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[Misc] Kemi Badenoch confirmed as new Tory leader
- Thread starter seagullwedgee
- Start date
Rdodge30
Well-known member
- Dec 30, 2022
- 589
I’m seriously considering a theory whereby, regardless of the political affiliations of the governments past, present and future - and almost entirely due to the nature of the political and social problems both worldwide and nationwide intensifying and worsening as time moves on, every UK government now and in the future will be worse than the last.Someone posted on NSC last week that the current Labour government are the worst government in UK history.
Some very rum coves about.
With the current incumbents, it is far, far too early to call it YET……. but I think I could be on to something.
Worrying.
- Jul 27, 2024
- 580
Too vague. 'Worse' governments, 'worsening' problems. Maybe it’s voters angrily hammering out messages on social media who are getting worse. We all want to stand on the sidelines shouting at each other through megaphones while keeping our earplugs in. Much easier than doing something useful; much easier than trying to understand other people.
Rdodge30
Well-known member
- Dec 30, 2022
- 589
It’s vague because it’s just thoughts - not a thesis
Do you think that after 14 years of this Government the country will be in a better place than it is now after 14 years of the last government?
I don’t.
and regardless of whether the next 14 years after that are conservative or Labour, I don’t see things improving noticeably.
Does anybody truly believe that this government is going to fix the NHS…. Or the trains…. Or the cost of living?
Would it have been easier to fix the NHS in the 80’s than it is to do it now. Will it be easier in the future? Are any of the problems facing this or any future government likely to be more manageable than the ones faced by previous governments?
Motogull
Todd Warrior
- Sep 16, 2005
- 10,446
Really interesting numbers. Thank you. Does that reveal reduced interest or membership level?
Fewer btw.
You have nicely illustrated the gap between perception and reality.
Millions imagine they are worse off after 14 years of Tory 'rule', but for a large number this will be quite nuanced. Stuff like not owning the latest iPhone or the most up to date flat screen TV. Shares not worth what they used to be. Even things like having to wait years for an autism referral. f*** me, 14 years ago there was no such thing as autism.
There have been millions who are genuinely worse off now than they were 14 years ago, but they are a minority. I am a public sector worker and although I am not as well off as I had hoped, I am still better off than I was 14 years ago.
Let's not lose sight of what is genuine bad governance (Johnson and Truss) in our rush to declare that every day in every way everything is getting shitter and shitter, cos it ain't. Perspective and all that.
Anyway Kemmy just said that 'now is the time to tell the truth' so even the Tories are on the road to a bright new tomorrow!
Oh dear, epic fail by the Tory members…..
Given the poor start by Labour, a credible opposition is essential, this won’t help at all.
Bring back…………. Actually, feck……no…….
Given the poor start by Labour, a credible opposition is essential, this won’t help at all.
Bring back…………. Actually, feck……no…….
Meanwhile Labour have quietly sidelined their hairy-arse trotskyite element.
Both Labour and Tory have a system that means it is the MPs that put the candidates on the final ballot, with the members getting the final vote. The problem, as others have noted, is that the tory MPs are now dominated by hard Brexit Daleks, with all the old patrician grandees forced into outer darkness.
With a 200 majority unfortunatly credible opposition is irrelevant. They can even have loads of own MPs voting against them in commons. It will be an interesting watch in next few years.
I dont think anything can be read into membership numbers. People just dont sign up now. Interesting Corbyne attracted the largest labour membership.
As somebody said Reform is the Tory problem not Labour. Intersting Farage not heard of since elected No surprise because he is an electioneer rather than a politican
- Jul 10, 2003
- 27,692
I'm confused. You announced you were voting Reform at the last election, then posted this
But you're still a voting member of the Conservative party ?
dsr-burnley
Well-known member
- Aug 15, 2014
- 2,615
I think perhaps it's not surprising that there are still people who view black people as one homogenous entity who are all expected to think the same . It is perhaps surprising that this particular person is black herself.
Apart from anything else, the political stupidity of making a racist tweet that will get more publicity than Starmer's, does not suggest good judgement.
happypig
Staring at the rude boys
Politics is, as ever, evolving.
In the 70s/80s (ignoring Northern Ireland) it was a two party race with a few fringe (mostly Liberal/LD) MPs.
