[News] Is Britain work shy ?

[Justice]

Minimum wage full time job lets say take home £420 after tax rent £300 per week for a tiny one bed flat.
That leaves you a massive £120 for the week with no food or fuel bills paid let alone council tax.
Existing isn’t a life is it?

 

[jackalbion]

I started at 16 as an apprentice and worked f***ing hard for very little for years.

Do you think I just rocked up and got that apprenticeship?

Or perhaps I looked up all the businesses in the area and wrote to them, none of these jobs were advertised. I wasn't given an help, no one told what to do. All my letters were handwritten. My cold writing got me four offers of work.

I expect you did work hard, like many others do, but I don't think that sort of opportunity comes around now. The job market in my opinion at the moment is absolutely dire, if you want to earn a wage to sensibly save up and buy a house.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

I don't doubt it was hard work. I doubt people today get the same chances of doing that hard work though.

If some 16-year-old lad sends a letter to SAAB today and say "hi I wanna come and build some JAS Gripen", they will not get some sort of apprenticeship, they will be told to spend the next eight years or so studying how to build aircraft.

WTF do you think I did as an apprentice.

You will not win the argument with me I'm afraid. If you want a job you'll get one. It may not pay or be what you want but every excuse eh?

 

[The Clamp]

are you a vampire hunter?

A vampire.

 

[Han Solo]

5 second Google search.

aircraft engineer apprenticeship - Google Search

Great stuff.

Cultural misunderstanding then and maybe people are just work shy and need to get a grip and a haircut and engulf in the wealth of available jobs.

If I get kids I'll send them to Britain where 18-year-olds build airplanes rather than here where you're not getting anywhere near engineering anything without a long education.

I'm going to suggest him to go there by boat though.

 

[Justice]

Nothing. I don't own one.

I owned five businesses Employed over 20 people. I set up two new businesses and unfortunately my wife was involved in a serious incident which left her in hospital for a year. I had 5 children, with three different schools to drop off and pick up each day, my wife was 45 miles away in hospital. The two businesses failed taking my home with them. I ended up caring for my wife until my daughter was able to do it. I was basically skint though never went bankrupt. Indeed I paid off all the debts as I was able to return to work. Been in private rented ever since. My wife died three years ago. I have since had four operations which led my company to "paying me off" having had 2/3 pay in that time. I'm now self employed just about putting food on the table. I work f***ing hard, I used my pension fund to start my business so will likely be working until I drop.

Could say I've been unfortunate and looking for sympathy, I'm not. If my current business doesn't work out I'll find a job. Never claimed a penny apart from caring for my wife.

What do you do out of interest?

 

[Rdodge30]

People who think that other people want to live on benefits and social welfare most often haven't tried living on it

Oh they are out there and in abundance. There may well be many people on long term sick who are genuinely struggling and genuinely cannot work. That much I accept.

Equally there are people who simply do not want to work, won’t work and feel the world owes them a living. In this country we have for too long used the carrot and bigger carrot method- time to return to the carrot and Birch

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

Minimum wage full time job lets say take home £420 after tax rent £300 per week for a tiny one bed flat.
That leaves you a massive £120 for the week with no food or fuel bills paid let alone council tax.
Existing isn’t a life is it?

What do you do out of interest?

I now buy and sell junk, sorry I mean fine antiques.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

I expect you did work hard, like many others do, but I don't think that sort of opportunity comes around now. The job market in my opinion at the moment is absolutely dire, if you want to earn a wage to sensibly save up and buy a house.

I just feel so deeply sad seeing all the smart and sparky kids around my town. Loving life, not a care in the world. As it should be. Except they don't know it yet, but they are doomed to zero chance of buying - or probably even renting - a place in this here Brighton or even anywhere nearby. It's a shit state of affairs Tommy

 

[Justice]

Oh they are out there and in abundance. There may well be many people on long term sick who are genuinely struggling and genuinely cannot work. That much I accept.

Equally there are people who simply do not want to work, won’t work and feel the world owes them a living. In this country we have for too long used the carrot and bigger carrot method- time to return to the carrot and Birch

Do they have a flat screen tv though?

 

[Han Solo]

Oh they are out there and in abundance. There may well be many people on long term sick who are genuinely struggling and genuinely cannot work. That much I accept.

Equally there are people who simply do not want to work, won’t work and feel the world owes them a living. In this country we have for too long used the carrot and bigger carrot method- time to return to the carrot and Birch

Like I said, people who haven't been on social welfare normally share your view. Same in the US, same in Sweden.

"Bring out the whip and everyone will be working regardless if there's jobs or not" is the melody.

Some people have spent their life working so hard they forgot to learn thinking or feeling or understanding other humans.

 

[Biscuit]

Minimum wage full time job lets say take home £420 after tax rent £300 per week for a tiny one bed flat.
That leaves you a massive £120 for the week with no food or fuel bills paid let alone council tax.
Existing isn’t a life is it?

I agree with this. I'd be interested to know how the average wage vs average cost-of-living has changed over the decades.

It *feels* like we're earning less and everything costs more, but I don't have data to back that up. Genuinely interested.

