Have to admit this is one I haven't heard yet. "I can't get a decent job because the generation above me have failed to inspire me to".
It's a good one
Got something to say or just want fewer pesky ads? Join us... 😊
[News] Is Britain work shy ?
- Thread starter Leekbrookgull
- Start date
It's a good one
Oh really you are a tool. Lets see if we can find a use for you.
BCal had an apprenticeship scheme of 18 entries per year. I was lucky to be one of 4500 applicants. Nothing has changed.
One of the others who got the job was Keith Cuss' son Simon.
beorhthelm
A. Virgo, Football Genius
- Jul 21, 2003
- 36,064
where did this idea we should automatically live on our own from a basic wage emerge from? time was you lived with parents until you'd got a few rungs up the wage ladder, or shared a flat with mates, strangers, whatever.
Rdodge30
Well-known member
- Dec 30, 2022
- 772
If that’s aimed at me then that is a very poor argument- because I disagree with you I don’t have understanding for other humans?
I honestly think we are talking about different people here, it’s just that you seem to think they don’t exist.
Anyone who hasn’t lived on benefits wouldn’t understand
Hardly anyone doesn’t understand
Benefit cap in this country for a single person is (roughly) the same as working 30 hours a week on minimum wage.
Is Britain work shy not exactly but I can see why you might be thinking that.
The real answer is far more complicated but to find answers we only need to look to the past.
If we work on the fact that everything has a life cycle including the earth and everything upon it, then it’s also true that every Society also has a lifecycle that ultimately ends in collapse.
Capitalism is midway through its final phase while political parties and the public scrabble around for solutions society is ever so slowly breaking down.
The Roman Empire has had over 200 reasons attributed to its collapse, one of the main reasons related to a change Romans in that for generations it was viewed by joining the army was a way to get on in life it was a civic duty, this view changed over time and instead they gave the jobs to others are the British work shy or are we choosing no longer perform our civic duties.
The real answer is far more complicated but to find answers we only need to look to the past.
If we work on the fact that everything has a life cycle including the earth and everything upon it, then it’s also true that every Society also has a lifecycle that ultimately ends in collapse.
Capitalism is midway through its final phase while political parties and the public scrabble around for solutions society is ever so slowly breaking down.
The Roman Empire has had over 200 reasons attributed to its collapse, one of the main reasons related to a change Romans in that for generations it was viewed by joining the army was a way to get on in life it was a civic duty, this view changed over time and instead they gave the jobs to others are the British work shy or are we choosing no longer perform our civic duties.
Last edited:
Could have been aimed at me as well, haha.If that’s aimed at me then that is a very poor argument- because I disagree with you I don’t have understanding for other humans?
I honestly think we are talking about different people here, it’s just that you seem to think they don’t exist.
Anyone who hasn’t lived on benefits wouldn’t understand
Hardly anyone doesn’t understand
Benefit cap in this country for a single person is (roughly) the same as working 30 hours a week on minimum wage.
Keeping back the encouragement I gave to my kids. I'll wait for the next post of woe.
There are very strong links between my attitude and my unemployment. I'm a lost case. I'm not young either.And this goes back to what I was saying earlier about people not being told the right things at school / Uni / wherever about how to actually get on in life. I've been employing people in Brighton for almost 8 years. In the time ONE person has taken the time to contact me directly and ask for an interview to work for my company. We employed her, she was great. And she has since buggered off to set up her own company, the bitch
I would argue this is another example of the problem. You said there is no way anyone could get a job like that today. It took 5 seconds to search Google for 'Aircraft Engineer Apprenticeships' and an advert for a job doing exactly that, with no degree required immediately appeared. I showed it to you and you decided it basically can't be true, and found a problem with it. Anybody who has that kind of attitude is going to struggle to find a decent job!
I mean, you could have just said "Yeah OK, fair enough" or something like I did to @PILTDOWN MAN when he completely schooled me earlier in the thread. But I know that's not your style.
Could there be a link between any of this attitude and the struggles that you have said you face to gain meaningful employment?
But its not relevant to the topic or my stance. I have zero self-interest on this topic. The ONLY thing I try to do here right now is to highlight the situation of the depressed and hopeless youth of the world today that gets dismissed as "lazy".
They need help and understanding and they need it now or we're going to have suicide rates that make the rates of the 1920s and 30s depression look like a kids game.
Understand them and help them get good lives or bring out the whip and push them over the edge. Thats the only two options at this point.
Those who have done well and lived well need to pull their head out their arses and try to understand that society has changed in the direction of "easier to live, more difficult to have a life" and that the young ones are depressed about it.
jackalbion
Well-known member
- Aug 30, 2011
- 5,057
To a certain extent though it has, I'd be surprised if you can get in at entry level now, they usually ask for experience, or degrees. That's before you get to the AI application issues, I've seen recently.
Interesting. If I may pick up on your comment on the inadequate provision of Swedish welfare payments, things are different here, if your circumstances allow (which they do for many)....
Council houses. It took me a long time to realize they were forever homes that could be handed down to kids, and not stop gaps for people saving for a mortgage.
I realized there was something odd about this when the woman I did Saturday shopping for in the late 60s lived in a council house with nicer stuff (furniture, kitchen, telly) than the one my mum and dad had bought, and were going on holiday twice a year. And abroad. Undreamt of for my family (we never ever did go on holiday abroad, and my late mum never even went aboard. Not even to Wales.