The 90s saw the Lib Dems on the rise, mainly as a left of centre party but not averse to pitch themselves as anti-labour when it suited them.
The 2000s saw the rise of the SNP; initially "Tartan Tories" they rebranded under Alan Salmon as left-wing.
Throughout this there was a Tory party that hoovered up all right of centre votes.
Brexit drove a wedge through left and right wing voters, something that the hard right took advantage of, taking votes from both sides.
The Tories drove out the moderates and centerists and are now vying with Reform to be the home of right wing voters.
The "right" can go one of two ways; Conservatives and Reform unite to become a hard-right party of bastards, racists and racist bastards. Or the Tory party fracture with the centerists going one way and the hard-right joining reform.
Under Badenough it could go either way but they aren't going to be electable until they sort it out.
In the 70s/80s (ignoring Northern Ireland) it was a two party race with a few fringe (mostly Liberal/LD) MPs.
The 90s saw the Lib Dems on the rise, mainly as a left of centre party but not averse to pitch themselves as anti-labour when it suited them.
The 2000s saw the rise of the SNP; initially "Tartan Tories" they rebranded under Alan Salmon as left-wing.
Throughout this there was a Tory party that hoovered up all right of centre votes.
Brexit drove a wedge through left and right wing voters, something that the hard right took advantage of, taking votes from both sides.
The Tories drove out the moderates and centerists and are now vying with Reform to be the home of right wing voters.
The "right" can go one of two ways; Conservatives and Reform unite to become a hard-right party of bastards, racists and racist bastards. Or the Tory party fracture with the centerists going one way and the hard-right joining reform.
Under Badenough it could go either way but they aren't going to be electable until they sort it out.
- Jul 10, 2003
- 27,692
It's going to take a long long time to drag both Parliament and the Conservative Party back from the depths Johnson took them. It may be debatable whether Parliament has started changing at all, but the Conservative party are still heading down at full speed with no sign of any slow down
aolstudios
Well-known member
It's Butler, it's what she does.
Undermining Starmer is her thing
On the plus side, with dull Sir Steer Calmer in charge of labour, we may be spared daft gimmicky nonsense from HMG, Starmer cognizant that he can get on with doing the difficult unpopular things without fear of the Tories laying a glove on him and a need to spin a load of old bollocks.It's going to take a long long time to drag both Parliament and the Conservative Party back from the depths Johnson took them. It may be debatable whether Parliament has started changing at all, but the Conservative party are still heading down at full speed with no sign of any slow down
People often wish for PR so that there is no dominant party of government. However, in the UK, when everything is in 'balance' and up for grabs we get a parade of wannabees trying to out-promise one another, with a risk that the king grifter wins. MacMillan, Wilson, Thatcher, Blair..... good times, relatively speaking; well, free from the utter madness of Brexit and Johnson (and Corbyn) anyway. A relatively weak opposition helped the stability. Now, there's a thing.
Rdodge30
Well-known member
- Dec 30, 2022
- 589
Reform effectively are simply Liberal lite in the same way that UKIP were before them. not in policy but in their effect on the make up of parliament. Nobody who votes Liberal expect them to win a majority and form a Government, their number of seats in the house generally rise and fall based on how pissed off the electorate are with the Conservative Party. I accept that some Liberal MP’s get elected for local constituency reasons.
They have an indirect effect on who the Government of the day is, as did Reform in the last election. Reform or UKIP or the Green Party may get one, none or two seats … who knows they might get 5!! but like the Liberals they will play their part in whether Labour or Conservatives take power at the next election only by indirect effect
Wilson won a majority in double figures once. In 64 and the 2nd 74 election he had majorities of 4 and 3, and the 1st '74 election led to a hung parliament. He also had to hold a referendum on leaving Europe.
By contrast, Brexit was the result of the Conservatives winning a majority in parliament from a much smaller percentage of the vote. The same 2015 election that saw the SNP turn about 50% of the vote into 95% of the seats.
The greatest con trick ever played is people being convinced that FPTP leads to stability, and that all the "unusual" results are in any way unusual.
Compare and contrast
Vs
One’s a statesman, the other’s an obnoxious shit. He’s going to wipe the floor with her.
Vs
One’s a statesman, the other’s an obnoxious shit. He’s going to wipe the floor with her.