[Politics] Trump's new gender executive order...

Hugo Rune said:

And that’s the problem with gender and sex and why it is a godsend to ‘anti-woke’ culture war stokers.

This is a very simple question where some people need a simple answer. However, the answers are very complex depending on situation and circumstance. A division of ‘two’ does not fully represent the population, either in sex or gender.

Those who need simple answers to what they perceive as simple questions (but actually are not) find Trumpism very alluring, however, his answers are very rarely solutions. Just hate.

But perhaps there is a simple answer? Try being nice to people instead of trying to divide them.

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sussex_guy2k2 said:

I’d be interested to know how many of those opposed to Trans people have actually met any people who have or are transitioning, considering the tiny percentage of the whole population that consider themselves to be trans. And from that number, I wonder how many have had a conversation about why they are trans. I don’t imagine the numbers are that high, why begs the question why this is at the forefront of social, culture conversation when there are many bigger issues going on.

Personally, I don’t really understand the need some have to transition, as I’ve never had those feelings. And I certainly think there needs to be some protection in place for women, and some regulation around trans people entering gendered sports competitions.

But overall I don’t really see how anyone can get that worked up about people transitioning when there’s so few trans people and the impact of them is so tiny. It does, as you say, feel like the anti-woke groups’ need to clarify things in their own limited minds, even if that clarity comes at the expense of trans people who are likely to suffer even more bullying and violence than they already do.

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Bodian said:

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sussex_guy2k2 said:

I’d be interested to know how many of those opposed to Trans people have actually met any people who have or are transitioning, considering the tiny percentage of the whole population that consider themselves to be trans. And from that number, I wonder how many have had a conversation about why they are trans. I don’t imagine the numbers are that high, why begs the question why this is at the forefront of social, culture conversation when there are many bigger issues going on.

Personally, I don’t really understand the need some have to transition, as I’ve never had those feelings. And I certainly think there needs to be some protection in place for women, and some regulation around trans people entering gendered sports competitions.

But overall I don’t really see how anyone can get that worked up about people transitioning when there’s so few trans people and the impact of them is so tiny. It does, as you say, feel like the anti-woke groups’ need to clarify things in their own limited minds, even if that clarity comes at the expense of trans people who are likely to suffer even more bullying and violence than they already do.

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WSU Dilettante said:

Oooh that is deliciously hilarious.
This lot are so stupid.

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n1 gull said:

Yeh but you're a man so it doesn't affect you. This is a women's issue who represent over 50% of the population

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Mustafa II said:

I must admit I kind of agree with Trump on this one.

Being able to categorise all people as either male or female is really useful when it comes to protecting women and children in our society.

It's important to be inclusive towards as many people as we can be, but this is one matter that isn't likely to ever have a satisfactory conclusion.

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FamilyGuy said:

Protecting against who or what (genuine question)?
And do any males need protecting too - either against the same things or something different?

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n1 gull said:

Yeh but you're a man so it doesn't affect you. This is a women's issue who represent over 50% of the population

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Mustafa II said:

It's just my opinion, and I accept that it's controversial to some, but I don't think people who were born male should be allowed in female private spaces. There are examples where women have been harmed as a result of this, for examples in toilets or in prisons. I don't think people born male should be allowed to compete in women's sport, as they usually have some advantage, if not a significant one.

Men are naturally stronger than women and so women need more protection in their lives. Even though there are likely as many bad women as there are bad men, the bad men are a greater threat to women, than vice versa... and that fact doesn't change if their genders are not the same as the sex they are born with.

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sussex_guy2k2 said:

I’d love to hear the explanation for this. Please do go on.

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FamilyGuy said:

Some men may be stronger than women (it would be v easy to give examples), however the reverse is also true - and I guess that's the flaw/complexity in this logic.

I tend to agree with you about the competing in sports things, however again, it should be two-way - ie women should not be allowed to compete in men-only sports (again there are exceptions - darts etc).

Bad men are not necessarily a greater threat than bad women - its just not that black and white.

I tend to agree with your overarching arguments, however its my opinion that you're portraying it as being a world of binary, one-way decisions (no pun intended), and that is simply not the case. I've met women who are "badder" than men and I know women who are stronger than men. Some sports lend themselves to mixed-sex players (however perhaps that's a red herring here).

It's complicated.

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FamilyGuy said:

Some men may be stronger than women (it would be v easy to give examples), however the reverse is also true - and I guess that's the flaw/complexity in this logic.

I tend to agree with you about the competing in sports things, however again, it should be two-way - ie women should not be allowed to compete in men-only sports (again there are exceptions - darts etc).

Bad men are not necessarily a greater threat than bad women - its just not that black and white.

I tend to agree with your overarching arguments, however its my opinion that you're portraying it as being a world of binary, one-way decisions (no pun intended), and that is simply not the case. I've met women who are "badder" than men and I know women who are stronger than men. Some sports lend themselves to mixed-sex players (however perhaps that's a red herring here).

It's complicated.

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FamilyGuy said:

So Trump is a female, and so am I and so is my wife? Interesting .....

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n1 gull said:

It's mainly a female issue as it is their rights that are affected

Women's sport, Women's shelters, Women's toilets, Women's changing rooms, Women's prisons, Women's only groups including lesbian groups, Women's breast feeding classes etc...

I'm not an expert but I've done a bit of reading - Helen Joyce, Katherine Stock, JK Rowling and I recommend the Graham Lineham book which is about how he got cancelled from the entertainment industry for his views on the subject

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Mustafa II said:

It's not complicated, it's actually very simple. This cultural problem is what's making it complicated. There are two sexes - men and women - and men are almost all of the time considerably stronger than women, but of course with a few exceptions as you are suggesting.

Our biology means that a super fit 21 year old woman who lifts weights at the gym every day can easily be overpowered by a 45 year old bloke who has never been to the gym in his life. It's terribly unfair, but it is the reality.

There is also the biological trait of men 'needing' sexual gratification. I'm a bloke and I'm very much supportive of the wellbeing and the rights of men, and I believe that most men are good, but it is not untrue to say that some men - even if they identify as another gender - can be likely to pursue sexual gratification in ways that can harm women and children.

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Mustafa II said:

It's not complicated, it's actually very simple. This cultural problem is what's making it complicated. There are two sexes - men and women - and men are almost all of the time considerably stronger than women, but of course with a few exceptions as you are suggesting.

Our biology meins that a super fit 21 year old woman who lifts weights at the gym every day can easily be overpowered by a 45 year old bloke who has never been to the gym in his life. It's terribly unfair, but it is the reality.

There is also the biological trait of men 'needing' sexual gratification. I'm a bloke and I'm very much supportive of the wellbeing and the rights of men, and I believe that most men are good, but it is not untrue to say that some men - even if they identify as another gender - can be likely to pursue sexual gratification in ways that can harm women and children.

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Mustafa II said:

It's just my opinion, and I accept that it's controversial to some, but I don't think people who were born male should be allowed in female private spaces. There are examples where women have been harmed as a result of this, for examples in toilets or in prisons. I don't think people born male should be allowed to compete in women's sport, as they usually have some advantage, if not a significant one.

Men are naturally stronger than women and so women need more protection in their lives. Even though there are likely as many bad women as there are bad men, the bad men are a greater threat to women, than vice versa... and that fact doesn't change if their genders are not the same as the sex they are born with.

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sussex_guy2k2 said:

So the US President, a man, is allowed an opinion, and you, I assume a man, are allowed to decide which gender this issue is attributed to and affects the most, but I, as a man, am not allowed an opinion of Trans issues?

No one is being cancelled on a football message board for having an opinion on this.

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