Well, I didn't mind, really. I was just a bit surprised. On reflection, the rents were too low, and once you were 'in' there was no check for continued need. But of course one would argue that if low income was needed to allow qualification for continued residence in a council house then people wouldn't bother trying to 'better' their lives. That, actually, is a strong argument for elements of what used to be mainstream conservatism.
That said, council housing once transformed lives. I am sure a rubric must be possible with some thought.
Last edited:
I agree and posted previously, the apprenticeship schemes are a mess. This has happened as a result of government intervention in the Blair years. Vocational training is far better suited to many of the school leavers. The madness of expecting so many to leave their family homes to be educated elsewhere, often with few actual lectures and building huge debt. Being educated locally and even earning while you do it, albeit a low wage is the proper way of doing it. As an apprentice BCal paid Crawley College to run an HNC then HND course for us. We attended the college and when on term holidays we had to go to work at the airport. We had to take our 14 days leave in this period.
dsr-burnley
Well-known member
- Aug 15, 2014
- 2,687
Could you clarify what that quote means please?
Rdodge30
Well-known member
- Dec 30, 2022
- 772
Your total generalisations both of, “those who have done well” and “the young ones” are just as unacceptable as the generalisations of others that hold the opposite views to you.
It simply won’t do you know.
jackalbion
Well-known member
- Aug 30, 2011
- 5,057
Agree the apprenticeship schemes in this country are a shambles, need to direct people down the routes they want to go early doors. I think I was lucky in that I always knew what I wanted to do so worked through college and university to get that job, but can see for a lot of people my age it hasn't been an easy task, and especially those younger than me. In the 6 years I've been at my job, its changed massively. My brother has just left university, and when he finished travelling has come back and found it very very hard to get into any industry, let alone one he was aiming at, living at home fortunately, so he hasn't had too many stresses, and can still go to the cinema at 2pm, while I'm stuck at bloody work
. Thankfully he's just got a job, but I think the employment to property ladder is getting later and later. Maybe into mid to late 30s even 40s now before you can even fathom a house (with exceptions of course).
I do think everyone needs to be prepared to completely change their career paths. Mine has certainly changed. Sometimes you have to go backwards to go forwards. There's no such thing as over qualified.Agree the apprenticeship schemes in this country are a shambles, need to direct people down the routes they want to go early doors. I think I was lucky in that I always knew what I wanted to do so worked through college and university to get that job, but can see for a lot of people my age it hasn't been an easy task, and especially those younger than me. In the 6 years I've been at my job, its changed massively. My brother has just left university, and when he finished travelling has come back and found it very very hard to get into any industry, let alone one he was aiming at, living at home fortunately, so he hasn't had too many stresses, and can still go to the cinema at 2pm, while I'm stuck at bloody work
The Clamp
Well-known member
There is a remarkable amount of help out there for under 25’s and Indeed is chock full of jobs both qualified and menial.
The Jobcentre will pay for a CSCS course or an SIA license.
If one is able bodied and willing to work, there’s plenty out there. And if the motivation isn’t there, it’s not hard for the government to provide reasons to work.
The Jobcentre will pay for a CSCS course or an SIA license.
If one is able bodied and willing to work, there’s plenty out there. And if the motivation isn’t there, it’s not hard for the government to provide reasons to work.
Justice
Dangerous Idiot
At least you gave it a go I admire that, I couldn’t work for other people, as my my other half says to me you don’t play well with others
it is true I’m a bit of a perfectionist if you are going to do a job do it properly.Housing is always very interesting topic.
Your government and mine gave up on providing housing a long time ago. We gave up trying to push them to as well.
We left it to the kids to sort it out.
"Sorry we gave up on you, but we expect you to be resilient and provide work and taxes to the society who is incapable of doing anything at all for you".
The situation for Britain is difficult tbf. Labour or some other miracle maker is going to need like 40 years of dictatorship to sort shit out. I think this guy makes a decent job of explaining why, especially in the chapter "No Building Please, We're British". It highlights the gigantic costs and problems you are facing. Need to double taxes to catch up with other European countries in infrastructure.
Its a mission impossible. The current ways societies are run prevents Britain from rising again. There are no tools in the current toolbox to change it.
Here in Sweden, the situation is only slightly better because in the 1960s, the government decided to build one million houses, "the million programme" and apartments - nearly doubling the amount at the time.
It took ten years. All of it looks like some DDR nonsense bullshit and for the first 30 years, there were more apartments and houses than people.
An early 90s baby boom - boosted by the fact that is was so amazingly easy to get apartments - and a case of "hyperimmigration" has rather swiftly turned this around.
Do Sweden need to build another million apartments and houses now? Yes. Can it be done? No, what could be done in 10 years back in 1960 can not be done at all today. All of the state companies that could build shit has been privatised meaning its virtually impossible to finance it. House owners and whatnot has had increased opportunities to delay and f*** up planning. And most importantly, the property owners understand the massive benefit of having people fighting and overpaying for housing.
These changes to society are not Sweden unique (or England unique for that matter), they're a global or at least Western phenomenom.
And of course the changes affects the young the most.
The increased difficulty in getting ANYTHING done (aside from skyscrapers in capitals) at the top level increases the difficulty of getting ANYTHING (such as living somewhere) done.
Justice
Dangerous Idiot
Not everyone is 20 yrs old, plenty of middle aged on minimum wage.