, which they need. I know there would be opposition but with Putin happy to bring in North Koreans, and next to no chance of Western troops getting involved surely Zekebsky must be considering this ?
 




timbha

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2003
10,702
Sussex
I do find it a little surprising that Ukraine have not mobilised 18-25 year olds. It's a war of National survival and could massively increase the manpower pool, which they need. I know there would be opposition but with Putin happy to bring in North Koreans, and next to no chance of Western troops getting involved surely Zekebsky must be considering this ?
It does seem strange because conscriptions usually take the 18-25’s first, don’t they?
 


Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
54,084
Goldstone
I do find it a little surprising that Ukraine have not mobilised 18-25 year olds. It's a war of National survival and could massively increase the manpower pool, which they need.

But do they desperately need more manpower?

Each year I'd guess that 250,000 men turn 26, so that alone provides decent potential for recruitment.

Presumably they will start recruiting younger people, maybe just starting with 25-year-olds, if they need to. But at the moment Russia is making very little progress.

I'd love to know what Ukraine's plan is, because on the face of it I don't see how they lose.
 


raymondo

Well-known member
Apr 26, 2017
8,058
Wiltshire
But do they desperately need more manpower?

Each year I'd guess that 250,000 men turn 26, so that alone provides decent potential for recruitment.

Presumably they will start recruiting younger people, maybe just starting with 25-year-olds, if they need to. But at the moment Russia is making very little progress.

I'd love to know what Ukraine's plan is, because on the face of it I don't see how they lose.
They don't lose so long as the west supplies sufficient weapons and monetary support as needed.
 




raymondo

Well-known member
Apr 26, 2017
8,058
Wiltshire
I do find it a little surprising that Ukraine have not mobilised 18-25 year olds. It's a war of National survival and could massively increase the manpower pool, which they need. I know there would be opposition but with Putin happy to bring in North Koreans, and next to no chance of Western troops getting involved surely Zekebsky must be considering this ?
I am surprised also. I believe there would be a political backlash if they mobilised down to 18 year olds, but they could mobilise 25, 24, maybe 23 year olds.

I know they are basically holding the front line against the Russians (ok, they lost a few tree lines and villages this year, but little).
Newly mobilised could be trained in depth and then rotated in bit by bit, to give exhausted (and I believe there are many) troops a break.
So, a bigger pool to select from, shorter stints on the front line, reenergise (physically and mentally), show a professionalism in troop management.

And, if they need them, 18 to 20 years could be trained as drone operators or builders or hackers, ...all very useful roles...in fact effing critical roles.
 
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raymondo

Well-known member
Apr 26, 2017
8,058
Wiltshire
That this thread is now over 1000 pages is largely down to you and Raymondo - thank you for keeping it going. It’s become my primary source of info on the war and there’s a good flow of balanced views from you and several others.

…..and on a day like today this thread is also a welcome distraction from all matters nottingham
That's very kind, thanks @Sirnormangall .

Actually though, it's all @vegster 's fault for starting the thread 😉.
Seriously though, everyone's contributions keep it very vibrant and timely. I have my favourite sources, but there are MANY and all contributions are really helpful to the thread.
 




raymondo

Well-known member
Apr 26, 2017
8,058
Wiltshire
This is a long opinion piece, and I can't really summarise the differing views.
It's dated 9th January and reflects on the upcoming Polish EU presidency (for 6 months) and what Poland may or may not push for in terms of support for Ukraine AND Europe's defence architecture in general. Worth a read if you can make time.
 




Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
54,084
Goldstone
I've often thought - when it's all over and Ukraine has got lasting peace and the land back it owns, Russia's economy is in tatters,
a world pariah and Putin and his cronies are all in The Hague, we should have a few drinks to celebrate,.

Regardless of when it happens, one day I will drink to celebrate Putin's end.
 




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