 

[jackalbion]

I feel so sad seeing all the smart and sparky kids around my town. They don't know it yet, but they are doomed to zero chance of buying - or probably even renting - a place in this here Brighton or even anywhere nearby. It's a shit state of affairs Tommy

For example my job, we had 2500 applicants on the last round, entry level job as well, but you have to cut people down, AI is making it very murky, IMO. Recruitment seems to be absolutely broken at the moment, we are struggling to get people once you get to the interview stage, and the ones that do start are not of good quality. I wish it was as simple as when @PILTDOWN MAN applied, but its very difficult for people to navigate the recruitment process and it means that the best candidates get ignored.

 

[Justice]

I now buy and sell junk, sorry I mean fine antiques.

 

[Han Solo]

I agree with this. I'd be interested to know how the average wage vs average cost-of-living has changed over the decades.

It *feels* like we're earning less and everything costs more, but I don't have data to back that up. Genuinely interested.

Surely median wage is more interesting? Average wages are almost always inflated by the top 1% to the point that they don't really represent the economy of the average person.

I agree it would be genuinely interesting though so now I've got some researching to do today. Hopefully can find global numbers. Will return!

 

[Justice]

I agree with this. I'd be interested to know how the average wage vs average cost-of-living has changed over the decades.

It *feels* like we're earning less and everything costs more, but I don't have data to back that up. Genuinely interested.

Considering labour have slapped an extra tax of £2500 per employee for the employer no one will get a pay rise for years.

 

[Commander]

I started at 16 as an apprentice and worked f***ing hard for very little for years.

Do you think I just rocked up and got that apprenticeship?

Or perhaps I looked up all the businesses in the area and wrote to them, none of these jobs were advertised. I wasn't given an help, no one told what to do. All my letters were handwritten. My cold writing got me four offers of work.

And this goes back to what I was saying earlier about people not being told the right things at school / Uni / wherever about how to actually get on in life. I've been employing people in Brighton for almost 8 years. In the time ONE person has taken the time to contact me directly and ask for an interview to work for my company. We employed her, she was great. And she has since buggered off to set up her own company, the bitch . But it's no surprise that somebody who bothered to use her initiative like that has gone on to do really well for herself. Unlike the countless others I've hired who didn't work out for us and have since drifted, failing from job to job.

I don't doubt it was hard work. I doubt people today get the same chances of doing that hard work though.

If some 16-year-old lad sends a letter to SAAB today and say "hi I wanna come and build some JAS Gripen", they will not get some sort of apprenticeship, they will be told to spend the next eight years or so studying how to build aircraft.

I would argue this is another example of the problem. You said there is no way anyone could get a job like that today. It took 5 seconds to search Google for 'Aircraft Engineer Apprenticeships' and an advert for a job doing exactly that, with no degree required immediately appeared. I showed it to you and you decided it basically can't be true, and found a problem with it. Anybody who has that kind of attitude is going to struggle to find a decent job!

Great stuff.

Cultural misunderstanding then and maybe people are just work shy and need to get a grip and a haircut and engulf in the wealth of available jobs.

If I get kids I'll send them to Britain where 18-year-olds build airplanes rather than here where you're not getting anywhere near engineering anything without a long education.

I'm going to suggest him to go there by boat though.

I mean, you could have just said "Yeah OK, fair enough" or something like I did to @PILTDOWN MAN when he completely schooled me earlier in the thread. But I know that's not your style.

Could there be a link between any of this attitude and the struggles that you have said you face to gain meaningful employment?

 

[Han Solo]

WTF do you think I did as an apprentice.

You will not win the argument with me I'm afraid. If you want a job you'll get one. It may not pay or be what you want but every excuse eh?

So in essence people are work shy today because you and the others from your generation failed to raise and inspire the next generation to be as good as you?

Then I wonder what you think you could have done better to make the kids of today as good people as you are?

I'm genuinely interested in understanding why people think young people are lazier today than they were.

 

[dsr-burnley]

as a gen x i always a chuckle at this blaming "boomers" almost as if the commentator dont have a clue. the boomer generation were born post war and faced actual difficulties, hard life the current or past generation know little to nothing about. like out door privy, no central heating, working in hard industrial jobs for average pay, private transport or holidays a luxury. they lucked out through the prosperity of 80's and 90's, hardly their fault, through hard work. ah, yes, there's the thing that has changed.

to an earlier comment about having a reason to work, that generation and those before didnt need a reason to work, they just assumed they had to work. buying a home would be a dream for most, often coming only after marriage and a lot of saving. not falling out of uni expecting a high salary and a house in your early 20's. my boomer parents built their own home in thier early 30's to make it doable.

Don't forget the school class sizes of 50!

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

I'm a bit like Yosser, I can do that!

My career has been varied

Aircraft Engineer
Licensed Aircfraft Engineer
Health & Safety manager
Owned three pubs
Started a licensing company and animal feed/equine business
Owned another pub
Carer of my wife and part owner of Antique shop
Beer technician for Molson Coors
Quality manager for Asahi
Antique dealer.

Antiques was interesting. While caring for my wife a friend bought an antique shop, I invested in it but knew f*** all. I met over time all the top "experts" you see on tv. Realised I knew as much as them, still f*** all.

See here I am, qualified aircraft engineer, liqueur licensee, brewer, beer sommelier and selling old stuff